All Baby rapers should die!

The BBQ Pit
61

Don’t feed the troll. I know, it hurts, just walk away…

Yes, I said it for the third time. Yes, I saw the sad OP and knew it was basically lame. However, I also saw the pain in another poster. So, what did I do? Commiserated. I ignored the OP, ignored the trolling crap and spoke directly to her. I did not feed either one. Yes, I still feel this is not really a subject to be joking around about but I saw the jokes for what they were. And I ignored them.

I don’t feel Ayesha did anything wrong in posting seriously to what she saw in the OP. I don’t think I did anything wrong in offering her support or sharing my own view. I did NOT jump on the “let’s kick the shit out of Konrad” bandwagon because I recognized WHAT he was doing.

I do not approve nor have I ever threatened the life of another poster. In my view you are free to say what you wish and so am I. Ayesha flew off the handle but if you look back a bit she has apologized for her heated post. Finally, yes, Konrad should apologizes to her; however, some posters owe HIM an apology for taking his “joke”, no matter how ill thought out it was, too seriously.

But then again, what the fuck do I know? Just my FWIW.

Best!
Byz

62

Byz, I don’t think anyone thinks either of you were wrong for sharing. It was very brave of you both. I sincerely hope that if anything comes of this thread, it will not be a hatred of Konrad or a new troll (Mojo), but a realization that these things do happen and that children should be listened to when they try to get help.
I also agree with you that several posters owe eachother apologies. This may be the Pit, y’all, but we are civilized, intelligent people. Please don’t forget that.

Cessandra

It’s frightening how many crazies think that world is going to end in a few days. All of us smart people know that it’s not ending until next year.

63

I would like to apologize to everyone and Kanrad.
I didn’t mean to say everything I did.
I still feel strongly about this issue.
I don’t think this is something to joke about.
If you went through what I did when I was a kid. You would know
why I went off the handle.
I take back all the threats I made.
Have a good and safe holiday.

STAY STRONG

64

This will be my last post to this thread.

I cannot help but take this subject seriously, here in the pit, or anywhere else I see it written about, or, hear it spoken of IRL.

I have said all I have to say on the matter, maybe it will help one person, maybe it won’t, I don’t know. I certianly didn’t mean to turn this thread into a huge fight.

I am just me people, I don’t know how to be any other way.

Ayesha - Lioness

There are two solutions to every problem : the wrong one, and mine
(Thomas A. Edison)

65

I think anything can be made fun of.

That’s right. You heard me. Anything.

My personal decision for wether or not I’ll share my sick, twisted, (but funny, damn it!) sense of humor is simple, really.

“Who is my audience?”

Wishing everyone the best (yeah, even MOJO and Konrad :wink: )

I knew there were some posters here who have had personal experience with this issue (I have too, indirectly), and so, I refrained.

I can’t think of any worse crime than to harm a child.

I am against censorship and the idea of “thought police”.

It’s all in the audience, people.

You say “cheesy” like that’s a BAD thing.

66

I apologize as well… for my ignorance but not for my finding his words offensive. I am one who doesnt think anything can be taken as a joke, espcially regarding people’s pain. Perhaps my way of looking at it, is just that, my way.

We are, each of us angels with only one wing,and we can only fly by embracing one another

67

Hey. I don’t want to hurt or call up anybody’s pain here. But I’d like to have a discussion beyond the black and white.

Before I reached the age of majority, I had sex several times with several different people who were older than me; in one or two cases, much older than me.

Of course, the sex was consensual, and most of the time I initiated it.

How do you define “child”? How do you define “molest”? Does consent matter? I’d like to hear your views.

68

Personally, I don’t think that age matters so much as the mental capacity and level of maturity. Or rather, is this person capable of consent?
I am fairly sure that the act that most of us are speaking of involves a child that is unable to consent, or one that does not consent.

Cessandra

It’s frightening how many crazies think that world is going to end in a few days. All of us smart people know that it’s not ending until next year.

69

As irritating as Konrad can be, I think his post rather efficiently highlighted a real problem–the language of several legitimate civil rights movements can be preverted until it justifies pediophilia, and it is something that the rest of us need to be aware of and guard against–Konrad’s satire is the real life political position of NAMBLA, and we need to stay on our toes to insure that such a nauseating group remains on the outermost fringes of society.

As to banning all child molesters from society and forcibly castrating them, it would never work–you would never get a conviction. Juries use different standards of reasonable doubt for different sentences, even though they are not supposed to. Evidence that would send a man to jail for a couple years for robbery would not be sufficent, in many cases, to convince a jury to vote for the death sentence in a murder trial. Before people are comfortable ordering life in prison and/or emasculation they are going to want to feel 100% sure the person is guilty–a luxery you rarely have in molestation cases. Few pediophiles take pictures, at least not with themselves in the shot. So you go after a lighter sentence so that the jury is willing to convict at all, and then at least the monster will be in jail for a while, and have a criminal record.

As far as consentual sex with older teens, I think it should be illegal. Sure, some kids can handle it and not be hurt by it, but most teen agers at not as mature as they think they are. We do not want to leave it up to sixteen year olds to decide whether they are emotionally ready to have sex. The risk is too great, with no gain–I don’t think NOT having sex is going to cripple anyone’s development, and waiting those extra few years builds charcter.

I don’t think it should be illegal for teenagers to be having sex with each other, although I think it should be discouraged (Out of the car, Longhair!). But anyone having sex with someone under eighteen and more than four years younger than themselves ought to be prosecuted for statutory rape. Furthermre, who “initiated” it is irrelevant–just because a lonely, neglected, angsty sixteen year old who is desperate for attention jumps her math teacher does not mean that that adult is freed of the responsibility to act as an adult and refuse the advances. Teenagers are not considered competent to make decisions about where they live, about drinking, smoking, elections, legal contracts, big purchaces, credit lines, bank accounts, etc. If they can’t be trusted to do any of that, why should we trust them to make good decisions about sex?

70

as an aside, & as i’m sure many of you are aware, physical & chemical castration have been used for convicted pedophiles, as recently as w/in the past 3 yrs or so. i believe it happened in the southeastern u.s. somewhere, but don’t recall the state(s).

the judge offered either in place of a long prison term. the convicted chose castration over being placed in the general prison population. one man chose actual castration over chemical as a measure of how contrite he was & how much he really wanted to change.

the practice was considered extremely controversial (even the chemical castration, which is reversible) & the aclu got involved. don’t recall how many of the sentences were overturned.

The purpose of life is to matter, to count, to have it make a difference you lived at all.

71

While I realize you didn’t mean it quite the way I do, Phil, I have to agree - making sure they NEVER encounter children again is the way to go, and I mean NEVER. Castration? Well, I suppose (altho the jury remains divided on whether this works or not), but castration means they’ll possibly encounter children again, right? If “NEVER encountering children again” means execution, so be it, I’m down with that. Anyone who would molest or rape a child has NO redeeming qualities IMHO (which is part of the reason child-molesters/rapists are usually segregated from the rest of the general prison population - even convicted felons HATE child-molesters), and I’m simply not willing to pay the rent, heat, electric, medical, and food bills for people as sick and disgusting as child-molesters, so that they can be released on “good behavior” or whatever, and do it again down the line. I say nuke 'em. No tears lost here. No sleepless nights. In my book, there is simply NO excuse or legitimate reason for this to happen, and anyone who agues that it’s ok (or even jokes about it) can rot in <font color=red>HELL</font color=red>.

And Ayesha, don’t apologize. You have every reason to feel the way you do toward Konrad (sick fuck that he is) and his ilk. I’ve been (apparently EXTREMELY) fortunate that I never had even the remotest reason to deal with something this horrifying, and my heart goes out to you and Beth and others like you. I can be a very giving, caring person (ask around), but there are some lines that - once crossed - I CANNOT ignore or forgive (and certainly should never be forgetten). In cases such as child-molestation/rape (as with cold-blooded murder), I believe people should pay for their sick, twisted perversions with their lives - after all, the victim’s life has been damaged irreparably and for all time. I’m all the way FOR the death penalty.

So sue me.

Oh no, Cessandra. I’ve thought about this very long and very hard, and my resolve remains firm - I’ll vote for the death penalty EVERY time.

Yeah, I’m from Texas. So?

StoryTyler
“Not everybody does it, but everybody should.”
I Spy Ty.

72

Oh.

So my wonderful, altruistic, twenty-three-year-old best friend, with whom I had a splendid first time at age 16, which gave me the self-confidence to come out and upon which I’ve never looked back with regret, who basically helped me change my life, and is my closest friend to this day, should be imprisoned due to an accident of ages?

That seems either a little harsh or a little hidebound to me. I also think you’re undervaluing both freedom of choice and the positive effects of sex.

73

Insert my Standard Death Penalty Sermon:

If you think that any human system of justice is infallible, then you are ignorant. If you think that no person has been falsely condemned to death, then you are naive. If you think that even one innocent person, ripped from their life and their passion and put to death at the hands of the state is in any way justifiable, then you are evil.

  • Joshua W. H. Steiner
74

The problem, Matt, is that approving the situation you discribe demands that we approve all sorts of other situations which are horrible. I’ve known people who liked nothing better than putting fifteen and sixteen year olds through an emotional ringer, using them both for sex and because they enjoy the sort of complete infatuation and adoration you get only from an adolecent, and then breaking thier hearts. This is amazingly easy to do with most adolecents, who are lonely and angsty and frusterated and naive–a potent combination, and one that leaves them defenseless to any adult who can say one thing and mean another. And we can’t legally differentiate between the two situations–allowing your exprience means we have to allow the other type. And I think you overestimate the powers of sex: couldn’t your best friend have given you self confidence and support and affection without having sex with you until you turned eighteen? Would this have crippled your emotional growth?

As far a “freedom of choice” goes, I don’t think it is much of an issue for teens–we don’t let them make other choices because we know they have no judgement. Lord knows I woudn’t want to be bound by the types of decisions I made at seventeen. Even in your own case–was your first sexual experiance with a “wonderful, altruistic. . . best friend. . . who basically helped me change my life, and is my closest friend to this day,” such a good experience because you exercised good judgement and made a sound choice, or was it because you got lucky and found yourself with a good person more or less by chance? At that point in your life, with the set of experiences and the assumptions you had about people and life, would you have been able to recognize the difference between a good person and a manipulitive bastard? I hold that the average teenager cannot because they are still children, and as children they must be protected.

75

I had to think long and hard before making a comment to this post because of the inflammatory context. Currently, in today’s society, there is a rabid, public hatred abounding concerning pedophiles, which seems to exclude rational thought.

As a reference point, I want to remind people of the ages long attraction in sex and pornography concerning adult women dressing up as kids, complete with pigtails and calling their client or lover ‘Daddy.’ Speaks volumes doesn’t it? Plus the very frequent jokes from older men in which they request to be called ‘daddy.’

Now, that having been said, I would like to point out the very rarely discussed or even mentioned possibility of the pedophile being mentally ill. I mean, what normal person would have sex with a child, KNOWING that the consequences of the act are so severe that he will be branded for the rest of his entire life if ever caught? Those who rape adult women are treated with less severity. Serial killers are made into media stars. Plus, what normal person would rape a child, knowing that to protect himself that he would have to kill the victim in many cases?

I read ages ago that, before things got really crowded, young men and women often experienced sex first with cousins, brothers or sisters. Especially in rural areas. (Jokes are still made about hillbillies and first cousins, sisters and the like.) As short a time ago as in the 1960s, it was not uncommon for sex play to happen between siblings and doctors used to simply tell the parents to inform the kids that is wasn’t right, why and to knock it off. No one went running to HRS, the cops, shrinks or Social Services. (Remember childhood ‘games’ like I’ll show you mine if you show me yours?) As a moot point, the 7 year old daughter of a friend of mine was involved in a ‘touchy-feely’ exploration with an 8 year old girl friend, who knew a bit more about sex.

The result was that she became panicked and disturbed because of what she had seen on television about inappropriate touching, told her parents, wound up having to have several sessions with a child psychiatrist and is not allowed to be with her previous best friend any more. For a time, the police and social services were almost involved and the friendship between both sets of parents ended. (I remember being 7 or 8 and examining a neighboring girl of the same age out of curiosity as she examined me. Big deal. About the only thing that worked at 8 was the erection process without the ejaculation or even knowing what to do with it or why the sight of a nude female body excited one.)

Back to the original line. Pedophiles have to be mentally ill in order to have such overwhelming urges to do what is socially unacceptable and which carry such an enormous penalty. Rapists in jail are not brutalized like child molesters are. Even the police treat rapists better than child molesters. Rapists, having served their time, are not required to post notices on their doors about their crimes nor does the general citizenry rise up and force them to move to another area.

So, if child raping/molestation is a mental illness, then can the repeat offender control their urges? If not, and there is no actual workable therapy in general for them, what should be our response? Most therapies do not work well. Some convicted molesters willingly opt for castration to try to prevent themselves from doing it again. (THAT method is not fail safe because the urge to rape in regular rapists is not always based just on sex.)

I’ve noticed the dramatic increase in child molestation not only in the States, but across the globe and have yet to find any sound reason for it. (AIDS fear might count for maybe, I guess, 2%.) Trying to have a reasonable discussion concerning it is difficult also because I have found that if one presents such a side to the topic as I am now, one can often be accused of being a ‘hidden’ molester or possibly having ‘molester’ tendencies and even the potential stigmata of being suspect can be devastating.

The OP cites a horrible crime. In today’s world, I wonder WHY the crime took place. How should we respond? In outrage and gut the bastard? In concern and hospitalize him? Put him in jail forever? Try to find out a cure for his mental illness? Remove his nuts? Remove his schlong? Persecute him forever even after he gets out of jail? Ignore him? Exicute him?

Why are crimes of this form on the rise? We KNOW why most rapists rape, but there doesn’t seem to be much in the way of knowing why molesters molest.

Any opinions? Any correlation to the current incidents of children shooting children?

A brief historical note here. In the past, many male kids got all steamed up over their female teachers in school. (I know I did with a few.) Most dreamed of potentially having sex with them. Remember, nearly ALL adolescent boys are so full of hormones that they are essentially a walking penis. To a few, it happened. Back then, if it did, the student was somewhat treated like a stud and if it got out, the teacher was quietly reprimanded. No jail. No molestation charges. No lawsuits. (The kids dad would usually admonish the kid, then pat him on the back in private, tell him about protection and then go tell his beer buddies bout his stud of a son.) No shrinks. No Social Services.

Not today. Have we gone too far in concerns about child sex in that way? Have we not gone far enough? Does it tie in with molestation?

This does not concern the warped, quasi-homosexual group of NAMBLA (North American Man Boy Love Association) which promotes sex between adult males and young boys. (Circa Early Rome.) They are another issue.

Any solutions?

What? Me worry?’

76

Manda JO wrote:

Not getting laid before I was 21 sure as heck crippled my emotional growth. Hell, it damn near killed me.

I sometimes wonder, if consensual sex between an adult and a teen-ager were legal, could I have found an adult woman willing to (ahem) inculcate me? Might I have avoided several years of late-adolescent and post-adolescent Hell On Earth by having some woman – any woman – do the horizontal lambada with me?

And how much lower would the teen suicide rate be if they were allowed to have sex with adults?

The truth, as always, is more complicated than that.

77

At the risk of going on a tangent, there’s a big difference between rape and sex.

“Statutory rape” is consensual sex, but it’s assumed that one consenting party is too young to really consent.

“Date rape” is sometimes consensual, but it is assumed that one person is either incapable of consent (drunk, drugged, etc) or is threatened or pressured into a sexual act. It’s rarely violent.

With those exceptions, rape is an act of violence. Rapists should fry, yes. But remember there is a distinction between sex with a minor and rape.

-andros-

78

I realize I’m jumping in here rather late, but I have a slightly different spin to toss into the mix. Just so you know, I’m not bothering with the Konrad/trolling/how dare you/physical threats thing simply because it doesn’t seem worthwhile.

Anyway, I, too, am a victim of abuse, but my abusers were children. They were older, but by no means adult–I want to say the oldest was maybe 12 (this occurred between ages 5 and 7 or so for me). One was my age, and even served as a kind of ringleader. Fortunately, because of the age of the perpetrators, the kind of abuse I suffered did not involve actual penetration or sex acts–it was more about stripping me naked, poking, and laughing. A helluva lot of laughing. There was some other rather repulsive variations, but that’s not the point of my post.

So what is done with these kids? In truth, I have spent my years in therapy not dealing with what they did, but with what my parents didn’t do. They were aware of what was going on, but preferred living in denial. I have an easier time forgiving the kids who abused me because they were, well, children–I blame their parents and my parents far more. Still, they are responsible as well for their acts. What is done with them? Esp. the girl who was my age while this was going on–the one who encouraged others to do these things to me? Execution? Certainly not. Then…what?

My final 2¢…I still see castration as a viable answer. All through college (I was a Social Work major) I heard “Rape is a violent crime of power, not a sex crime, so castration isn’t the answer.” I believed it then, but have changed my response to this: Nonsense. It’s both a crime of violence and power and sex! And let me see the statistics that prove a castrated pedophile continues to molest children. Of course, not all pedophiles are men…for women perpetrators, life in prison may be plausible. (I’m curious to know if removal of the ovaries would have the same effect on a woman as removal of the testes on a man.)

If a racehorse is rank, obnoxious, violent, and overly aggressive, he is gelded–castrated–to make him more trainable. Hyper male dogs usually mellow out follow castration. Castration works on them. Are men animals? No. Would the results be exactly the same? No. But I believe it’s worth finding out.

I used to think the world was against me. Now I know better. Some of the smaller countries are neutral.

Laura’s Stuff and Things

79

StoryTyler:

You want Konrad to get the death penalty? Because that’s what I was talking about.

Cessandra

It’s frightening how many crazies think that world is going to end in a few days. All of us smart people know that it’s not ending until next year.

80

Alright, people. It’s time I got my ass whooped. I’ve been gone a while.

Sealemon is right. Everything can be joked about. It is all in the audience.

BUT:

How can anyone read MOJO LIZARD’s posts? I laugh at them, not because of the content, but because of the format.

They remind me of a big, strange poem.

I’m sorry, but that looks to me like a big, strange, oddly funny poem.

Again, nothing against you or your content, MOJO LIZARD, but I have trouble taking things seriously when written in haiku form.

Please do not hit enter at the end of every sentence, only when truly needed.

Thank you.

–Tim

We are the children of the Eighties. We are not the first “lost generation” nor today’s lost generation; in fact, we think we know just where we stand - or are discovering it as we speak.