Any dopers still playing starcraft?

It has become somewhat of an annual tradition for me to dust off the old Starcraft game and play it around the end of the year. Usually I just make my way through the single player campaign in Brood Wars and that’s it. This time I decided to look online to see if there might be anything interesting.

I couldn’t believe how much Starcraft stuff there was available! :eek: I knew this was a great game but I didn’t realize how beloved it truly was. Right now I’m slowly making my way through the user-made campaigns I’ve downloaded. Some of these are professional quality works and I’ve been enjoying them alot.

I have also started experimenting with the multiplayer aspect. This is the part I’m having trouble with. It seems I can’t win no matter what I do. I like to play as the zerg which might be the problem. Either I get overrun early in the game or I stagnate late in the game. Can anyone provide a little help? I have managed to hold off 2 people using protoss or terrans so I’m not a complete newb. I just can’t seem to get the hang of the zerg.

Actually, any kind of advice would be appreciated. You know what they say, “Know your enemy”. Also, AFAIK, most people tend to specialize in one race and it seems like no one uses the zerg.

I think this is one of the best games ever made. I’m sure I’m not the only one looking forward to the sequel.

zerg are my speciality. except i usually play with friends, and then against comps. From when i multiplayed (about a year ago,) i could hold of several people while zerg. Are you playing money maps or regular maps? (since that varies the strategies)

Against real people, more troops are better than more towers, but if you are on a money map you can afford towers. the only thing to worry about is zealot rush in the beginning, especially if he bypasses your towers and runs directly for your drones (which is why units are better). As zerg, you can also get more troops faster, and can do the rush yourself if you can pull it off (i can very rarely, and even then some other yahoo attacks my undefended base). Build lots of hatcheries. if the game hasn’t declared the unit limit, you don’t have enough hatcheries (your maggots count as units, thus stealing space from other people, and giving youunits to make while they get stuck)

mass hydras or mass flyers (evolved) is what i usually do, but i love sending streams of lings our to screw with people, especially while waiting for stuff to evolve.

hopefully there are more active current players who know more recent strategies and can point out what is wrong with mine.
and i’m sure you know this by now, but never do free for all on a map where two of the players have the same clan extension on their name.

Playing against other people is completely unlike playing the single player campaign, and both are unlike playing head to head matches against the pc on multiplayer maps.

I haven’t played against real people for ages (nor much at all, truth be told), but I always preferred zerg myself for such applications, for the simple reason that they don’t need so much micromanagement in battles, just build up a whack of hydras and send them in a massive wave. (I like terrans in campaign situations precisely because they do - I love inching my tanks forward with carefully overlapped fields of fire while making sure the anti-air screen doesn’t fall too far behind. But not against people, or even against head to head matches against the pc. I don’t multi-task well enough.) However, against talented people the zerg are going to suffer in the late-game. There are no good zerg answers to battlecruisers, carriers, nukes, templars, etc. If you let your enemy get to the top of the tech tree, you’ve pretty much lost already.

It sounds to me like the basic shift you need to make is in aggressiveness. If you play the campaign like I do, you like to focus on defense while you build up an unstoppable force, and then unleash it on the computer’s position. This works because the computer doesn’t send effective attacks at you in the campaigns. It sends stuff at you piecemeal, and you can generally absorb an unlimited number of attacks at near zero cost to yourself with the right defense. People aren’t like this. People are more like you. So what you want to do is hit early and often, keep them off-balance, and never let them get established. The more aggressive player will usually win. One simple way to play more aggressively - use troops instead of buildings for base defense. Because you can send the defense troops as a quick follow-up attack wave if you get your opponent on the ropes, or even use them to boost the size of the main attack, though this can screw you over if your enemy hits your base after you send your force out but before you get his attention with an attack. Plus you can withdraw survivors to another base if you’re clearly already losing a base. Sinking resources into defensive buildings allows for much less flexibility, though it of course provides some other advantages.

Memorizing a couple good build orders and learning how to do early recon are also useful.

This is probably applicable to every rts game ever made.

Hmm. Just thought of a nice illustration of the basic principle. In the basic campaign, one of the early terran missions has you defending a position for a fixed time (30 minutes?), at which point dropships will arrive to evacuate you. With a couple minutes left, the computer sends everything it has in a massive attack wave that is quite devestating. Most people, I’m sure, play this the first few times in a defense-first sort of way, which actually makes it quite difficult. You need a lot of bunkers with the right mix of troops in them to fend off the final attack wave. But if you play aggressively, the level is pathetically easy. Three barracks will easily turn out enough marines to send largish attack waves that will wipe the zerg out long before the time limit is up.

I still play occasionally, though my skills have slipped a bit; I used to be able to take down 7 comps on a normal map, though now I am down to 4-5. :frowning: I mostly play Terrans; I love the micromanagement abilities.

Thanks for the advice guys. I think I just need lots more practice.

I usually play money maps since they seem the most popular. My strategy is to build 7 ~ 9 hatcheries as quickly as I can. Then I constantly pump out zerglings and send them in waves of ~50. Lately I’ve tried adding ~12 mutalisk as backup (someone suggested it on b.net). My problem is I get overrun while I’m attacking someone else in 2vs2.

Early game I build a sunken colony close enough to cover my peons. Later I build lots of defensive towers because I figure they’ll be enough protection. I guess they aren’t worth it in terms of cost. (?)

Is there someplace where they explain all the terminology, etc of battlenet? It took me a while just to figure out what tvb means.

I recomend getting good on normal maps before heading onto the money maps, in order to get a good skills set. The money maps reward throwing huge numbers of troops with no control too much, and you don’t learn the micro to properly counter these attacks.

If you do play money maps, then the mass zerglings + mutalisk is a pretty good unit combo, especially if you can upgrade some of the mutas to other flying units. I prefer to use mass hydralisks when playing as zerg; they work well enough against just about everything, and if you get a good production base set up you can keep making them slightly faster than they get killed till overrun your opponet.

For playing defense, I recomend building only a couple of towers at first; all the species have units with longer ranges than the towers. And in the early part of the game you want your firepower to be as mobile as possible. Only start building mass towers when you start to hit your supply limit. For defense with the zerg I typically use ~10 hydras and 2 lurkers, with overlords overhead, in the worker line.

I can’t offer any strategies as detailed as those already mentioned, but I just wanted to drop in and say that I still play SC.

Or more accurately, I used to until my computer took a terrible tumble and stopped working properly.

And just for the record, the majority of people still playing on bnet are either complete newbs or really, really good. Don’t be too hard on yourself. Practice makes, well, not perfect, but at least better.

Cool build orders I vaguely remember (may be a bit wrong):

  1. Standard (flexible) good for mass hydras

drones to 8/9
pool
drones to 9
lord
drones to 14 or 15
hatchery (at expansion if poss)
gas (1 drone at first)

variant:

drones to 9/9
lord
drones to 12
hatch

  1. Fast gas (for rapid tech) good for mutas

drones to 8/9
pool
drones to 8/9
gas
drones to 9/9
lord
… blah

Just 6 or 7 pool for rush.

Of course you need to balance a bit between defence and economy in the early game, it helps if you know your opponents style.

My favourite tactic is the hydra-drop combined with fully upgraded queens - essential against terrans and protoss. You’ve got all those lovely free transports, use them! Mutas are too weak to rely on unless you can get them at exactly the right point in the game, before your opponent has a counter. However a few are useful to escort drops.

Most important of all is recon - zerg have the best. Scout early with lords and use burrow to put lings at expansion sites. Then parasite with queens as well. This way you see your opponents weaknesses and know what/where/when to hit him with.

Theres no real tactic for the late game except to be able to concentrate on many things at once - whoever loses concentration first will lose.

I also loved this game, its the best online game i’ve played. I only stopped cos I moved to Linux and can’t be assed faffing about with WineX. Its the only program on Windows I miss…

So theres going to be a sequel?

It seems like people only play the same 3 maps over and over. I guess that would mean the majority are newbs. I have met some cool people so far but they are the minority.

I’ve been trying queens and defilers right now. Normally I never use them in single player games so I’m not very good. I guess defilers are very importent late game.

Meta-Gumble, when I started I told myself I wasn’t going to memorize build orders and here I am memorizing build orders. I think I’m starting to get addicted to this game again. :slight_smile:

Hehe, Lost Temple was always my favourite - fairly well balanced + scope for a few good strategies. You need to be careful of rushes though… About towers - i’m not sure if they’re a great idea in the early game: for 125 you can get 4.5 zerglings… If you’re opponent has more troops at that point, then you have to look at your build-order.

Remember: sleep is your friend :wink:

I’m not currently playing Starcraft (not since Diablo II 10.0), but I have a habit of revisiting old games (sometimes very old indeed), so I’m almost certain to play Starcraft again eventually. I typically go Zerg air (devourers are more than a match for the battlecruisers and carriers Gorsnak mentioned, and guardians can kill anything on the ground quickly), but I haven’t done much versus other humans, so I’m not sure how effective that is there. I have found that on the money maps, mutalisks (unupgraded) are very useful: About two dozen of them sent straight for your enemy’s base have a very good chance of taking out his first Town Hall (the one closer-than-legal to the resources). They’re fast enough to just fly past most of the defenses with minimal casualties, and once there, they can attack ground (and the bounce attacks will do serious damage to his workers, too). Once you have the economic advantage (since his workers now have to travel further than yours), you should be able to overwhelm your enemy(s).

But the biggest point of advice, for this and every RTS I’ve seen: Never do anything halfway. An attack force should absolutely never have less than two dozen units, and sending 150 food worth of warriors in an attack does not constitute overkill. Never settle for injuring an enemy, if you have anything left to finish him. If you decide to detour to another opponent before finishing the first one off, he’ll have recovered by the time you get back to him. If one building producing units is good, then ten or fifty buildings is better. And so on.