Bah, fearmongers said the UK economy would take a hit from Brexit too, and look how well that’s turned out!
Addressed by Keith Wilson here.
Net immigration to Alberta is positive continually from the rest of Canada. Business will not leave if we achieve independence because the industries are tied to the resources. 3rd largest oil and gas reserves on the planet no longer hampered by Ottawa. Trade no longer hampered by the elbows up crowd.
Frankly, Alberta continues to grow in spite of Ottawa. We imagine what it can do without Ottawa in the way.
And when people hear the threats, ‘we’ll take your passports’, ‘you won’t have access to the sea’, ‘we won’t trade with you like we supposedly do now’, we hear why you can’t make a deal with Trump. You’re a bunch of children acting like bullies on a school yard. Probably why you don’t like Trump as you recognize yourselves in him! Maybe act like adults and recognize why Albertans are upset and fix it. But self reflection isn’t the left’s string suit.
Same thing happened in Quebec – a vast business exodus over the mere threat of separation, and a flailing economy that is constantly being propped up by Ottawa.
Great! The world’s third largest reserves of an environmentally damaging and increasingly disfavoured resource that is in rapid decline in an enlightened world trying to avoid environmental catastrophe.
In a Trumpian world, Alberta would just be taken over by the US. In a more rational world, it would just be ignored and left to fester. Even Jason Kenney predicted that separatism would turn Alberta into a third-world shithole (I believe “banana republic” was the term). It’s astounding to me how naive and myopic the separatism supporters are. The political and economic realities in the real world just don’t work the way they somehow manage to hallucinate it in their heads.
Yes. The real world economic realities by people who claim there is no business case for sending LNG to Europe when they were begging us for it. The same reality the has driven a trillion dollars from Canada, the majority of which would have been invested in Alberta.
The same lack of understanding that if we don’t produce and benefit from our oil production then someone else will. Us not producing will not decrease world oil productiin by one barrel or save one pound of carbon, but will, with certainty, not benefit is by one dollar.
Thank you, we can do without your claimed knowledge of economic reality.
The rest is just typical fear mongering. No rational argument on the benefit of staying.
I am going to listen to the businesses in the Calgary Chamber of Commerce, rather than the opinion of a guy. I’m going to listen to Ph.D. economist Trevor Tombe, rather than Mitch Sylvestre, who thinks King Charles is out to get him. Or paid content providers from various lands. Or dual citizen David Parker, who owes hundreds of thousands in fines for breaches of the Elections act, and has run away to the USA to avoid questions about his criminal stealing of voter data.
I’ll listen to people who know what they’re talking about, rather than folks who peddle magical thinking.
You listened to Carney and Black Peter before him. You’ve already proven you’re listening to people peddling magical thinking.
“Your boos mean nothing, I’ve seen what makes you cheer”
“No U”
Good luck with your fantasies.
Let’s take a closer look at the Calgary Chamber of Commerce survey, and more importantly, how it has been presented.
Global News: Half of Calgary Chamber members would consider leaving if Alberta separates: poll
CBC Radio: New survey data suggests half of Calgary businesses think separation discourse is impacting the economy
That sounds dramatic. Half of Calgary businesses might leave Alberta?
But look at the actual numbers.
The survey had 137 respondents out of a Chamber membership of roughly 1,700. Of those 137 respondents, 48% said they would consider relocating if Alberta entered a formal separation process.
That means about 66 respondents said they would consider leaving.
Not leave. Consider leaving.
And those 66 respondents represent less than 4% of the Chamber’s total membership, never mind Alberta businesses as a whole.
There is also the problem of voluntary survey bias. The people most likely to respond to this kind of survey are usually those with strong feelings about the issue, whether strongly concerned or strongly supportive. The indifferent majority often does not respond at all.
So the responsible way to describe the survey would be:
“Among the 137 Calgary Chamber members who chose to respond to a voluntary survey, nearly half said they would consider relocating if Alberta entered a formal separation process.”
That is very different from implying that half of Calgary businesses, or even half of Chamber members, are preparing to leave Alberta.
The CBC Radio interview adds another concern. Around the 3:40 mark, the Chamber CEO appears to say that 74% of businesses are thinking of leaving if separation occurs. But the Chamber’s own release says 48% were likely to relocate, while 74% saw no tangible benefit to separation.
That distinction matters.
So, we have a poll that is used to shape a narrative that it doesn’t actually support. Take a small voluntary sample, headline the most alarming interpretation, and let the public assume it represents something it doesn’t. Fearmongering 101.
The actual survey may show that some Chamber respondents are worried. Fair enough. Reasonable people should be. Learn more to actually understand the risk.
But what it does not prove is that half of Calgary businesses would leave Alberta.
Yes. It’s a POLL. Do you understand that polling does not contact EVERY SINGLE PERSON. Do you understand how statistical analysis of polling works?
Less than 8% of Albertans signed the petition indicating support for separation, and that was after an illegal release of voter info. One could say that there is very little support for separation by your logic.
I think I see the problem here.
I understand they sent the poll to all their members. So only 4% thought it worth expressing their concern.
The majority probably did a better risk analysis comparing it to continued liberal misrule, having already cost Canada over a trillion dollars in the last decade of lost investment due to uncertainty of their deliberate anti industry legislation and this didn’t reach that level of worry.
“probably” is carrying a lot of weight here.
And a 4% response doesn’t equal a headline that says 48% of businesses would consider leaving. A long as it fits your narrative all is good, huh?
Christ on a cracker, this is embarrassing.
True Believers are very set in their thinking.
Which is twice the percentage that signed the poll for ‘leaving Alberta’. Yet we have the threat of 48% of companies would consider leaving.
So, which is the fringe minority?
You can’t argue on facts, so you revert to scaremongering tactics with misleading headlines. As I’ve said all along, all you have is fear.
“Albertans overwhelmingly back separation movement as petition surpasses required signatures.”
None of those headlines would be justified by the petition alone. A petition tells us how many people signed it—not how many Albertans support separation. Likewise, a voluntary survey of 137 Calgary Chamber members doesn’t tell us that half of Calgary businesses would leave Alberta. In both cases, the headline encourages readers to infer far more than the underlying data actually demonstrates.
Au contraire, mon ami; Christ IS the cracker. 
Scaremongering tactics. So what are you afraid of? That only 18% actually want to separate? And even they are split between independents and joining the US.
I’m not afraid of anything. In fact, my point has been the opposite.
I’m criticizing the use of fear in this debate.
We’ve just discussed a Chamber of Commerce survey where a voluntary response from 137 members became headlines suggesting “half of Calgary businesses” would leave Alberta. That’s an example of using a small dataset to create a much larger impression.
Now you’re doing something similar.
Bringing up “joining the US” misrepresents the issue. Both the petition and the referendum are about Alberta becoming an independent country, not about becoming the 51st state. Those are completely different propositions.
It also assumes that raising the possibility of joining the US is somehow an argument against independence or a way to denigrate people who might support it, when there is nothing inherently wrong with that perspective. There are 340 million Americans who are quite content being part of the United States. Only the ‘Elbows up’ idiots hate Americans (Actually, I think they hate themselves and Canadians more given their stance blocks any deals ever being made). We don’t.
If we’re going to debate Alberta’s future, let’s debate what people are actually proposing, not fringe positions or hypothetical outcomes that make for a scarier headline.
Whether someone supports staying in Canada or supports independence, the discussion should be based on evidence rather than fear. That’s the point I’ve been making all along.
But I suspect you can’t help yourself. You know your position is weak and you need the money to keep flowing west to east, so whatever it takes, right?