How weird. The latest story from CNN has changed the place the plane left from. Initial reports said he was coming from Sofia, Bulgaria, and now it says he was coming from Switzerland.
Obviously, Italy had been the speculated target of additional attacks. Looks pretty damn fishy.
the massive damage and huge fire rule out the single engine nonsense. This is obviously terrorism. small plane accidents do not hit skyscrapers and do not leave this much damage.
CNN is saying the pilot was about 70 years old.
From Reuters:
In October, U.S. officials said they believed Milan’s Islamic Cultural Institute was al Qaeda’s main European base. Muslim leaders in Italy have denied that charge.
Italy has arrested around 30 people on suspicion of links to extremist Islamic groups since September 11 and has frozen around $300 million of suspected assets.
http://www.reuters.com/news_article.jhtml?type=topnews&StoryID=840950
Yeah, it looks fishy, but so far our only evidence is:
Changing locations
Full fuel tanks.
On the other hand, he was trying to land, and he reported an SOS. If he was a terrorist, he would make it clear he was. Committing an act of terrorism is pointless if you don’t make it clear that what you’re doing is terrorism.
I think it was a bizarre accident.
Zuma, calm down - you’re not helping, and you’re probably wrong. Unless you are an expert of some kind either on aviation or on structural dynamics, please stop making unfounded conclusions. If it had been a jetliner, then the eyewitnesses that the news networks have been scrambling to talk to would have said so when the anchors asked “what kind of airplane was it?”.
CNN has been contacted by Piper Aircraft, and they (Piper) are stating that there is no evidence that the plane actually is anything manufactured by Piper, and that “Piper” may be being used as a generic term for a low-wing airplane. Piper makes aircraft ranging from the small single-engine aircraft most of us think of when hearing the company’s name all the way to a twin-engine multiple-passenger aircraft.
Now, as for the damage to the building, keep in mind that the plane set off a major fire that was rather quickly brought under control - this may have busted out windows and scorched the outside of the building, making the damage look more severe than it is. Can you realy judge the difference between impact damage and fire damage that well? The pictures I’ve seen that are obviously impact damage show a very small area with bent window frames and metal parts hanging out, and the other damage appears to be soot and broken windows.
Except that the plane hit at 5:50pm local time. This would be an unusual time to carry out a terrorist attack, seeing as most people would have left work by that stage (meaning less people in the building).
It is also saying on CNN at the moment that witnesses saw some flames coming from the plane before it hit. More evidence to suggest mechanical failure was the cause.
This is really eerie !
CNN 3 dead, 30-40 injured
zuma, I’m as suspicious as the next person, but the evidence is really tending towards this being an accident. To which I’m sure the immediate counterargument is “that’s what they want us to think!” but Kilt-wearin’ man and Beastal are absolutely right. Plus, the pilot of the plane was apparently well-known to the people at the local airport, according to the latest thing from CNN. I dunno. It’s worrisome, but I do think it’s just eerie (to borrow dragongirl’s word).
I am calm. I simply stated that the amount of damage was in no way caused by a small single-engine piper plane. This is obvious by the damage done.
And I hope I am wrong… I hope this is not terrorism but some horrible accident. Also, the witnesses on 9/11 initially claimed that it was a “small plane”. My conclusions are not unfounded. There is massive damage, and a big fire. The kid in florida who ran a piper into a building busted a few windows. I’m just comparing a piper’s non-damage to a huge hole and fire which was obviously the result of a large plane.
I hope I’m wrong, but I don’t think I am.
Everyone seems a little paranoid with this.
As was pointed out it was late in the day, its a small plane, elderly pilot and most importantly of all, it radioed in engine problems.
IMHO if it was a terrorist I don’t think they’d try the plane route again… Everyone’s too paranoid (just look at the conclusions everyone’s jumping to) and the point of terrorism is to make a point/generate fear. Radioing that you have engine problems accomplishes neither.
Also its Italy… If it had been Germany, Turkey or England then yes I’d be thinking terrorist… but Italy isn’t a major political ally of the US. And also looking at the picture of the damage it looks pretty minor. I can’t find a wide angle image of the damage, which to me implies given the building it’s a pretty small hole. It looks like the dmage is just slightly larger than the wingspan of the plane.
I also can’t help but think that if you were to do another plane attack… you’d pick something very small and harmless looking like a 4 set cesna (which I can’t spell) and pack that sucker with C-4 on a timer. It’d be cheaper, make a bigger boom and nobody would think twice about it.
That’s a good point Beastal. And I’d not seen the report about prior flames from the aircraft.
Someday this world is gonna make sense again.
I think we should leave all the reckless speculation aside until more facts are known (i.e., “this was definitely a terrorist attack”). It’s sad that now, any time the words “plane” and “skyscraper” appear in the same sentence, the jump to terrorism is invariably made, either by those in power, those in the media, or us arm-chair commentators.
Do you realize that saying “It was a Piper” is like saying “It was a Ford”? Are you talking about a Ford Escort or a Ford Expedition? CNN has been talking about the stats on the Piper Commander single-engine airplane. It weighs 1 1/2 tons empty and can fly over 300mph. There’s a lot of potential for damage there. We’re not talking about the tiny Piper aircraft the little idiot in Florida was flying - this is a completely different airplane that may or may not be made by Piper.
Now, if it was a Piper, that does not mean it was a tiny little airplane such as what a student pilot would have had access to in Florida. Go here http://www.newpiper.com/aircraft/line.htm for more infor on Piper.
Miles O’Brien on CNN is saying that another pilot (and Piper Aircraft dealer) in the area has reported that according to the radio calls he heard it was NOT anything made by Piper, it was an Aero Commander, which is a twin-engine turboprop aircraft which runs on jet fuel. “Piper” is being used as a generic term for “not a jet”, just as nose wipes are “Kleenex” and all copiers will “Xerox” your documents.
http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=110261 for another discussion. Ace0Spades has an interesting post there.
Lieu,
Personally the world never stopped making sense. But then again I’m a cynic 
I expect the worst out of people and I’m pleasently surpised when I keep getting proven wrong.
It makes for a happy little world view honestly I’m not suprised by the appaling things people do to each other and small acts of kindness of honor make me happy
The flight path from Locarno, Switzerland to Rome, Italy takes you directly over Milan. This means there was no sharp change of direction before the plane hit the building (compared to 9/11, where the hijacked airliners diverted way off course before hitting their targets).
So it’s not as if the pilot went out of his way to get to Milan.
Coupled with the time of the incident, and the reports of flames coming from the plane before impact, I think it is safe to say at this point that we can chalk it up as mechanical failure, and not terrorism.
I’d like to pedantically point out here that “the little idiot in Florida” was in fact flying a Cessna 172R, not a Piper.
If anyone really cares, I’ll scare up a photo or two.
“Someday this world is gonna make sense again.”
Optimist.