Buffy 15/10/02 Long sloppy word kiss-with spoilers

I had the priviledge of watching this last night, but the board was down so here I am over my lunch. Spoiler space follows (just in case i can’t get that nifty spoiler box to work):

[spoiler]I hope I’m not the only one who was really shocked when Cassie died at the end. I really had her pegged as the Scrappies’ Willow-character. She had that quiet, kinda dorky way about her, and she was psychic to boot. I totally thought she was going to be the best friend/mystical person for Dawn.

What does her death at the end mean? Her vision actually came true, which is odd in the Buffy-verse. Usually don’t they sorta come true, but in a twisted way? What i mean is, usually prophesy can’t be relied upon, yet in this case it was totally accuarte. She just up and died. Anybody think this is a fundamental shift in the Buffyverse, or am I just overplaying it?

I’m also positive Cassie was played by a young Drew Berrymore brought into the future.

I liked it. Not so much of Spike showing us all how crazy he is (we get the idea), more character development.

Doogie Howser fan fiction?
[/spoiler]

I hope you’re all jealous. I used to have to watch Buffy on Saturday, and come here and not try to spoil the eps. for myself. Now you know what’s it’s like. Hrmph.

[GASP!]

A true, honest-to-God spoiler! Gah! I have actually seen the future!
I have only 5 1/2 hours to go before the show comes on and now I already know what happens!!!
You are a true villain, pure!
Fie on thee!

Not my fault, I swear! I tried to warn you!

i tried to warn you

Spoiler whore checking in here.

Haven’t seen it yet, doesn’t come on here in Vegas for four more hours, but, I was glad for the little tidbit about Spike.

I’ll check in tomorrow, after I’ve seen the episode.

I give up on Buffy. I’ve watched faithfully, for all these years, but last year was an absolute turn off … and they’re back at it. I don’t watch TV to see depressing stuff, I watch to see fun and excitement and whatever. OK, once in a while, I’m willing to put up with a depressing episode… but not every freaking time.

Screw it.

Paraphrase of Final Line: “Boo hoo, how dreadful, some things are fated and we can stop them!” Been there, done that. Giles’ girl friend. Buffy’s mom. Tanya. And half a dozen other minor characters.

Overall, rather depressing and predictable. I mean, the girl’s name was Cassie for crying out loud, of course her predictions would all be correct!

Bright points:

-Principal Cool Guy is from the Hood… of Beverly Hills.

-Doogie Howser fanfiction

-“I’m over you sweetie.”

-The scene at Tara’s grave (Yay! they didn’t completely forget about her!)

-Spike’s getting more lucid. Good. (“Who are you?” “A Bad Man.” punch heh.)

Annoyances:

-“Someday she’ll tell you…” What? That she forgives him? That she likes tacos? That his hair’s on fire? I’m firmly convinced that this line was only added to vex me.

-Home Improvement guy. Just… ick.

Next week promises to be better thoough. Bring on the Anya!

I wish this episode had been a week or two off with lighter episodes before it. It messed up the season’s starting pace. It wasn’t a bad episode really but it was made to be predictable and depressing. There were lots of good parts. Buffy the Counciler was good stuff. It would have been nice no supernatural or just the creepy prophesy stuff.

The random prophecies at the end were there to make moments later in the season stand out. They probably won’t refer back to Cassie but when they come it’ll click in place. I think she was going to tell Buffy she was going to do something real big. Right before her heart gave out. I knew that was what was going to happen. Mostly because aneurism was already taken.

Home Improvement guy looked like a sleezy high school junior or senior so he was a good pick look wise. He wasn’t on screen long enough to tick me off. I was disapointed that Cassie wasn’t the next opening sequence girl instead of a random sacrifice for cash. I liked Buffy’s mockery of the lame ass demon summoning.

Next week’s episode looks good. I liked that they showed Anya getting stabbed. As if anyone who watches would think that could kill her. I give the episode 5.5 out of 10 and a special gold star for the Buffy the Counciler stuff. It was still better than the average for season 6, was worse than the other episodes so far this season and wasn’t nearly as good as the overall average for the series.

Hrmm, anyone think that demon bite may turn into something a little more long term, perhaps the Home Improvement guy will be back?

Why did Willow put the rocks on Tara’s tombstone? It’s a Jewish custom, but Tara wasn’t Jewish and Willow, though raised Jewish hasn’t touched on that in a long time. I don’t think you’d do that for someone who wasn’t a Jew.

Doogie Howser fanfiction was a great line. Our old Willow is coming back.

I like the Principle, sounds like he has some promise as a guide/mentor/adult friend for Buffy.

I liked the “Someday she’ll tell you” line. It could be forgiveness, love, thank you, lots of stuff. Intriguing without giving too much away. And the “You will make a difference” is the same thing. But I’m not a huge fan of prophicies, since they’ve shown that they can be changed. It seems like Cassie’s all came true.

Not a great ep, but not that bad. I love the Anya character, and her character could use some development right about now. Let’s resolve the Vengence Demon thing.

Even though she isn’t a practicing Jew, Willow may still find comfort in some of the customs of her cultural heritage.

I think Steven Speilberg would disagree with you here.

Hmm, I really liked this episode.

Like so many atheists that celebrate Christmas, say “bless you” etc? Traditions may start as part of a religion, but end up as part of a culture.

I think I’m gay … would the hottest women of the SDMB go out with me just so I can be absolutely sure?

(dumb grin)

It really pissed me off, when Cassie died, especially since her MOTHER did not tell her about the family history of heart problems.

More common than you might imagine.

Sua

Why? That’s not at all unusual. I’m certain there are a great many parents out there with info on family problems and have never told their kids (my mom has all these funky problems and didn’t bother telling me for years).

And as for the rocks …

While I’m not full-blooded Jewish or have ever practiced, it seems it was once a sign of a person’s offending the church - a stone on your coffin means you were excommunicated, hence were worth stoneing. Now, that is not the case. It’s more like a little seat for the person’s soul to come and sit on while you visit. There seams to be some dispute on whether to leave it or take it away, and I think seperate little groups do as they see fit.

Now, my not being Jewish but having seen this practice before, I was impressed they added it, and find it completely within Willow’s rights. She loved Tara, and she uses a custom that, though she wasn’t an everyday practitioner, she had obviously grown up with.

Respect, see. Yeah, see.

It’s true that the survivors did put stones on Schindler’s grave, but that seems connected to his act of saving Jews, sort of an honorary Jew. I don’t recall Tara and Willow even discussing religion other than Wicca.

Still, the comforting rituals tend to surface in times of need. Clearly, it helped her deal with visiting Tara’s grave, that’s all that really matters. It just struck me as odd, since they haven’t mentioned her Jewish faith in a long time.

Cassie dying was needed to show that her premonitions always come true. Now, what she said to Spike and Buffy have more weight. Still, she could have been a charter member of the Scrappies.

The gloom and doom needs to lift, I feel like I have to watch Monty Python after Buffy just to be able to get out of the chair.

Hey now! I bagged on Buffy’s last season as much as anyone, but one episode with a downer ending is ok. It’s not Buffy the Puppy Trainer after all.

A good, not great episode. Xander used as non-humor relief (thankfully), and Dawn actually used in a clever manner pushed the score up a bit.

Next week looks good.

I really hate it when I plan to come here in a high dudgeon to make a point and someone has already made it, using some of the same people that I was going to use as examples, to wit:

Exactly the reaction I had, except I got Tara’s name right (ducking). I’d add to that list Brain Tumor Boyfriend from season 2, Faith from season 3 and Ben from season 5, among others.

The Buffy/Spike interaction really pissed me off this ep. Maybe it’s the influence of my fellow Dopers but the way she treated him irked me something awful. Did it seem to anyone else that Spike was feeling less pain when he was wailing on that one guy? Previously one punch would send Spike reeling for several seconds. Last night it was like (punch) “ow” (punch) “ow” (punch) “ow.”

I did very much enjoy Buffy the Counselor, although the “Buffy the Vampire Slayer would bust through this door” line was a bit heavy-handed.

Overall I give it a 5.

I thought the girl said “Someday she’ll love you,” but maybe I heard that wrong…

Thank you for the Home Improvement reference. Watched that show only occasionally many years ago, and was going NUTS trying to figure where I recognized him from. As none of my family members EVER watched HI, they were very irritated at my repeated questioning, "Where do I know that guy from."

Missed the Doogie Howser line. Anyone want to clue me in?

Thought it was a decent ep. Sure, Cassie died, but she was essentially a glorified redshirt. People died all the time in S1-5 demon-of-the-week eps. I would have liked it if she’d given a few more “hints”.

Dawn was better than usual this ep (which isn’t saying much!) Her detective bit is getting tiresome, and her sobbing at the end undid all the good thoughts I had had of her during the ep. Took her right back to whiney Dawn. She really looked hot in some of the earlier HS scenes, tho!

Pretty crappily costumed and ineffectual demon. Especially disliked the jutting jaw, and the rubbery boot.

Really did not like the scene where they confronted the dad. Hi, we’re from the HS. We heard you had been arrested. Are you a drunk?

Yeah, a belligerent drunk is even going to let them in his door with that BS story.

Overall, a fine ep - tho nothing memorable. I did not see it nearly as dark as some of you are making it out to be.

Not to mention lousy choreography.