Civil War wasn’t forgettable, and T’Challa didn’t have a cameo in it. He was darned near the main character, despite what the title said.
Not a chance. The reason modern box office numbers are so big is the international market and this film likely won’t do as much as the other outside the US, according to most pundits.
Very good point. I should have prefaced my argument with “domestic sales” as that is what I was talking about
iiandyiiii:
In reading these reviews, the one thing that sticks out at me is how many reviewers seem to say that it’s great “despite being constricted by the MCU formula” or something similar to that. These are the same guys 90+% of whom gave glowing reviews to Thor: Ragnarok and Spider-Man: Homecoming and Guardians Volume 2 and Doctor Strange and Captain America: Civil War. It always becomes trendy to hate on what’s popular, I guess. Maybe it’s time they realized that if the MCU films are so consistently good (and better recently than earlier), it might be because they adhere to the MCU formula (embedded into which is room for individualized flavor in individual movies) rather than despite it. Maybe Kevin Feige is actually doing something right rather than him being a liability that Coogler, Waititi, Gunn, etc manage to miraculously overcome.
Well stated.
Check this out: https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/15/entertainment/black-panther-movie-movement/index.html
In this article is an embedded video of a slam-poetry performance where the two guys riff on Black Panther, dissing other superheroes who wish they were as cool as T’Challa. Really funny.
I keep trying to forget it. Too many idiot balls bouncing around that one. But I agree that “cameo” is a significant misrepresentation of the size of the role.
On the rap point that rumbles on, I always assumed that they used it in the trailer not because the character was black but because the audience they were trying to attract is black and (presumably) likes that sort of music. To me this looks like Marvel saying “Hey, any black people who aren’t yet interested in the MCU films - we’ve got a kickass black superhero here! And that music you people like! Come give us your money!”. Maybe I’m just overly cynical, but then wasn’t Black Panther originally created for a black audience who were complaining there weren’t any black superheroes in comic books?
Anyhoo, the film looks good (and certainly better than Civil War). I’ll definitely be having a look-see.
In actuality of course, Civil War was very well made and intelligent.
Well, my opinion is my opinion and yours is yours, and my opinion is that the level of “geniuses solving problems by punching things” crossed my suspension of disbelief threshold during the airport scene - and that’s despite me liking most of the MCU films.
Off to see Black Panther tonight. Hopes are high.
How did you expect Iron Man to bring Cap in when Cap wouldn’t come peacefully and the alternative was the military killing him? And how did you expect Cap to react when his best friend whose been brainwashed and framed has been ordered shot on sight? What does genius have to do with that?
WTF, man? Did you write “CA: Civil War” or something? Because you’re taking this way too much to heart.
But the answer to your question is: in some more constructive way than lining up in a row and hitting each other with (someone else’s) trucks and airplanes. Which was obviously done because it Looks Really Cool rather than because it made any sense. And as such it required several characters to hold the Idiot Ball.
You liked the film. Good for you. I didn’t. It’s just a film, and a superhero action film at that.
Naw, that’s just projection. I typed it very calmly, just having a discussion. If you don’t want to, that’s fine.
Okay then.
Soooo… Black Panther, good movie but not mind blowing.
Made $25M in Thurs night previews, which is the 2nd best ever for Marvel after Avengers 2. Plus, it’s the highest ever non-summer preview total aside from the last few Star Wars movies. It’s gonna make a ton of money. Can’t wait to see it tonight!
I saw it last night at a “private screening” that was filled to the rafters and only three hours before anyone with $10 could see it. Why don’t they just open tentpole movies on Thursdays? Then they’d wind up with three days of sellout crowds in the opening weekend instead of two. Maybe they’re afraid that early online buzz could kill the Friday crowd for bad movies.
I really liked it. Michael B. Jordan showed again what a star he is. I loved him in Creed and Fruitvale Station. He’s alternatingly charming and tough in this. I hope that he and Ryan Coogler make a hundred more films. Winston Duke was hilarious and scary as needed. The rest of the cast was very good. Accents seemed a bit silly but since none of the overwhelmingly black audience I saw it with were bothered, I tried not to be. They at least seemed consistent from person to person.
Because it is an origin story, it didn’t rely on extensive knowledge of the Marvel Cinematic Universe and the plot didn’t lose me. I wondered however, if this showed a lack of commitment to the character. It felt like the studio might have thought this movie should stand somehow outside the universe they are creating so if it failed, it could be effectively ignored without feeling like over-arching plot lines got dropped.
I loved Wakanda. My wife has worked and traveled extensively in sub-Saharan Africa, particularly West Africa. She thought the clothes and city design felt like a real-world future West African city.
It was really interesting to see this movie which basically treated the black characters the way that the white characters in mainstream Hollywood movies get treated and treats the whites exactly the way that minorities are treated in those movies. The whites are underdeveloped, generally stupid or inadequate. The people moving the action are all black and there is time to help the cast develop as people and for the audience to understand their motivations. They have distinct personalities that come across and you understand their relationships to each other. The white people are mostly interchangeable cogs, they were routinely dismissed and disrespected by black characters, and they are embarrassing to watch on film. I cringed a bit but that was exactly what the filmmakers intended for me. Well done. I hope it doesn’t drive white audiences away. I hope it inspires white filmmakers to see what they’ve done to black characters for decades.
I think it will do well enough in the international markets. My hunch is it will do at least 55% of its box office overseas. That means it will slightly underperform internationally but not by much. It will still make a fortune despite its bury-it-in-winter release date.
I don’t see enough MCU movies to know what that formula is. They generally bore me and having lost track of the plotlines and the links between them, I can’t care enough to try to catch up.
Haven’t seen Black Panther yet, but I had been watching the Blade Trilogy, knowing that Wesley Snipes had originally wanted to play Black Panther way back then but it never happened. Was trying to imagine what a Snipes version of Black Panther might have been like. But Snipes himself, besides expressing gushing enthusiasm for the new movie, also acknowledges that the time probably wasn’t right for Black Panther back then, the time is now.
Wow, thanks for the warning. I can’t believe filmmakers would intentionally insult their audience like that.
If you find it insulting, you’re probably not the intended audience.
You’re going to miss out. Underdeveloped comic book villains are a durable archetype. The term “comic book villain” is even used idiomatically to refer to real people whose simplistic motives lead them to do tremendously terrible deeds. (e.g., https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/241785). Black Panther simply uses white people as incredibly traditional comic book villains to tremendous direct and meta effects.
The filmmakers are challenging their audience, not insulting it. Insulting the audience is what white filmmakers have been doing to minority audiences forever. I appreciate the occasional challenging film. It’s only the demonstration of racism in those other films that creates the opportunity here to show others what it feels like. It’s a brilliant choice. I’m sorry that you are so threatened by the possibility that white people aren’t presented as all-conquering heroes that you can’t bear to see a really good movie.