A question for women, how great an accomplishment is it to be thin

In My Humble Opinion
61

Then you buy a house you can’t afford, overextend yourself on the mortgage, Pottery Barn Motif and work 90 a week to get the Restoration Hardware dining room set and are too tired at the end of the day to go on the Treadmill of the Damned…for about the next 30 years. And you both get fat because who in the fook wants to prepare nutriotious meals that take twenty seven hours to make each dish with exotic ingredients when you can eat ramen noodles straight out of the pyrex in under 5 minutes. And that’s before the kids come along.
YMMV.
But at least you have nice furniture. (that will be out of style before it is officially paid off.) : And puked on by one child and have a major diaper blow out by another. Just sayin’…

Full Scale Brainfart Alert. Scramble the Fighter Jets. Turn on the Weather Channel!

Look, there is something I’ve noticed out there, gals. It is brutal, so pay attention:

There is a vast conspiracy to make women feel fat.

Yeah, I know. Yer shittin’ me, Shirley, really?

I, Shirley, will not shit you in this.
I am, according to the Clothing Sizing Industry Bizzaro Charts that exist out there, a 1x in shirts and a 14-16 in pants. ( Baby fat. No matter if I drop that pesky 20, that extra skin is still there. )

Let’s see if I can make this coherent:

The most fooked up thing that I’ve encountered since I’ve had kids is the fact that the shirts that I have bought myself pre-pregnancy ( size 10 for pants and an L for shirts) still fit me. Ok, the pants don’t, but the shirts do. My underpants that I’ve had since the mid 90’s (yeah, the 90’s.) still fit and they are a size 5 or 6. The newer stuff, post baby, are 7’s. Yes, I just put my undie size out there for all my 45k friends across the globe. I said it was brutal. And for guys who are sitting there scratching your asses over this one, the bigger the undie size on a chix is the equivalent to a smaller penis size on a you.

Now, the shirts that I have bought since having two kids are a 1x. I have always had big shoulders for a gal, but my boobage and fleshy parts have not grown THAT much since 1998. I still fit into the bra’s I bought pre-baby (even in cup, I just overfloweth and not in in a dithering Victoria Secret Model kinda way.) I am not that much in denial either. Stellar’s Sea Cow, I am not.
The industry out there is downsizing sizes for the teenage market because they have the disposable income for the trendy things and the staples of life wardrobe like LL Bean, which are made to fit women, are the standard soccer mom wardrobe as they know their market and do not maliciously downsize to cater to the emiciated teen crowd.

In Meijer ( a mega store in the mid west) they have a Junior’s section (3/4/5/7/9/11) the odd numbered ones.) and now a junior plus section. Above 13. I can actually wear, if I had dignity, which I still do, some junior pants, only I look like I am desperately trying to cling to my ute, which I am most assuredly am not. I have left my ute behind and happily so.

There are also the regular women’s ( plus) sizes and ladies sizes, but every woman I see in shopping for clothes is in the plus section. And they have regular female bodies that have gone too seed. It makes me wonder two things simutaneously: If women have the spending power that controls the industry how can this happen? and two, why hasn’t anyone done anything about it?
The reason this is happening learly for going after the teen driven blank-eyed rampant consumerism and the desperate desire to be a part of the herd and to fit in. If you are skinny, well dressed and whatever, you will a) be accepted b) find love c) have a happily ever after.

This will lead me into another tirade at a future date of why the Wedding Industry brainwashes the twenty something female crowd into getting married before 30 or you are a spinster/doomed/a horrible horrible unworthly person. Cause, like, you are not completely sure of yourself yet and well…everyone is doing it.

But I am putting the cart before the jackass.

Anyways, this leads me to my favorite subject: Me. …No, wait…that isn’t applicable in this paragraph. imagine that. **Conspiracy theories! ** the darker side of my brain senses that somehow the Diet Industry is in cahoots.

Look, you can’t fight genetics but you don’t have to give in and take what Mother Nature and eugenics shat upon you either. It’s a vicious world, try to find some peace and serenity and remember this:
Why do we worry about a fookin’ number so much? Whether it is a 2 or a 12; a 100 or a 122? Who determines that our underpants sizing is more critical to our self esteem than our IQ.? We do. That’s who.

Who we are; what we stand for; what we have been through and what we have have learned are what matters…blah blah blah…feel good…Oprah Kharma shit…Ommmmmm…You deserve the best…deep cleansing breaths…take care of you…yadda yadda yadda…

Comprende?

Today’s Mantra: There is no comfort like a donut.

:smiley:

62

A well placed comma could really disambiguate that one… :smiley:

63

(Al Bundy Voice). And do you know who says stuff like that? Fat girls

Please dont kill me

64

You know who quotes Al Bundy?
Virgins.
:stuck_out_tongue:

65

Sure i’ve only slept with 0 women, but over the next 10 years i’ll have slept with twice as many.

66

Shirley, you’re my hero.

67

I’ve been thinking a lot about this lately. I had gastric bypass surgery in November, 2004. Before that, I was a proportionate, but obviously large woman. I was always extremely well-dressed, always been well-thought of on my job, and didn’t lack for self esteem. I did, however, have some severe health issues which prompted me to have the surgery. For the record, I was 5’11" and 334.

I’m now 5’11" and 270. I am proud that this surgery has given me the control I desperately needed, as well as totally alleviated my health issues (the most frightening one was sleep apnea). I can now go to the gym and exercise without pain, and I feel amazing.

The one thing that causes me discomfort is the actual weight loss itself. The perceived “sins” of fat people are immediately evident, as is the weight loss. Instead of asking me how I feel now, people invariably tell me how great I look, or that they can’t get over the physical change. I understand that the physical change is the most apparent end result of the surgery (and my working it like a bastard for all it’s worth, too), but it still makes me feel squonky when people mention it. There was nothing wrong with my appearance before hand. My surgeon estimates I’ll lose another approximate 80 pounds - I don’t know if I can continue to accept the comments with a sincere, yet strained “Thank you. I feel wonderful”. I know people don’t mean any harm by it, and I guess it proves the supposition of the OP in that a woman losing weight is something akin to the Red Sox winning the World Series.

I’m sorry if this is rambling and not coming to any particular point, but it’s something that’s been on my mind lately. Thanks for bearing with me.

VCNJ~

68

YAY Veuve!

What you realized is that your weight and situation were not healthy for now or long term and * you did something about it*.
Tower of Babble

I am not starting some kind of revolution for women to toss their sports bra’s into the fire and sit on the couch eating doritos and ice cream while living vicariously through Reality TV, and I hope that isn’t what my ramblings have been getting across. Dear Og, ladies, please keep your boobies contained and turn off the fookin’ TV and all its 'Your House is a disaster. Your body is a disaster. Your relationship is for shite and we won’t even talk about your kids.’ shows. That stuff is a subconscious trainwreck for everyone.

It’s about taking care of yourself without obsessing over a number. It is about taking care of yourself, being in control of your density (and destiny, too) and making smart choices not just for long term stuff ( college, marriage,investments) but short term stuff ( If I eat this entire bag of chocolate chips … I could eat something healthy…but ooooooh, Ben and Jerry’s!) Y’folla?

The people who state that they have acheived a PhD but their proudest accomplishment to date is dropping 50 pounds tells me that the relationship this person has with food is harder for her to deal with than the tough courses involved. If you are not frightened for this woman and for the future of all younger girls, then I will be.
We all need our comfort food and we all have Really Bad Moments. The fact that more of us are not free-basing drug users is a testament of our own strength and the inner fear of Mom Finding Out.

Your bad moments and stresses I could probably waltz through in a ballgown.

My bad moments, you could probably stand back and go…What in the hell is she talking about?..This is not that hard at all…why does she need to do her default of chocolate over something like this? though , I seriously doubt it. Not patting myself on my back, you are a pussy. yes, you. Actually, we all are. About something. And that is ok. We cannot be like Wonder Woman all the time.

Most of our problems PAY ATTENTION PEOPLES are from the neck up and self induced.

Yeah, I said it.

Your problems ( and mine) are mostly self induced and we (me, you/all of us we are all fooked in the head.) have been conditioned by the Law Offices of Sue Everyone, to blame someone/something else for our own lack of control. We want to blame someone and make them pay for our own fook ups.

In the end. We pay. For not owning up to our weaknesses and trying to work through them and by continously burying our heads in the sands and up our collective asses, time and time again. There is a difference between Picking Your Battles and Not Actually Engaging Battle. But, you are a pussy, so you know this already.
If you think about it long enough, from the start, women have been subconsciously trained to be submissive, pretty, thin and a helpmate to Big Strong Manly Man. And, in a time when women had no legal rights; could not pick whom they could marry, they were not educated and had no say in anything, do you think our foremothers we bitching about the last twenty pounds they wanted to drop after birthin’ their 12th child? No. they were trying to survive war, disease, crop failure, bad dental, no education and no birth control. Men saved them from Bad Things and Told them What To Do. I’m not dissin’ men here. Just stating the facts.

We have the highest form of freedoms known to woman-kind on our planet. We have legal rights. We have religious rights. We can go to school and get edumakated. We can own our own property and mow the freakin’ lawn. We.have.birth.control. We have access to dental and health care. We have washing machines and dryers,refrigerators, ovens and microwaves to make homecare so much easier. We can eat out alone in a restaurant without fear of whispers, innuendos and our reputations being sullied. We can decide if we want to marry or, if it is a Bad Situation, leave the marriage.

And yet we cannot get over how FAT we perceive ourselves too be.
The sound you hear is me banging my head against a sharp rusty nail on the wall.

69

I get what you mean here and can empathize with your feelings. A couple of years ago in the spring time I became quite ill and had to have some surgery. I lost about 60 lbs fast. I was so ill and out of circulation for about a month and yet all people could say as I returning slowly to the world of the living was, “Wow, you look great. What are you doing?” My reply that I had been quite ill did not slow them down. “We’ll great good for you. Keep it up, because you look marvelous.” All people could see and talk about was the weight loss. Not that I wanted to discuss the illness, I didn’t, in fact I felt quite private about it. But I could have done without every single damn one of the people who commented on the weight loss during that time and that is just about everyone in my life.

I could lose a good deal more weight before anyone would consider me thin, and yet when I do lose a few pounds, I start to obsess and worry about what people will say to me. I become speechless with embarrassment, hurt, and fury. I just want to disappear. or vomit. or hit. or wish oozing zits all over their bodies when anyone comments on my gain or loss of weight. I am totally in the, commenting on weight loss is NOT being supportive camp.

70

I thought I’d chime in here briefly, too. I could stand to lose about 15-20 pounds. I fit into about a size 12, but I would love to fit into something smaller. And yes, weight loss is important to me. Like many have mentioned, it’s a big accomplishment, and you can see it, too!

I’d like to consider myself smart. I’ve got a masters degree and linguistics and can speak and read in six languages. But I would kill to lose those fucking 20 pounds. I rarely think about my graduate degree with pride, mostly it’s the weight that occupies my thoughts.

And you know what’s really sick? A few years ago, I weighed a lot less than I do now (about 40 pounds - I was pretty underweight). I went to a Houlihans and got terrible food poisoning. Not just the shits, the kind of food poisoning that had me vomiting for four days - I couldn’t even drink water without it coming up again - and having seizures from the fever. I didn’t have insurance, so my friends decided to see if it would just run its course (I now think they were idiots for doing this - I could have died, but they thought they were doing me a favor). I was unconscious or having seizures during the entire time, so I was almost completely insensible those four days and don’t remember most of it. What I do remember is that I lost 20 pounds during those four days and, looking back, probably appeared absolutely emaciated. I’m 5’9, and had to go out and get pants that were a size 4 because the ones I owned were simply too large and kept falling off my bony, jutting out hips. Do you know what? I was so proud. I can’t even describe how proud I was to have lost all that weight, even though I had gone through hell for four days and was still out of it for the rest of the week. I’d lay there at night and cup my hands over my hip bones that poked against my skin and run my fingers over prominent ribs and feel like I had finally gotten somewhere. And that feeling of pride was completely reinforced by everyone I met. “Overly, have you lost weight???” “Why yes, I have. Unfortunately I had food poisoning.” “Well that’s one way to do it, but you look great.” I had already been underweight to start with, then lost 20 pounds and got complimented for it. Of course I want to be that thin again. But it’s not gonna happen unless I starve myself. And I’m trying to avoid that mentality.

My husband certainly helps. Even with the extra weight he tells me that I’m the most beautiful woman in the world. Then again, my mom tells me I’m fat. I try to listen to my husband more than my mom, but it’s hard when my mom is repeating something she’s told me even when I had an eating disorder in high school, especially since everything I see and every woman I talk to wants to lose weight no matter how thin she is.

71

Probably. But what men think is different from their behavior. Being fat is like having a public cloak of invisibility. I only have my own anecdotes on this, but in my experience if there’ s a fat girl and a thin girl at a party; the thin girl will get asked to dance and the fat girl will be leaning against the wall.

72

You know what makes me feel like crap? When my parents tell me how beautiful I am NOW…the dividing line between a 4 and a 6 seems pretty small to me but I have lost about 80% of my belly pudge and my boobs are now smaller too and I just look more “petite” as opposed to voluptuous but every single time my father sees me it’s “you look beautiful NOW” or “you look perfect NOW” and I know he’s just saying it to keep on encouraging me to me it just says “You looked fucking hideous before,” and that just makes me want to cry because I just get more and more obsessed with it and the old self that looked kind of pretty and never had trouble getting guys (well, at least white guys) seems like a big, fat obese shithead who must never reappear again.

73

That is true if we are talking 100+ lbs-overweight-fat. However, in my experience (BMI 17, pretty face but no boobs) the thin girl will get passed over in favor of the curvy girl with the 20-22 BMI and a nice rack who thinks that she is 20-40lbs overweight. And when she gets back from dancing (with the guy I wanted), she’ll tell me how jealous she is of my body :rolleyes: .

I actually put on about 13 lbs one summer when I worked at a coffee shop (free milkshakes- mmmm!). I got less female attention (oh you’re so skinny! I hate you!) but waaay more male attention. My bf at the time loved the change, and was sorry when I lost the weight again.

74

When I was dating from the phone personals, I met this one guy; he seemed okay, seemed to like me okay, but the next day, while I was listening to profiles again, I noticed that he had changed his to specify (basically) NO FAT CHICKS. That stung a little, let me tell you. Fortunately, I decided that he was an asshole, and it was his problem, not mine.

Then I met my husband, and he loves me exactly the way I am. He thinks he’s lucky to have me, and couldn’t care less about 40 extra pounds.

Bottom line - there will always be assholes trying to tear you down, no matter what you weigh or what you look like. Ignore them. Listen to the voice in your head that says that you look good, that you’re a good, decent person, and you deserve to be happy and comfortable in your own skin.

75

I’m about 60-70 pounds overweight. I’ve never thought much of it - I’m 18 and haven’t really gotten the ‘must have boyfriend’ thing going yet. However, when I ordered my grad dress, it came back far too small. I basically had to lose 15 pounds in 3-4 months. I did it just from changing my eating habits. But after grad I went on two new drugs to help my anxiety and depression, and my weight skyrocketed by 30 pounds. I’m still on them, but my parents continued bitching about my weight means I might stop them soon. I’ve gotten back into the groove of bad eating habits, but not to the degree to gain 30 pounds.

Seriously, if I could, I’d go get my stomach stapled or some other sort of surgery. But I don’t think I’m overweight enough to warrant it. But I just can’t see losing 60 pounds.

But I would find getting a degree much more of an accomplishment. But judging from most people’s responses, I may not think this way in a few years.

I think it is sad that we focus so much on weight though.

76

This is something I think about all the time. I know in my head that my weight is not that important, but logic does not overcome my desire to be thin. It is an issue of control for me, when I feel out of control, I eat. I will eat past the point of fullness, and I know it is only the grace of a decent metabolism and being moderately active that I am not obese. As it is now I am on the cusp of crossing that line into a BMI that is ‘overweight.’ I spend most of my life now teetering on that line. I make little boundaries that I am not allowed to cross, and that is one of them. Another is being able to shop in ‘regular’ stores, and staying out of plus sizes. It is a mental game for me, all about the number.

There was a time in college that I look back on now, and I thing about how proud I was of my body then, and how I could wear anything I wanted and not obsess over how I looked in it because I knew I looked good. When I really start to consider that time, I realize that I ate sporadically because I was broke, I ate junk, I smoked a pack a day. I was so unhealthy then. But I was thin, but even then I would have said I wanted to lose 10 pounds.

I quit smoking and I am very proud of that accomplishment. I sometimes think to myself that if I could do that, I should be able to control my weight no problem. I did gain about 10 pound after I quit, I know that to reach that weight again would take daily hard exercise, and careful eating. Right now I am at that weight that my body ‘settles’ in, you know the one where you can eat pretty much what you want but not too out of control. I eat vegetables, I get the whole grain bread, I don’t keep chips in the house. But I don’t count calories. And I get dessert when we go out.

My family has high cholesterol and I worry about that. I worry about the example I will set for my baby boy, and for the responsibility of buying and preparing food for him and my husband.

Last year when I was pregnant I felt a suprising relief at being ‘allowed’ to eat what I wanted and watch myself get fat. I was supposed to get bigger! And boy did I. I gained almost 50 pounds but really I didn’t care, I loved my huge belly. I read all those books and articles about how women hated their pregnant bodies and watched every pound on the scale with dread but I liked my body honestly and purely for what I think was the first time since I was a very very little girl. And after I had the baby the weight came back off and I fell into my settled weight again, where I am now. And now I see the stretch marks and how the pregnancy has changed my body shape and I know I will never have my ideal body back, ever. Sometimes I am ok with that.

If anyone is still reading this I have one little tidbit to share that just happened this morning that is typical of my thinking. I work in a male-dominated office and someone came in with donuts for everyone. When I heard they were there, I waited until most of the men have had thier pick and left before I will go in there to get mine. I still feel like it is fine for them to eat a donut or even 2 or 3 but I feel a little shame when I get one, and I feel like people are judging me if I take one, like ‘she doesn’t need that.’ Sometimes I find myself hiding when I eat something ‘bad’ like that, even though I know it’s ok to have one once in a while. I still feel a little ashamed for eating it.

I will sometimes chastize my husband for eating junk when I am really chastizing myself. If I was happy with my own eating habits I don’t think I would criticize his.

77

In terms of the ‘because that’s what we’re judged by’ stance, as well as the ‘what kind of female body men want’ thing: I always had the impression that women, to paraphrase Van Morrison, often “dress up for each other.”
But maybe that’s a sort of sideline and it really is all about attracting the opposite sex in particular, and looking good for society in general.

What’s really sad to me is that it is seemingly not so much about being thin as it is being skeletal.

78

Wow. I felt alot beter about myself before I found this thread. :confused:

I’ve always been at least marginally overweight… and since the birth of my son 10 yrs ago, I’ve been anywhere from downright fat to HOLY MANATEE, BATMAN!

I’m now on the upper end of downright fat, but a good 30 lbs away from my beached whale phase. I would love to tell you that I really don’t obsess about what I eat and am generally happy with myself, but we both know that’s bullshit.

I would estimate that on any given day, I’m spending at least 2-3 hours total feeling fat, pulling at my shirt, lamenting the bagel that I ate with my cereal, waiting for lunch, wondering why I’m hungry, analyzing whether or not I’m actually hungry, etc.

That said, I seem to have a completely different response to external pressures than I’ve read in this thread. If my parents called me fat (which they dont, since they both struggle with their weight), I would probably binge on everything in sight for the next few days.

If a guy stopped talking to me because I’m fat, I would say “Eff him, pass the cookie dough.”

Of course, I’m also one of those people who insists on having a cigarette everytime I’m bombarded with a sanctimonious Truth ad, so maybe this is purely a “me” problem.

I just can’t imagine trying to change because someone else doesn’t like me the way I happen to be.

Granted, I obsess over my weight because I never feel comfortable, I always wonder if my dear SO (who has always maintained that I am beautiful) sometimes inwardly cringes when I disrobe to reveal my fat belly and flabby arms. I also feel ridiculous for worrying about something like this. Why the hell would he be with me if he didn’t dig me? I’m not rich, I’m not exceptionally brilliant, I sure as hell don’t have a trust fund or any idea how I’d make my next car payment if I lost my job tomorrow.

Part of me wants to drop every single pound and strut before anyone who felt I wasn’t appropriately attractive as a fat chick.

Part of me wants to eat everything and flip the finger to anyone who doesn’t like it.

Part of me wonders why my weight only brings up vanity and self-esteem issues as opposed to worrying about my health and when/if my knees are going to be replaced in 20 years and whether or not the smoking/eating will kill me long before that.

I do know for a fact that I would like to kick everyone who says, “God, I’d never be fat. I don’t understand why people don’t just eat less and exercise more” square in the babymaker.

So how great of an accomplishment would losing weight be? Somewhere between a magnificent accomplishment that I’ve been fighting for since I was knee-high to a duck and a horrible failure because all of the people who judged me for being overweight have somehow “won”.

Damned if you do and all that. Bleeh.

I’m gonna go have an orange or something. THANKS GUYS!

79

Okay, I guess this is sort of what I wanted to get at but didn’t want to come out and say without asking a few questions first.

Frankly, as long as women aren’t obese, men just don’t care about how much women weigh. In fact, we seem to prefer larger than most women realize. The Trilateral Council isn’t meeting to figure out how to engineer society so that fat-women feel ashamed, frankly it really seems to me to be mainly the work of women themselves.

It’s been really refreshing to hear from some women that came from all parts of the weight-spectrum that basically said, “I don’t care WTF people think of my body. It’s mine and I’ll change it if I want to for me.”

80

Y’know, this is so fooking true. I beleive I’ve had an epiphany. w00t