Angel - 03/19/03 - Orpheus (spoilers)

Yay! Willow.

What can I say? It just keeps up the good work. I would be sorry to see the show cancelled. And with Alyson in the mix… things could hardly have been better.

Seing her on Angel, I’m so totally convinced she could carry her own show as Willow. I have no idea about the arc, but Hannigan’s acting is flawless and Will’s character is interesting.

Well, on to plot related spoilers:

Of course, Faith doesn’t get vamped. But the way she escapes was not what any of us thought about last week. My only objection is that they make the sollution too obvious with a stupid flashback. Hey - this is an intelligent show. The viewers are smart enough to be left wondering what happened, during the 30 secs the main title rolls.

There is a surprising amount of action, considering most of the main characters are in bed or sleeping or unconscious this week. Done with nice flashbacks to Angels previous life.

Maybe Cordelia finally reveals herself at the end - maybe not?

Nice magic battle between Cordy and Will (Cordy by remote). Holy Crap, I like seeing BadAss!Wicca!Willow.

Connor being manipulated by Cordy, who is about to lose it, and is getting sloppier. Connor must be denser than lead, not to catch on to the strangeness of it all.

Willow sorta makes a pass at Fred. Whoa - way much more chemestry than between her and Kennedy. I was wishing for something to happen and her return to Sunnydale to tell Kennedy she found someone else.

And - I can’t come to terms with no development of Faith. It’s such a great character - much more interesting than Buffy, who only wants to be normal. The possible arc about redemption, brought up again this week - could make for a very good arc.

[wishful thinking]
So - Faith and Will as lesbian lovers going at it with magic and slayer powers, both seeking redemption?
[/wishful thinking]

AngelScore: five-by-five

I am so terribly excited. Yay Willow! Favorite TV character since Dale Cooper.

I didn’t mind the flashback so much - it could be insulting to those of us who are quicker on the draw, but there was enough blink-and-you-missed-it exposition in this ep that I think one more thing to explain would have been too much.

[spoiler]I was TOTALLY grooving on Fred and Willow geeking out together. That was so much good old-fashioned fun to watch.

Wes and Willow’s dialogue was great black comedy: “Yeah did you hear I’m a badass?”
“Hey, me too!”
And Wes’ double-take when he caught on - priceless!

I agree that Cordy is getting very sloppy. Connor is sufficiently naive that I can believe he’d be fooled, but still - what if someone else walked in and caught her talking like that? And her outfits aren’t getting any better. shudder And what the HELL was she doing at the end? What kind of strategy is that? Or is she taking a completely different route now that Angel is back?

I want to watch it again though, I have a feeling I was missing something when Faith and Angelus were unconscious together. [/spoiler]

kung fu lola

Re: your last comment in the spoilerbox.

Angel eating rats was part of the redemption for tasting the blood of the victim in the diner. I think the whole interaction between Angelus, Angel and Faith goes to the very core of the Buffyverse. How evil always lurk in the heart of men (and women, obviously), how we must keep it at bay and if the beast in us ever gets out, we need to make up for it, by redeeming ourselves. There are ohhh so many layers here, that I need to see it again, too.

My take on the last part of the Faith/Angelus/Angel discussions is that the soul has as much personality and motivation as the demon.

Most of the discussion I’ve read seems to assume that the demon is actively trying to reassert itself, while the soul is seen as a more passive element. I think when Angel stands up and says (paraphrased) “It’s not all about you”, this is what he meant. The soul has it’s own agenda, and can act in more explicit ways, although most of the time it doesn’t.

This links back to the discussion Conner had with Angelus when Angelus was still in the cage, where Conner says Angelus is his real father, and that Angel is just something he is “forced to wear”. If the soul Angel is actually a complete entity, then it’s not quite that simple.

Maybe. I’ve been faked out by Joss more than once…

Speaking of vampires with souls… Does Willow tell Angel about Spike?

And has anyone heard anything about how Angel and Spike will react to one another when Angel drops into BtVS for the season finale?


No mention of Spike at all in this episode. But considering how chummy Fred and Willow are, I must assume there is contact between the two groups, not seen on TV, due to the previous crossover rule. Of course, Will and Fred have met before, but that was a long time ago, at least in the TV world.

Fucking bastard television stations cutting away in the last 20 minutes of Angel to tell us, over and over and over and over and over and over and over one piece of information and all the other crap we already know.

So, can somebody please fill me in on the last 20 minutes of the show in detail. I left right when Angel and Angelus started fighting in the alley.

And why is the WB broadcasting CNN coverage. If I want CNN, I’ll change the channel.

?? I didn’t see any CNN coverage…

Willow/Fred interaction… snort nyah-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha! I laugh!

Oh, and we got rid of cable, so no more watching Angel a day early. Now I actually have to wait for Wednesday to get the show through my TV’s bunny ears. thumbing my nose at cable company Ha! I still get all the shows I regularly watch but for free! doing the "superior dance

I’m e-mailing ya!

Email me too!!! I was taping it and planning to watch it tomorrow.

Now I come home, and what do I see? Live pictures of Baghdad. (Not what I was expecting.)

Dang it!

I really would appreciate being filled in on the ending.

OK Why can’t I turn on email on my registration?

It’s been a long day -

it’s amyz at


I’m in the same boat as Hamlet - Could someone please email me the ending? Dorks at WGN cutting in to say that they didn’t know what was going on, but not getting back to regular programming. :mad:

My email addy should be in my profile. <fingers crossed>

Thanks! :slight_smile:


Oh, someone just spoiler it? I missed the last six minutes or so. The line was, to Conner, “That just proves you’re”

They didn’t cut away where I was(Detroit).

Here is what happened

Angel and Angelus fight inside the flashback. Angelus is whooping Angel and Faith joins in. Meanwhile, Cordy is trying to block the spell that Willow is casting to reinsoul Angel.

During the spell, we all see big mean ghost faces threatening the group. This is Cordy’s counter-spell. It doesn’t work, so the fight between Willow and Cordy goes on. Connor breaks into Cordy’s room to make sure she is okay and it breaks her concentration. Willow gets the soul out and proceeds to go full on with the reinsoul process.

Up in the room, Cordy convinces Connor that he must kill Angelus because it is putting the baby at risk. Connor goes to the basement, knocks out Gunn, and gets ready to stake Angel/us. Faith wakes up from her coma, runs downstairs and stops Connor. They fight.

Connor backs against the cage, Angel grabs him and says, “It’s me. For real. It’s over.”

Willow and Angel leave for Sunnydale. Angel is about to give a little pep speech when Cordy comes down the stairs and says, “If this is about the worst being behind us, you better wait.”

She struts around revealing her pregnant stomach to everyone. Angel and the gang stare with dropped jaws.

Joss Whedon screen.[/spoiler]

Sent you te same mesage I sent to Hamlet.

Thanks, Mahaloth! I, too, was cut off a few minutes before the end, at the line, to Conner, “That just proves you’re–” Then the screen went black for a few seconds, then suddenly we’re seeing CNN’s coverage of the war starting. Which consisted of them having very little to report, but nonetheless reporting it at great length. As they always do when they pull out all the stops for a reeely BIG story.

Was there a preview? The TV Guide description of next week’s episode does not seem to follow from this episode. Sounded like it might be a repeat, but wasn’t labeled as such.

Yes, there was. Cordy looked like slutty evil mommy dearest in it.

Man, that dress Cordy was wearing in the final scene was just so cool!

I want one just like it.

I can’t believe that Willow would be talking to Angel and not say, “Oh, by the way, guess who went out and got his soul back last summer?”

I can sort of see why she didn’t tell him about the First being a big problem, what with Angel having an apocalypse of his own to deal with, she probably figured she didn’t want to divide his attentions with the troubles in Sunnyhell, but Spike getting his soul back, that’s good, happy news. Inspiring, even.

Oh, and when Willow hugged Angel, did anyone else think, “Oxygen, becoming an issue.”