Oh, that makes sense, thanks.
Sexual assault of females taking part in anti-Mubarak rallies and female journalists covering anti-Mubarak protets has been a hallmark of the regime. This was likely not a case of someone taking advantage of the chaos, but secret police enforcing a policy that has been in place in Egypt for decades.
I’m willing to bet money that this is the reason why Logan allowed CBS to report what happened to her.
It’s possible to look it up and find that out. There might be people reading this who find that kind of probing tactless because they might share or just might sympathize with Logan for whatever reason.
Sad to hear. Especially since previously it had been reported that the mob was showing more than normal reverence to female participants in the first stages of the protests.
Hijack/nitpick/pet peeve: “brutal sexual assault”. OK, I get that the victim might not want all the salient details broadcasted to the world. But “sexual assault” is so vague as to be journalistically useless, like the term “sodomy”. “Sexual assault” has been used by the media for any act from touching a clothed boob, all the way up to beating the shit out of someone while naked and fondling them, just shy of regular intercourse.
I’m outraged, but I’d like to know what level of outrage to be…
I don’t blame you, WordMan - the original article is as much vague. But let’s face it, “sexual assault” in the media covers things that are routine for people entering a club or encountering the TSA at a minimum. Or is it the maximum? We need to know.
What was the affiliation of the crowd… Was the mob rape political?.. an autocratic arm or tool of the state? Sappers?
Obviously, the descriptor of “brutal sexual assault” is being used to get across the level of assault (brutal, sustained, violent, a mob, requiring hospitalization) while still leaving her with some level of dignity and privacy. It’s polite-speak for violent rape and battery. She’s not a case history for you to gawk at. You don’t “need” to know; it’s already been described. Why on earth do you “need” to know the details of which orifices were penetrated, by whom, by what, how many times, etc.? If she were your daughter or sister, do you think the details should be available to any schmuck who “needs” to know?
I also would feel sorely deprived of Egyptian news… totatlly uninformed as a consumer of American news (*Read Fox and CNN), entirely blindsided by the turn of events in Egypt. Kept in the dark for wartime political and propaganda reasons. And in general a pervading apathy and denial about our footprint as a nation, good and bad, in the world, non reported Always regardless, ever large the footprint.
Less surprising to those that follow the CBC and BBC.
This. Jesus Christ, we need to know the exact type of sexual assault in order to calibrate a level of outrage? This legalistic nitpicking of the definition of sexual assault is just not necessary.
Legally, assault is touching a person without their permission. Sexual assault is any contact with the breats or genitalia without the owner’s permission. Rape involves penetration, but sexual crimes are far more than that.
Now, to comment on the actual topic of this thread: If actual penetration were involved, I’m sure there are some “religious” folk who think she should be stoned to death for commiting adultry.
I have no idea what Egyptian law says.
At common law, rape was a very specific crime, requiring penetration of the vagina by the penis. Obviously there are a wide range of outrages that may be perpetrated upon a person that are sexually motivated or sexually related but do not include that specific event. For this reason, in the United States, most states have a number of statutes that define varying degrees of criminal sexual assault.
I suspect Ms. Logan does not relish explaining in detail what was done to her, and there’s no reason just yet for her to do so. Given the descriptions as “sustained” and “brutal” I think we can sketch out a sufficiently horrifying experience without needing those details, and not be terribly far from the truth.
“Sexual assault” often includes rape, and it’s a legal term, not a journalistic one. The law distinguishes between some of these acts but not all of them, and in covering things like this a lot of publications try to follow the legal standard so the privacy of the alleged victim is not violated.
“Alleged victim”? What a very peculiar phrase. Is there any doubt in this case she’s a victim of some form of assault? I’ve heard “alleged perpetrator” before but never “alleged victim”.
I don’t know - the cynic in me thinks that one of the sleazier new organizations was going to break the story (apparently Logan is in the tabloids occasionally), so CBS pre-empted them so it wouldn’t turn into a tabloid frenzy.
I was talking about sexual assault allegations in general, not Logan specifically. I have nothing but sympathy and the headlines alone are horrible. Right now I don’t have the stomach to read any further about what happened to her.
Well that’s just appalling. Best wishes for her recuperation.
Thing is, there are those in that society who precisely want it to be so outsiders, and women, and essentially anyone they don’t control, are afraid to show up and report. Because of course it’s all the fault of some meddler…
BTW on the hijack: What ** Ferret Herder** said. In many jurisdictions the word “rape” is no longer used to classify even what everyone knew as that offense, due in part to the traditional strictures of definition alluded to by ** Bricker**. Around here for instance most personal sexual attack crimes and their attempt have been subsumed into different degrees of “sexual battery”.
I’m really curious as to how this is being reported in the Egyptian press. Specifically, if it is, will that fact have any bearing on the treatment of anti-Mubarak female protesters and journalists in the future?
Will there be a public outrage there against this kind of systematic brutality that’ll improve the level of safety for those most vulnerable?
Hey, it’s not all bad news… turns out Debbie Schlussel feels “it kinda warms my heart” to see a left-wing female journalist experience what “real Islam” is like.
Classy stuff.
This is what I am concerned about. Twittish commentary.
Do we need to care about this twit? Is she a lone gunman or part of a bigger media machine?
No, but being beaten by a large crowd is. None of us has any idea how severe it was and nothing is “pretty clear” about it.
It has absolutely nothing to do with sympathy or lack of thereof, i greatly admire and respect Lara Logan and have been a fan of hers ever since her appearance on the Daily Show and maybe just maybe some of us are hoping that it was in fact a beating and a groping rather than a brutal gang rape.