Would you get over yourself already, or do you need a stepladder? Your condescending, Dittohead ravings are getting old. You generalize what “liberals” do, and when called on for a cite, you back-pedal and weasel, as when we asked you about how the press treated Reagan and your only evidence was what you remembered hearing in the sixties.
Look-I get it. You’re a conservative. That’s fine. I’m a liberal. That’s fine too. I know many people on this board who consider themselves conservative, whom I also consider very good friends, even though I don’t agree with them, and we agree to disagree, even though we continue to debate.
In said thread, you claim to have “liberal ideals”, but say that the liberals cannot correctly implement them. Yeah, okay. Sure. And Pinochet was misunderstood, right?
And then he goes on to state that he only murdered
You’ve already compared flag burners to Nazis, called Hilary and Bill Clinton communists and McCarthys of the left. Can I just say, that as far as credibility and common sense-You are the weakest FUCKING link!
awww Guin don’t be so hard on yourself, after all with our liberal lack of a worldly viewpoint, it’s easy for us to get confused.
I know you butted heads with him on the Pinochet thread, but in this thread a few months ago, we went round and round about the Matthew Shepard case, where he made claims specifically about MS, they were demonstrated to be wrong (based on his misremembering and misinterpreting what was in an op ed piece and was never offered up as data in the first place). Even after that, he still felt that his original premise was correct.
I’ve learned to ask for cites, but to be prepared for links to amazon.com’s sale of a book by a columnist, or his ‘I remember hearing’.
If I recall correctly, he also is the poster who claimed that Clinton’s name was never made fun of (a la ‘shrub’). when I posted “Billery” he said he’d never heard of it and was certain that it wasn’t main stream. I then posted where a cite mainlining the term was showcased on Rush Limbaugh’s web site as a ‘favored link’ for a year, and he didn’t feel that was evidence that it was mainstream.
oops. it was Gingrich, not Bush, and specifically 'no one’s made fun of Hillary’s name" here where apparently a link on Limbaugh’s web site is considered by him to be an ‘obscure’ one.
For myself, I am on the conservative wing of the extreme Left. I know a Trotskyist from a Stakhanovite, I know my ass from a hole in the ground, I know you can lead a horse to water but if you hold his head under for too long, you can’t ride him back.
I also know how the world works. That is precisely what pisses me off so much.
For the first time in human history, it is possible. It can be done. Every child fed, with books and pencils and schools. No father deciding which child to buy shoes for, no mother watching her cherished sons go off to kill an equally miserable neighbor. It can be done, we lack only the will. If we have to dismantle all our cars and ride bicycles, if we never see another golden arch or Starbucks, or another mega-buck Hollywood spectacular, so be it.
And God? His only demand is that we care for his children, if we fail in that, our other petty virtues are just so much dust. And if this isn’t true, then to Hell with Him too!
Am I wild eyed and idealistic, and december hard nosed and realistic. If I’m totally honest, I’ll have to admit I don’t know, not for certain. But I am damn sure ain’t gonna take his word for it!
If you didn’t post in december’s pet thread, you have no right to complain about racism, because you’re not doing anything to improve inner-city education.
If you are actually teaching minority students in an inner-city school, but are not teaching “advanced calculus, Shakespeare, nuclear physics, and organic chemistry”, then you still don’t have a right to complain about racism, because you’re not doing anything to improve inner-city education.
If you think Bababooey is a racist, you’re a racial McCarthyist.
If you privately think Bababooey might hold views which are racist, but are withholding judgment until you get to know him better, you’re a racial McCarthyist.
December extensively quotes me out of context in an effort to paint me as a “racial McCarthyist,” and even quoted blatantly out of context he can’t make the quotes support his point.
December in the very same post admits that some of his quotes have nothing to do with race or racism.
As I conclude in my last post to december:
“Could it be that not only do you feel that it is invalid for people to seek legal remedies for racism, not only do you feel that it is inappropriate for us to openly discuss racism, but also you feel that we have no right to even think about racism? Because that’s all I’ve done- I have thought that it is possible that BBB might be racist, and you have accused me of being a racial McCarthyist.”
Well, he’s generally light-hearted about most of the things he posts about. Sure, he has the whole liberal-bashing shtick, but (from my perspective) he always seems to be coming off as if he’s not very serious about some of the things he writes (like the aforementioned comment about his wife, daughters, etc. not understanding how the world works). Sure, if you want to take offense with his comments, go right ahead… but taking offense is, as always, purely optional.
I said Hillary (not Bill) had a nickname of “the communist” when she was in school. A friend of mine who knew her then told me this, and he’s a supporter of the Clintons.
That’s a fact. I agree with Guin that it’s an uncomfortable one, because it smacks of McCarthyism.
I got a nice chuckle from december in the By Rush’s Ears thread, in which we learned (from Sam Stone):
Yet here’s december with the very first reply to the OP:
Which might have had some sliver of relevance if the OP had even mentioned race. If you’re going to set up straw men, you should at least make some effort to make them look like your target.
Whoa-I thought I was going to be blasted.
No, he’s not gonna change. But I need to vent, and maybe this will make him think.
Spoofe again, I’m tired of the, “he doesn’t mean it like THAT!” I don’t know how he ‘means’ it. What matters is how we can conclude that from his posts. I can’t. I see someone who makes questionable statements in Great Debates and can’t or won’t back them up. If it were the Pit, or MPSIMS, I wouldn’t mind so much. But here, he constantly says these things, as facts, and then, even when proved wrong, simply cries the martyr, or those “damn liberals” again.
Perhaps in the past I have made sweeping generalizations about conservatives-but I know better now. I know all conservatives are not Limbaughs, just as not all liberals are Rosie O’Donells. I TRY not to make generalizations, and while I admit to going off on certain topics emotionally-ie, the School of the Americas thread, I still think I at least don’t say, “well, all you conservatives, typical Republican…blah blah blah…Bush and Reagan are fascists, Trent Lott is a druggy, blah blah blah, Ashcroft blows goats”. And there are a great many conservatives on this board that, while I STRONGLY disagree with them, I also have great respect for them and enjoy talking with them, such as Fenrish, John Corrado or erislover. (Admittedly an Ayn Rand fan, but still).
For what it is worth, I entirely see your point. Frankly I see december as the mirror image of stoid. Both are yapping ideologues incapable of factual argumentation, either by nature or natural endowement. Neither seems to be able to question sources except to the degree to which the source conflicts with their own-prepackaged ideologically driven stance.
Pity. I have little use for either.
(now the question is, am I a conservative, a liberal or something else?)
That’s exactly what I was thinking-he’s the Stoid of the right. But I didn’t want to start on her-I really don’t like Stoid, so I don’t want to get into that, because I can’t be objective.
Well, thanks, I think.
Actually, I’m more obsessed with European royalty-Russian and Serbian, to be exact. But it just doesn’t come up very often around here, I’m afraid.
I don’t intend to argue everything that december has said (or anything he’s ever said, for that matter). But I do wish to say, FTR, that in having participated in many threads along with him, I have not found him to be an “ignorant slut” - the opposite, in fact. And his debating style is not at all out of the bounds of what is found on these boards. Seems to me that this thread is just a bunch of liberal piling on a conservative. Be strong, brother!
(Actually I for a while suspected that december was actually a sock-puppet for IzzyR, due to many identical biographical details (both are conservative Jewish actuaries from NJ). But on discovering that december is in fact an atheist I was forced to abandon that theory :D)
