What’s that breeze? Why it’s getting stronger! It’s all that handwaving going on!
So a successful citizen initiative to have a referendum to stay in Canada is meaningless. Because it asserts a positive notion that the country stay intact. Well, that’s certainly… an opinion anyway. I’m unaware of any legislation that states that only referenda with negative outcomes are allowed.
The Forever Canada petition was first. It was successful, even with a higher bar of acceptance. Hand wave away, but this is factually accurate.
Alberta stays in Canada, and the tiny separatist movement can now shut up. At least for a while. Because the people will have spoken and made their will known.
And if instead they hold a non-binding referendum on leaving what happens in each possible outcome?
Answer: the exact same nothing whether Yes or No win.
Bingo. The majority of us in Alberta, as evidenced by how many signatures are on the “stay in Canada” petition, are sick of hearing separatist crap. It’s a small number of Albertans, who live in a bubble, hearing nothing from sources that don’t support their view, and who believe they’re the majority, that are spearheading this. It doesn’t help that Danielle Smith has basically abandoned the Rule of Law, which states that you don’t get to make shit up in order to justify your governance. Which she has done, with her “Oh, you got this many signatures to stay in Canada before my petition to leave got any? That’s invalid, because something-something-something.” Smith makes shit up.
Regardless of the question, I believe that the majority of Albertans will vote to stay in Canada, no matter what referendum is presented. We’ve got a good thing going: a seat at the UN, respect around the world as a place of freedom and tolerance, and a passport that doesn’t need a visa in many countries.
I for one, would not want to leave Alberta because it wants to strip my Canadian citizenship in favour of a citizenship that is not recognized by any world country, that is a state that is not (and will not necessarily be) recognized by countries of the world, the UN and other bodies (e.g. the WTO, NATO, NORAD, etc.), and who will promise riches while being stymied by Canada and the United States every time it tries to send its oil somewhere. Alberta would become Bolivia: just as landlocked, and dependent on the kindness of neighbours to get its goods to market.
I’ll take my internationally-respected Canadian passport, my Canadian citizenship, my Canadian identity, over anything an independent Alberta has to offer. Bring on a referendum of any sort; I welcome the chance to tell the small minority of Alberta separatists to sit down and shut up.
And if the APP manage to get 500,000 signatures for an independence referendum (they are hoping for 1M, btw), will the pro-canadian types shut up? Will you?
How would Alberta strip you of any citizenship? Why would you need to give up your Canadian passport? Carney has 3. You won’t need to UNLESS your fellow Canadians (not Albertans) are so butthurt about losing Alberta’s money that they take it away from you. It is impossible for this to happen by any action of Alberta.
Alberta would immediately become one of the richest countries in the world. It would be more Switzerland than Bolivia. Honestly, what are you basing this on? You live in Alberta you should know how much we send to Ottawa that we don’t get back and what we could do if we weren’t hamstrung by Ottawa and taxed to death.
No court should be saying that a government can’t allow a citizen led initiative to ask questions related to the constitution because it violates the constitution. How would anything be able to be changed? That’s what she fixed.
These the arguments you going to use and expect to hold water when Quebec holds its next referendum as promised by Paul St-Pierre Plamondon of the PQ? I’m pretty sure if Quebec separates that France will welcome them with open arms to the UN the next day. Alberta will have no issues, either. Certainly not with the US. If Trump is still alive, he’ll support us just to spite Carney.
The only entity that will be upset will be BC when we shutdown access to the ROC if they don’t comply with UNCLOS, for which Canada is a signatory, if they don’t allow us access to the coast. Which we can’t do now.
I will not shut up. Because you and I both know that your cause is hopeless. You will not get 500,000 signatures (out of a population of 4.5 Million), because very few Albertans feel as you do. If they are hoping for 1 Million signatures, then the loud laughter you hear from southern Alberta is coming from me.
Alberta’s best course is with Canada. It’s time to tell to the Alberta separatists to sit down and shut up, and if a referendum favoring either side allows us to do so, then bring it on.
I’m not going to get involved in this silliness, but this tempts me to ask one question. You and I both know that the idea of Alberta seceding from Canada is nonsense. But just for the sake of argument, let’s suppose that it does become the glorious independent nation of Albertastan.
What are your plans for when the global oil market inevitably and permanently collapses?
Even Saudi Arabia is making contingency plans for the inevitable, diversifying its industries and establishing major domestic renewable energy projects. Climate change is not going away and fossil fuel production – particularly oil and coal – is a dying industry whose days are numbered. The fact that the political right refuses to acknowldge this doesn’t change the reality.
Quebec separatism is different. They’re willing to live in squalor and poverty for the sake of cultural purity, and expect to get support from France. It’s irrational, but it’s a choice a radical minority of them are willing to make. At least they wouldn’t be staking their future on a dead-end resource industry.
You mean like datacenters near Grand Prairie? You know what you can do with lots of money? Diversify. Like Saudi Arabia.
Having rational regulations and a low tax regime creates opportunities that don’t rely on some autocrat, and his nonsensical projects office, to choose winners.
No, he chose to renounce due to people such as yourself saying he had divided loyalties. He had no legal requirement to do so.
If the Albertan separatists win, which I think is highly unlikely, I expect them to require Albertans to choose only one of Canadian or Albertan citizenship. Canada will not strip them of their citizenship.
And neither will Canadians. It is a requirement in the US that people give up their other citizenships. How many Canadians have dual citizenship in the US and don’t give up theirs in Canada? It’s nonsense to suggest otherwise.
Why? Not one person has said this or even suggested it. It seems that the only people saying it are the ones against independence. But it is expected. I expect fear tactics rather than rational discourse.
This is also incorrect. The US has no legal opinion on dual citizenship, although a Republican Rep has proposed a constitutional amendment to disallow it.
Because I think the people hoping for separation will be petty if it comes to be and demand absolute loyalty to the new country.
If you want the Clarity Act to fully apply, this assumption should be included in any referendum. Let’s see how many vote yes.
Because I think the people against independence will be petty if it comes to be and demand absolute loyalty to the old country.
I should add that you are the only one suggesting it, so if you’re thinking it it is likely that your side will be the ones to implement it if anyone does.