Fantastic post, Cervaise.
Good post, Cervaise, and dear Lord, I hope you’re right!
Pence’s football carrying guy: I would have thought he would be in constant communication with somebody, and that endangerment to the football would be of some concern.
Apparently this is of no concern whatsoever to Republican Senators. Party before country for them.
You’re right- they don’t care. I was wondering about the safety of the football at the time of Pence’s removal to safety. Long time between then, and the troops showing up, as I understand it.
What exactly could be done if the insurrectionists had gotten ahold of the football?
My understanding is that it’s stuff that would help the President communicate his orders, but it’s not like it’s just a button that he pushes and missiles go flying.
Apparently not blown up the place physically, but blown it up metaphorically: https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/11/politics/military-officials-were-unaware-pence-nuclear-football-riot/index.html
“The risk associated with the insurrectionists getting their hands on Pence’s football wasn’t that they could have initiated an unauthorized launch. But had they stolen the football and acquired its contents, which include pre-planned nuclear strike options, they could have shared the contents with the world,” Kingston Reif, an expert on nuclear weapons policy at the nonpartisan Arms Control Association, told CNN.
“Such an outcome would have been a security breach of almost incomprehensible proportions,”
– whether it would have wound up in the hands of somebody who knew how to do that would be another question, I suppose.
Fair enough. Of course, if they had done that, there’d be no question as to whether they should be considered to be traitors and strung up.
At the same time, the guy carrying the football is not exactly just a ceremonial position. I assume that he is armed, well trained, and is willing to kill to keep it secure. Not sure how many insurrectionists would be willing to throw their lives away to sell info to Russia.
I’m 69, and I’ve been hearing it since I was in high school. And I haven’t gotten more conservative as I’ve aged. If anything I’ve consistently moved to the left.
Same here. I was pretty heartless 20 years ago. I’ve gotten better.
I definitely feel like the ground shifted under me. I used to be far left. My ideology did not change. Everyone else did. I agree with the foundational principles of progressive thought - I recognize systemic racism, patriarchy etc and I actively work to dismantle those things even in my professional life - but the tactics many on the left are using are just bonkers to me.
Not as bonkers as Republicans, but still.
I’m more liberal, too, than I used to be. Nonetheless, people seem to be conservative. Some get more conservative, some less. Some are conservative on some issues and liberal on others.
Are they really that much different than the ant-war protests of the 1960s?
You don’t have groups like the Weather Underground carrying out bombings today. Leftists today engage in protests that may become violent, but most terroristic acts and the advocation of terror come from the right.
Not sure. I was born in 1983. I think it was Gimlet media that hosted a debate on Free Speech with one leftist arguing to significantly curtail free speech, and the guy who argued to protect free speech was dismissed by his debate partner because he was white. This concerns me.
The difference, of course, is that leftist extremists have little power because liberals, by and large, do not vote for them. They are largely confined to the Twitterverse. In contrast, right - wing extremists are developing a stranglehold on the country.
I think it was More Perfect by NPR
The protesters were right, of course. The ants remain undefeated.
I for one…
I was in college as a freshman in 1993 when we were assigned to read the book 13th Gen by Strauss and Howe, sociologists who are noted for their generational theory model. Whether you believe in their ideas is neither here nor there, but I do remember them saying in their book that the 13th Gen, now what we call Generation X, would be a conservative generation, partly as a response to Boomers, partly out of the reality they grew up in. Whether that is demonstrably true, I don’t know but not everybody was saying that conservatism would die out or anything like that back in the 90s.
An interesting take by Ronan Farrow on who the people at the riot were. He said that there was a study that said that there was about 10% of the crowd who were part of an organized group. But the rest were just individuals there on their own.
As has been noted earlier in the thread, the rioters are not the downtrodden for the most part. Neither are they particularly young.
Of the 193 people who have been charged so far, average age is 40, 2/3 of them are 35 or older, and 40% of the people are business owners or have white collar jobs.
Farrow says that the commonality of the people is that the people largely got their theories from Facebook.
My question is that now that Trump is not feeding these people conspiracy theories from a place of power, what happens to these people who have these racist views fueled by a conspiracy theory? Do they increase in number, decrease in number, become an underground movement, fade away or something else?
I suspect that there will always be people who have racist views, but with the integration of culture, one would imagine that without added fuel, racism would decrease.
I personally don’t buy the idea that half the country voted for Trump based on racist ideals. Maybe it largely fueled the riots but there’s more going on with the people in the wider group of people who voted for Trump.
Ronan Farrow: Who Were the Rioters on Jan. 6th? | Amanpour and Company on Feb. 10, 2021
Farrow did a detailed piece on one person in the riot named Rachel Powell. She was seen as an unlikely candidate for storming the capitol. She didn’t vote for Trump in 2016 and only reluctantly in 2020. She said she was against the racist stuff, though said some racist slurs on tape. On the surface, she seemed like a typical yoga mom of eight children. But she got pulled into the conspiracy theories via Facebook. She was just one person in the riots who seemed an unlikely candidate.
Article posted in post #1005 by darren_garrison.