I don’t get it, man. I never understand what could drive someone to suicide, but if the thought of an Army Recruiter calling you would drive you to thoughts of suicide, I really hope you got help. If you really were getting that many calls, it was most likely your friends fucking with you. As was explained upthread, Recruiters don’t have the time to do waste calling people who don’t want to join.
As far as the long hair, I hope you don’t accept prejudice in your life. We don’t either. In fact, the young man I am driving down to ship out on Friday has hair to his ass. Seriously. He wanted to report to BCT like that, but I asked him to cut it today. Just because the barber at BCT will probably rip it when he cuts it. Anyway, walking out on an uninvited guest, I could understand that, but what I don’t get is why your mom wanted you to meet with him so badly. Could it be that she made the appointment or that she asked the Recruiter to call you?
My school made most of the senior class take the ASVAB. I apparently scored very well on some part of it or another. The recruiters from all 5 branches wouldn’t leave me alone, even after I told them I was in college. 9am Saturday was big for them, but not so good for me. Some even recommended OCS and such things. Eventually, the only thing I found that worked was telling them I was gay. It was a lie, but it was the only thing that actually worked.
I actually feel guilty about doing that. But I was much happier to sleep in on weekends.
I hate to tell you this, and I feel guilty about it too, but thanks to DADT, if the person tells me they are gay and can’t enlist because of it, I remind the person that I did not ask. If the person still insists he/she can’t join because of orientation, I do tell the rest of the people that I call from your school that you are a homosexual. Because if you tell me and then believe that you can’t keep your orientation to yourself, I feel that is an invitation to share that knowledge with your High School class.
I find myself re-reading your post, convinced that I cannot have read what I read. You didn’t really do that, right? I’m missing some droll irony here, yes?
I don’t understand this thinking. They are sales people and there is nothing unpolite about telling sales people “no” with no reasons in person or on the phone.
I see nothing wrong with people being who they really are. I also believe most of what people tell me when I call them. So here is the typical conversation:
SSG Schwartz: “…So I am your local Army Recruiter.”
Potential Applicant:“Yeah, well I am gay, otherwise I would love to enlist”
SSG Schwartz: I never asked you about your orientation.
PA: Well, I am so gay, I have to tell you about it and I can’t join unless you could accept me for being openly gay.
SSG Schwartz: Thanks for your interest, and I will do what I can.
Potential Applicant (2): Hello
SSG Schwartz: This is your local recruiter. PA wants to join, but he is openly homosexual and can’t. Can you believe that?I’ve talked to him several times and never suspected. To each his own, and I hope the Army policy changes so I can put him in some day. He said he would join if he didn’t have a boyfriend he was so much in love with.
Anyway, if you don’t want to talk about your orientation, I want to talk to you about your furture…
Most of the things you have said have either made me feel sorry for recruiters and the shit they put up with. This just adds to the complete asshole image they tend to have. Good job. Do you do the same for people that say they have a medical issue that would DQ them?
Nope, and not even the same thing. A person cannot just not talk about diabetes and be accepted for enlistment. A person cannot agree to not tell their friends that they have tachycardia and be safe to go through Basic Training. However, the Army accepts homosexuals and lesbians. I have enlisted one of each. Both were candid about their orientation and I advised both of what service in the Army would be like. (Reality, IME, nobody cares.)
I would also think that the people who are gay and want to join would never play that card, so I sincerely believe that if a person tells me he is gay and would join if he was not, then that person may help change DADT. From what I have seen, a lot of Dopers disagree with that policy, so I am helping to eliminate it. I can show my higher ups that I have 10 people who would join if they could be openly gay. Trust me, these things are recorded higher up, stats compiled, and if the Army is falling behind on its mission the policy will be reconsidered.
Of course, Antinor01, if you don’t believe that gays and lesbians should serve, then I missed that part of your post and will respond to that.
Here is what it comes down to for me. I call a person once or twice because I have to. I need that person that is in my pool to call to say, “No, I am not interested in the Army.” I cannot guarantee that you will not get a call a couple months later asking you again how you are doing and if you are still not interested in the Army. If, by the second call a couple months later you still don’t want to join, let him know that. You can also request to be taken off of his calling list. You may have to call the recruiting station commander and ensure that your name is taken off the list. It will be done, but don’t go to GoArmy.com and enter your e-mail address, because we will contact you. Don’t go to military.com enter your e-mail address and phone number and then be all amazed when we call you.
Finally, if Military ain’t for you, and I know it is not for everyone. Man or Woman the fuck up and tell the caller that you are not interested. When you try to use some pat answer thinking that the Recruiter will never call you again, you are wasting his time and yours.
Play the gay card if you want to, but we can only disqualify openly gay people, and I am hoping that this discrimination becomes a thing of the past.
Except telling them you aren’t interested doesn’t get you left alone. If recruiters didn’t continue harrassing people after being told NO, these things wouldn’t happen.
When you take it on yourself to give out someones personal information (even if they were lying) to everyone that you know knows them, that makes you an asshole. The only reason to do so is that I can think of is retaliation.
Whether DADT, along with the military code that disqualifies you for being gay, should be dropped is beside the point.
Telling a Recruiter that you are not interested may get you a couple of calls a year. If that is really that big of a fucking deal, then check the box and opt out. I don’t know why people think we Recruiters have the time to waste on people who don’t want to join now. If you know someone who is being harassed, PM me the name of the caller and the zip code, and I can assure you the calls will stop. The same thing as if you called the station yourself.
I really feel bad for openly gay people that cannot enlist. I also feel that the people who cannot keep their orientation to themselves for long enough to say not interested, most of their friends and classmates should know already.
Finally, I think only an asshole would have to claim to be part of a minority that is discriminated against in order to avoid serving his or her country. Remember, we don’t have a draft going on, so a simple no, not at this time really will work.
As luc says, it’s not for you to make that call. These are teenagers we’re talking about here, and many gay teens don’t have their whole circle of family and friends clued in on their orientation. And yes, I can imagine that there may be plenty of gay teens who are willing to be frank about their orientation when speaking to a recruiter who’s a total stranger, but who hide it from some of their friends and family.
I earnestly and respectfully implore you to stop this unwarrantable practice of intimidating, retaliatory tattling about the self-proclaimed orientation of potential recruits. I assure you that it’s bound to horrify and/or disgust many of the other potential recruits you’re tattling to. No representative of any employer should be babbling intimate personal information about one interviewee to another interviewee. That’s completely unprofessional and reflects very poorly on your organization.
“Avoid serving”? As you just said, there’s no draft. Nobody needs an excuse not to serve in the military, and nobody should be pestered with unwanted recruitment efforts after they’ve plainly said they’re not interested.
Yes, I agree that people who just barefacedly lie about their sexual orientation (or even flaunt their real sexual orientation) first crack out of the box, in order to avoid the minor hassle of saying “no thank you” to a phone solicitation, are being kind of assholish. But that’s no reason for you to be assholish in return, and I really think it’s beneath you.
I should advise, then, that he’s pretty much OK, now. He was a junkie, a biker and a petty thief, but some guys from the Viet Nam Veterans Against the War pulled him into their orbit, and helped him. And may the Goddess bless them and hold them close to Her bountiful bosom all the days of their lives…
You seem to think that gay teens cannot join. They can. You seem to believe that homosexuals who have not identified themselves as homosexuals cannot join, that is also incorrect. I advise any applicant who states he/she would not join if it was not for their orientation that the Army will accept him/her if they do not violate DADT, because I believe that anyone who wants to serve should be allowed to. The common answer I get when I hear this is, “I am proud to be gay, and I would have to tell.” If the applicant has to tell, then who is he hiding it from? Those that can understand DADT and still want to enlist, as I have said before, I will do all I can to get into the Army. Those that want to serve, but cannot refrain from being identified as gay before they can be identified as Soldier, should have told the family already.
I’m very glad to hear that, luci. Now, as to the issue of you not knowing who not to forgive, I hope the Goddess heals you of the need to hold onto that iniquity. In the long run, it will be healthier for you, and I’m sure you have inner resources to keep your fighting spirit going without the engine of that bitterness.
Don’t have a problem with that. Have a problem with you taking it upon yourself to out the kid to others. If it were my son or daughter, I would have a *big *problem with that. Probably would do my level best to make it your problem as well. That is, most definitely, out of bounds. No question.