D & D on the Straight Dope setup thread. (In Middle Earth FA63)

[D_Odds]

[QUOTE=What Exit?]
**What Race is best at what class: **
Clerics: Common Man, Southrons
Druids: Woses & Beornings followed by common man.
Melee Fighters: Khazad, Beornings, Dunedain, Common
Horse Riders: Rohirrim, Dunedain, Common
Bowyers: Silven, Sindar & Noldor then possible Hobbits
Rangers: Dunedain of course, then Common
Paladins: Rohirrim, Common
Mages: Common Man or Noldo
Illusionist: Common Man, Southrons
Thiefs: Hobbits, Common, Silvan
Monks: Southrons. Common
Bards: Elves are best then all others.
Ranger Bards: Dunedain of course, then Common

Jim
[/QUOTE]
You just had to go and throw the Dunedain up their twice, didn’t you? Brin slumps and walks away.

OOC - don’t worry, I’ll moderate this when we get going…I’m just having some fun right now. I’ll still be insecure, but not this bad.

[Malacandra]

[QUOTE=NAF1138]
Thankee. I do have a mighty thrist.
[/QUOTE]

More information than I care for.

And don’t worry. Once you start waving that ox-cleaver around, I’ll be only too pleased to stay well out of your reach.

tosses a piece of silver barwards and motions to set 'em up again.

[MHaye]

What Exit?

If you want some help with references, just let me know. I still have all my 1e rulebooks lying around, although spell lists and stuff will need typing up. That definitely includes the original Unearthed Arcana, where the cantrips came from.

[appleciders]

[QUOTE=What Exit?]
I’ll find a list of cantrips for you somewhere. These are very minor spells you keep in your head that do far less than the ones from your link.

They are things like coloring hair, stacking wood, sweep the floor, button or unbutton. Tie something neatly etc. Simple, easy, gratuitous magic.
[/QUOTE]

OK, great. Then I’m satisfied with my character.

[What_Exit]

[QUOTE=MHaye]
What Exit?

If you want some help with references, just let me know. I still have all my 1e rulebooks lying around, although spell lists and stuff will need typing up. That definitely includes the original Unearthed Arcana, where the cantrips came from.
[/QUOTE]

Thanks, maybe you could give **appleciders ** a better idea of the cantrips. I think all the ones in Unearthed Arcana are available.

Just a minor note, I have photocopies of an old Dragon magiazine that had Cantrips and extra glyphs for before Unearthed Arcana was printed.

Honestly for cantrips, if it is something silly and almost as easy to just do, there is a cantrip for it. A mage would pick up many of these.

A common one was Sort. It would quickly seperate small objects by type of coin or color or size and arranged neatly by groups of 10s or 100s for easy counting. (Vampires loved this one)

Did you want to play or be 1st alternate or are you just observing?

---

Gwaelur son of Gwaelin has been mailed out.

**Brin ** is next.

I need a little more feedback from **Elendil’s Heir ** and CatInASuit.

I sent an Email to **CatInASuit ** with a class question.

EH, if possible, can you summarize your character as we have discussed it, and list the following.
Class, Race, Sex, Name if you have one, Prefered secondary skill, Proficiencies, whatever history we have come up with so far. Any oddball notes that it would be helpful for me to know as I start creating the characters.

Send it to me as an Email.

[glee]

[QUOTE=D_Odds]
Whereas the Men of the West are naturally good at … nothing?
[/QUOTE]

No, no, no. I was just surprised that how high my tracking was and was certainly not trying to be snarky.
This is only going to work if we act as a team.

[glee]

[QUOTE=appleciders]
OK, great. Then I’m satisfied with my character.
[/QUOTE]

Druids start with a few more spells than MU’s, so I can take ‘Detect Magic’, freeing you up to learn something else.

I will cast ‘Entangle’ if there is enough plant growth, so archers (the elf?) could pepper trapped opponents.
‘Heat Metal’ will be aimed at 3 opponents wearing metal, forcing them either to take it off or suffer a lot of damage.
‘Summon Insects’ is my big spell, tying up the biggest opponent for 3 rounds and also doing some damage.

I’d like the party advice - would you prefer an extra curing spell, or for me to take ‘Flame Blade’ as my melee weapon?
I suspect there are enough Fighters that I can concentrate on curing…

[What_Exit]

[QUOTE=glee]
Druids start with a few more spells than MU’s, so I can take ‘Detect Magic’, freeing you up to learn something else.

I will cast ‘Entangle’ if there is enough plant growth, so archers (the elf?) could pepper trapped opponents.
‘Heat Metal’ will be aimed at 3 opponents wearing metal, forcing them either to take it off or suffer a lot of damage.
‘Summon Insects’ is my big spell, tying up the biggest opponent for 3 rounds and also doing some damage.

I’d like the party advice - would you prefer an extra curing spell, or for me to take ‘Flame Blade’ as my melee weapon?
I suspect there are enough Fighters that I can concentrate on curing…
[/QUOTE]

Crap I forgot. Don’t pick the same spell twice. You can throw your spell points at any spell you have memorized and cast it up to your level each day. So at third level the Mage could cast 3 sleeps if need be and you can cast 3 Cure Lights.

I get a little forgetful. I have used the same basic rule set since 1986 or 1987 and I have to remember to list my variants.

I listed the spell conversions earlier. I hope both Spell Casters saw that. It will apply to the Bard someday too.

…

I thought I sent out the spell conversions, now I can’t find them. (Did anyone get these already? )

**Here is how it works. **

You can down at a minus 1 penalty. So a 2nd = a 1st and a 3rd equals a 2nd or two 1st. A fifth could be a 3rd & a 1st. etc.

To cast up you need to exceed the Spell level by 50%. So to cast an extra 2nd takes 3 1st. To cast an extra 3rd, 2 2nds and a 1st would do it.

If you need more cantrips, a 1st = 4 extra, a 2nd = 6, 3rd and above is Level-1*4. But no amount of cantrips will give you a 1st.

Jim

[D_Odds]

Summon Insects is best targeted at magic-using opponents. It greatly increases the chance for spell failure (although that may be 3e rules versus 1e rules).

I never found Flame Blade to be useful for anything more than killing regenerating trolls, and I think ME trolls will be different than D&D trolls. Druids should not be close enough to battle to need a flame blade, IMO. Especially at the early levels, healing spells are key. I don’t know the 1e Druid spell lists, but “buff” spells like Bless or Aid also are very helpful. Summon ‘cannon fodder’ is also good. Anything that is killing cannon fodder isn’t killing me.

ETA: What Exit?, those sound like the sorcerer rules from later editions. Rather than picking spells to cast for the day, you can cast x number of spells from an allowed pool per day.

[What_Exit]

[QUOTE=D_Odds]
Summon Insects is best targeted at magic-using opponents. It greatly increases the chance for spell failure (although that may be 3e rules versus 1e rules).

I never found Flame Blade to be useful for anything more than killing regenerating trolls, and I think ME trolls will be different than D&D trolls. Druids should not be close enough to battle to need a flame blade, IMO. Especially at the early levels, healing spells are key. I don’t know the 1e Druid spell lists, but “buff” spells like Bless or Aid also are very helpful. Summon ‘cannon fodder’ is also good. Anything that is killing cannon fodder isn’t killing me.

ETA: What Exit?, those sound like the sorcerer rules from later editions. Rather than picking spells to cast for the day, you can cast x number of spells from an allowed pool per day.
[/QUOTE]

Summon Insect & Magic Missile are two of the best anti-spell casting spells.

I agree on Flame Blade and you are correct, the Trolls of Middle Earth are much closer to the Giants and Ettins of D&D. Of course the basic type has that nasty habit of turning to stone if exposed to the sun.

Druid don’t have many buff spells, but the ability to make Goodberries up ahead of time if huge for healing and food.

I am not sure if this Druid is the type willing to summon actual animals to be slaughtered for the party. We’ll see how that goes.

The Spells rules are from 1986 or 1987 and my own creation. I disliked how the AD&D rules worked and made my own. It obviously boosted the power of the spell casters, but at the same time I boosted the powers of the Fighters. I think I was inspired by the better Mana rules that MERP had.

Your character is making its way through the wilds of the Web. You might be surprised by the special ability I came up with for you.

Jim

[appleciders]

[QUOTE=What Exit?]
Crap I forgot. Don’t pick the same spell twice. You can throw your spell points at any spell you have memorized and cast it up to your level each day. So at third level the Mage could cast 3 sleeps if need be and you can cast 3 Cure Lights.

I get a little forgetful. I have used the same basic rule set since 1986 or 1987 and I have to remember to list my variants.

I listed the spell conversions earlier. I hope both Spell Casters saw that. It will apply to the Bard someday too.

…

I thought I sent out the spell conversions, now I can’t find them. (Did anyone get these already? )

**Here is how it works. **

You can down at a minus 1 penalty. So a 2nd = a 1st and a 3rd equals a 2nd or two 1st. A fifth could be a 3rd & a 1st. etc.

To cast up you need to exceed the Spell level by 50%. So to cast an extra 2nd takes 3 1st. To cast an extra 3rd, 2 2nds and a 1st would do it.

If you need more cantrips, a 1st = 4 extra, a 2nd = 6, 3rd and above is Level-1*4. But no amount of cantrips will give you a 1st.

Jim
[/QUOTE]

That does sound closer to the sorcerer, but I think the difference is this: My allowable pool of spells is based on which spells I learn in the morning and can change from day to day based on what’s in my spellbook, whereas a sorcerer cannot change his spells from day to day.

As to casting up and down, you had mentioned that but I thought it was in reference to learning new spells. It makes more sense in terms of casting.

[Elendil_s_Heir]

[QUOTE=glee]
…I’d like the party advice - would you prefer an extra curing spell, or for me to take ‘Flame Blade’ as my melee weapon?
I suspect there are enough Fighters that I can concentrate on curing…
[/QUOTE]

I’d vote for more curing spells. I have a feeling we may need them!

[D_Odds]

[QUOTE=What Exit?]
Summon Insect & Magic Missile are two of the best anti-spell casting spells.
[/quote]
This is why, in a magic-user versus magic-user battle, it is better to raise Shield first, then cast Magic Missile, because the first thing opposing magic users do is disrupt each other’s first spell with Magic Missile (thinking the other MU is going for a more ‘alpha’ attack).

I am not sure if this Druid is the type willing to summon actual animals to be slaughtered for the party. We’ll see how that goes.

Well, then maybe the MU spells Summon Monster. I like anything willing to take a hit for me.

Your character is making its way through the wilds of the Web. You might be surprised by the special ability I came up with for you.

Jim

Got it. Had a couple of questions, which I sent back to you.

[Malacandra]

Flame Blade is the druid’s big equaliser against undead, too. In any kind of low-light conditions Faerie Fire is a nice way to give allies a to-hit bonus. And even if the druid doesn’t want to call up cannon fodder, a scent-hound, watchdog or spy in the sky always comes in handy.

Now if we find ourselves in bear country, or maybe some wild swine or kine, Ghan might find some friends who would be ready, willing and able to get into the rough stuff.

[What_Exit]

I am piecing together Thoroncir aka Elendil’s Heir.

I figured while I actually have a mostly dead Friday, I would get another one out of the way.

CatInASuit: Hobbit rogue (a Took Treasure Finder) needs to ger back to me on an Email that I hopefully sent concerning a change in class. I cannot start on the character until the reply.

Jim

[glee]

[QUOTE=What Exit?]
Crap I forgot. Don’t pick the same spell twice. You can throw your spell points at any spell you have memorized and cast it up to your level each day. So at third level the Mage could cast 3 sleeps if need be and you can cast 3 Cure Lights.

[/QUOTE]

Glad you mentioned that…it makes my spell selection much easier.

@D_Odds

Summon Insects is best targeted at magic-using opponents. It greatly increases the chance for spell failure (although that may be 3e rules versus 1e rules).

I never found Flame Blade to be useful for anything more than killing regenerating trolls, and I think ME trolls will be different than D&D trolls. Druids should not be close enough to battle to need a flame blade, IMO. Especially at the early levels, healing spells are key. I don’t know the 1e Druid spell lists, but “buff” spells like Bless or Aid also are very helpful. Summon ‘cannon fodder’ is also good. Anything that is killing cannon fodder isn’t killing me.

‘Summon Insects’ is great against anyone!
No save; victim can do nothing but takes 2hp damage for 1 round per level.

I appreciate your confirmation that I can stand back and therefore am unlikely to need ‘Flame Blade’ - mind you, under the rules that I can use any spell I memorise, I can afford to take it. (I get quite a few low-level spells.)
I will always have two healing spells: ‘CLW’ and ‘Goodberry’…

Sadly ‘Bless’, ‘Aid’, ‘Chant’ and ‘Prayer’ are all Cleric only. But I think you will like what I can do instead.

Oh, and ‘Summon Monster’ spells are the province of the MU (3rd level spells upwards).

@What Exit?

Druid don’t have many buff spells, but the ability to make Goodberries up ahead of time if huge for healing and food.

I am not sure if this Druid is the type willing to summon actual animals to be slaughtered for the party. We’ll see how that goes.

Aha! You allow ‘Goodberry’ storage? Combining with the above, that means I can cast ‘Goodberry’ from all my unused spell slots at the end of a day? And they last for days (as per spell duration)?
Now I have a lot of healing to offer the party!

Ghan will not want to ‘Summon Animals’ to be cannon fodder. That goes against his beliefs.
However ‘Summon Woodland Creatures’, who can fight intelligently, sounds fine to him.

@Malacandra

Flame Blade is the druid’s big equaliser against undead, too. In any kind of low-light conditions Faerie Fire is a nice way to give allies a to-hit bonus. And even if the druid doesn’t want to call up cannon fodder, a scent-hound, watchdog or spy in the sky always comes in handy.

‘Flame Blade’ only gets +2 damage v undead. It’s not like an MU ‘Wall of Fire’, which does double damage.
I’ll load it, because of the wonderful flexibility above, but only for self-defence. I expect to cast a lot of healing instead.
‘Faerie Fire’ is now one of my automatic choices (again because of the flexibility). My understanding is that it works in any light conditions (but I’ll check this in a detailed e-mail to the DM later today).

[What_Exit]

[QUOTE=glee]
Aha! You allow ‘Goodberry’ storage? Combining with the above, that means I can cast ‘Goodberry’ from all my unused spell slots at the end of a day? And they last for days (as per spell duration)?
Now I have a lot of healing to offer the party!
[/QUOTE]

You are still limited to only as many spells per day as you have levels. So any night you can scrape up 3 2nd level spells you can make the berries.

I have to look up the spell soon, but I believe it is 2-8 Berries lasting 1 days +1/lvl. You also might need to cast a plant growth to get the fresh berries that are needed.

There is also a limit of eating only 8 berries in any given day, but it does help a lot.

Jim

[NAF1138]

Wow, I just looked at my character sheet (and then had Jim explain it to me :o ), I am one powerful bastard!

Let me at em, I will kick all their asses. I will take em on 5 at a time! If they are Orcs, I will take em on 10 at a time! Pass me another ale, I want to get drunk and fight.

[glee]

[QUOTE=What Exit?]
You are still limited to only as many spells per day as you have levels. So any night you can scrape up 3 2nd level spells you can make the berries.

I have to look up the spell soon, but I believe it is 2-8 Berries lasting 1 days +1/lvl. You also might need to cast a plant growth to get the fresh berries that are needed.

There is also a limit of eating only 8 berries in any given day, but it does help a lot.

Jim
[/QUOTE]

That’s exactly what I was expecting.

P.S. After 29 years roleplaying, I am now loading ‘Plant Growth’ daily?! I love this game!

[glee]

[QUOTE=NAF1138]
Wow, I just looked at my character sheet (and then had Jim explain it to me :o ), I am one powerful bastard!

Let me at em, I will kick all their asses. I will take em on 5 at a time! If they are Orcs, I will take em on 10 at a time! Pass me another ale, I want to get drunk and fight.
[/QUOTE]

I have read your information with interest and would like to subscribe to being in your party.

P.S. If you do go beserk with power, please remember that the small ugly one with a blowpipe is on your side…