I think the distinction is that there are no remnants left of the institutions that engaged in the slave trade within the African continent. The US government of today, however, is the direct desendant of a government that tolerated and oft times encouraged slavery and segregation.
That said, I think it is too late for reparations. I think those that are demanding them are doing so to bring some awareness to the American people of their country’s brutal pass. Reparations is simply an opening bid in a dialog and negotiation that they hope will eventually reach a settlement that results in acknowledgement.
Elmer J. Fudd,
Millionaire.
I own a mansion and a yacht.
I am for reparations for one simple reason: My anscestors were forced to the United states and placed in endentured servitude, had their land taken or were conscripted in the military. I have good claims against Germany, Russia, Lithuania, The state of Pennsylvania and the US Government. WIth a little research, I could probably make a case against England as well.
I want my share of the swag, DAMMIT! If the blacks get something, I get something too!
“The robbed that smile,
Steal something from the thief.” —WS, Othello I.III.204
Just an afterthought, don’t African Americans have a form of reparations in EEOC and anti-discrimination laws?
What I mean is that a current descendant of slaves, when encountering some vestige of racism (assumedly left over from our slave owning past) can file suit and be compensated. THe current system, in my mind, allows current slave descendants the ability to be compensated when they suffer from their legacy.
After all, the arguments for affirmitave action and the EEOC are that the damage caused by slavery nesecitate such “repairs” to the system.
Perhaps, but it has changed greatly. There are many new laws, many new members of government and so on. Whether it is a descendant of the government of slavery days, it is not a “vestige” of slavery. If my anscestors had had slaves, I am a descendant of slave owners, but not a vestige of slavery.
Even if the current government is somehow a piece of the slavery machinery of yore, the statement that no similar remnant exists in Africa is false. The tribes that imprisoned fellow blacks are still alive and well in Africa. THese tribes must also then be a vestige of slavery. In fact, many of them perpetrate acts of outright genocide on each other today. I would think that they are more than a vestige, but a full blown racist machine.
THe only distinction here is who enslaved whom first and upon whom falls the greatest blame. Whatever the proportions, you can’t eliminate Africans.
A “tribe” is hardly an institution. It’s also silly for anybody to suggest that African-Americans should first go to Africa to find redress for past ills before going to their own government. As I said before, it is too late for reparations, but it is not too late to acknowledge the injustices perpetrated by our country’s government in years gone by. That doesn’t mean we have to wallow in self-guilt. Most Americans alive today are guiltless in the matter. However, if we are going to take any pride in our nation’s history, we must also bear some of it’s shame.
Elmer J. Fudd,
Millionaire.
I own a mansion and a yacht.
What this discussion seems to be leading to is the need to establish a statute of limitations on historical grievances. We need to recognize that there are practical limits to the principle of inheritance–of rights, claims, guilt, liability. Otherwise we’d be trying to redress events going back thousands of years. Furthermore, we must resist the tendancy to personify large timeless groups like nations or races.
Well, yeah, that’s my point. I think the argument has merit.
Damn great movie. At least you got that right
Following that silly thought,tom, one could say that WE Americans suffered OUR bad karma, and thus paid the bill, by our Civil War. Hello?
That doesn’t work.
.
tom, shame on you, Jews never delivered other Jews to the Death Camps, or in ANY WAY participated in the Holocaust. Blacks HELPED subjugate other blacks and PARTICIPATED in the slave trade. JEWS DID NOT PARTICIPATE.
You can destroy your now by worrying about tomorrow. Janis Joplin
John John, the point is that it may be arguable, but it is pointless. Since no one is on the other side would you care to provide us with a pro-reparation thesis in order to provide some counterpoint?.
Your “shame on you” quote is excessively stupid. I mentioned that obviously incorrect contention for the very fact that there are idiots who have expressed those sentiments. Should we now go into your rants against Hillary and cry “shame on you” when you quote her to make a point?
Can anyone give me some specific information on the U.S. Federal government’s culpability in slavery? It isn’t enough to say that the Feds “condoned” it. The U.S. government was designed to minimize its control over private citizens and state governments. So a real “smoking gun” is needed to counter the following:
In 1807 the Federal government banned further importation of slaves.
The Southern states seceded in 1861 because it appeared that the balance of power in the Federal government had permanantly shifted away from the slave states.
The Federal government, of course, prosecuted the Civil War which, although it wasn’t immediately about slavery, became so after the Emancipation Proclamation issued by the Persident of the United States.
The Federal government attempted to secure political power for blacks in the South by imposing the Reconstruction governments.
During the Civil Rights Movement, Federal court rulings, presidential orders, the use of U.S. army troops, and the Federal Civil right act of 1964 clearly spelled out which side the U.S. has been on.
So unless I’m missing something, how can the U.S., as opposed to various states or individual families, be subject to demands for reparations?
Yes, I have. If I’m not mistaken they are Jews that ONCE THEY WERE IN THE CAMPS collaberated to stay alive. I’m talking about before the act, pre holocaust,which they did not, as in the blacks particiaption in the round up of other blacks for sale INTO slavery.
You can destroy your now by worrying about tomorrow. Janis Joplin
Here is the story of yet another white-on-black riot that destroyed virtually the entire black population of the small town of Ocoee, Florida in 1920. Predictably, the white folks of Ocoee would rather not talk about it. The great writer Zora Neale Hurston wrote about it in 1939 for the WPA. There is dispute about the number of people killed (8 to 60), but what is not disputed is that 26 black residences were burned to the ground and nearly 500 blacks were literally chased out of Ocoee. And it was in 1920, three years before Rosewood.
If that doesn’t work, I give up. If it fails, go to www.orlandoweekly.com/news/index.asp and have it search for Ocoee. Click on the link “Dead wrong” and you’ll see it.
They shouldn’t, but if the issue comes up, it should be included as comparative negligence would be in a trial. Contribbuting factors are assigned a percentage based on their contribution to the damages.
When proving damages, you have to show that you are worse off now than when the act occurred. It seems to me that the slaves were no worse off (accept for the boat ride over.) And I am not sure that their descendants would have been better off staying in Africa. I don’t see any damages, nor do I see a reason to appologize. The whole issue is used to induce guilt and grab a bigger share of the pie. Let it go already.
I still wish I could get back some dough from Germany and Lithuania though
