What happened when Babbitt got shot? Did that turn the crowd away from the doors? I think a lot of people are brave until the shooting starts. A lot would depend on just how riled up the crowd was before the SS took their first shots.
I will note that in movies, the crowd/rioters/lynch mob usually calm right down when our hero either racks his shotgun or fires once or twice into the air.
I’ll quote myself from that thread,
I’m curious if any of the folks that think this wasn’t a working gallows would be willing to put their head through that loop of rope and take a step off the platform . . . just for science of course.
Your fixation on whether it was functional or not is weird. It has nothing to do with the fact it was meant to threaten our government and the people who believe in the United States. Whether it was functional doesn’t enter into it.
I don’t see any point in engaging with you further on this specific issue. It has nothing to do with the horrific events of 1/6. Functional, schmunctional.
(dismissive hand wave) You can go away now.
Another consideration is how much pressure from behind the front lines of the crowd would be subject to, and thus whether they would have been able to break off any attack when the SS started shooting.
As I watched the mob on January 6th, I kept wondering why they weren’t being shot, at least with tear gas, beanbags, water hoses, those sorts of riot control weapons. Of course after the fact we’ve learned just how deliberately, criminally crippled the Capitol defense was. I suspect any future attempt at such a mob coup stands a better chance of meeting much stiffer resistance, up to and including lethal force.
Curious that you didn’t say that to the folks that are insisting it wasn’t functional . . . or did I miss you doing that?
FWIW: IMO the gallows was not meant to be functional. It was meant as a prop. I’m almost as Liberal as they come, and would love to see Conservatives have their deserved comeuppance. But I don’t believe the insurrectionists built the gallows to, or intended it to be used for, and actual lynching.
IMHO, they wouldn’t need to do an actual lynching. I don’t want to give these morons ideas though. They got pretty darn close to murdering a lot of people though.
If the mob had managed to breach the doors en masse where Babbitt was shot I suspect things would have escalated quickly. Would it have been enough to stop the mob and protect Pelosi, Pence and others? I honestly don’t know but I do recall when Reagan was shot, several SS agents appeared to have Uzis or some similar machine guns appear out of thin air. Given the numbers of the mob it is certainly possible they could have overwhelmed the SS but there would have been many dead people on both sides.
I think that did turn that group around when they realized that the those protecting congress meant business.
Let’s not forget the images of the House doors barricaded, and defenders at the barricades with guns drawn. If those doors had been breached I’m pretty sure there’d have been shooting then, but would it have been enough to stop the mob? Thank goodness we’ll never know.
I’m also surprised water cannons or other less than lethal weapons where not available to protect congress and the Capital of the United States of America from US CITIZENS.
I can’t believe I’m even discussing this.
Oh yes. Pistols pointed point blank at people trying to break in.
Sadly, there may be and episode II. But I sure hope not.
The gallows were performative to me. The real danger was the SS (some very chummy with Cheetolini) trying to bundle Pence away in a car (enroute to Minot AFB??) for “safe keeping”. I give credit to Pence for seeing the ruse (delay for fake electors…) and refusing the ride.
Performative is a great word for them. Functionality was less important than the effect.
And yeah, pretty sure Pence’s instinct was correct regarding that ride.
Side question: How many rounds do those guards have on them? If the Babbitt crowd had continued their assault, how many of them could the police officers have taken out? 1 magazine and a spare? Two?
I don’t doubt that if they had gotten hold of Pence, someone would have tried hanging him on that gallows. They may not have been successful but they could have really hurt him.
Or he could have died from a heart attack or some other shock brought upon by that mob manhandling him.
Had they mussed Pence’s hair there’d have been some iconic pictures.
This article says the Capitol Police use the Glock 22.
Standard is a 15 round magazine.