Disrespect and losing your best friends.

I’ve tried to talk to her, I called her and left a message on her answering machine. Nothing fancy, just “Hey Danny, it’s Adam… Call me back if you want.” She hasn’t called back. I even left a message on her ICQ just telling her that I really treasure her and I seriously don’t know what I did. It was then she told me that I had massively disrespected her and she didn’t want to talk to me or see me.

coughs again

By Danny I mean Jane and by Adam I mean Speaker.

Could you please change that?

Speaker, I agree wwith more or less everything that has been said here: she’s playing a game, and it’s horribly, horribly immature. Here is some food for thought:

If you play along with her, you will repeat this game over and over again for the entire lengh of your association with her.

The only hope you have for a mature, adult relationship with this girl–romantic or platonic–is to simply refuse to play. You cannot, cannot, cannot play and win. Won’t happen. This game is more rigged than an Eastern Block election. She is making up rules about who gets to decide what is right and wrong in the relationship, but it only works if you swallow her bluff and follow along when she just assumes that she gets to be the one who decides what is respect and disrespect and what you “should” know.

If you want, you can call her one more time and say “Jane, I feel like there is some bizarre headgame going on. I hope we can discuss this matter as two adults, but I am not going to play absurd guessing games.”

After you say that, you cannot, under any circumstances, initiate contact with her: the ball is in her court. This is hard, but you have to have faith. If she does not care enough for you to seek you out after this, better to find out now.

Think for a momment: if your best friend insulted you would you ever, under any circumstancres, treat them as she has treated you? Would you refuse to give them an explaination?

Lastly, quit with the dire predictions. Stop trying to second guess “what she wants” or “what she feels” or “what she is going to do next”–you don’t know her well enough to do that. Hell, at you all’s age, she barely knows what she wants or what she feels, so it’s really arrogant of you to think that you do. It’s up to her to tell you what’s going on. Let her do that.

I am an idiot.

No, Speaker, you’re not an idiot. I’ve read enough of your other messages here to know better than that.
What you are, by your own admission in this thread and others, is in love with Jane, a girl that you think is “too much for you.” Love is a tough game under any circumstances, and your circumstance is about as tough as they come.
You’ve received some great advice from others in this thread. Expressing some of the same thoughts in a slightly different way: I believe you are going to have to take some action that shows Jane that you are to be respected as much as she is, and that you won’t be kicked around. Call her once more, request that she explain what you did wrong, and then leave it up to her to make the next move. If she wants you, she’ll move your way.
Good luck!

There’s a group dynamic that often exists when there are three people involved. It goes something like this:

The three involved do not know they are part of an endless loop surrounding: Victim, Persecutor and Support. They needn’t all be friends but all three spend time together (ie work, school etc).

1 victim, 2 persecutor, 3 support:
Person 1 feels person 2 is making their life hell, often via projecting and personifying their own problems onto 2 - person 3 supports person 1.

Often person 1 and 2 will resolve their differences, it’s then that everyone’s role switches:

Person 1 doesn’t need 3’s support any longer, 3 then complains to 2 that they are being rejected by 1. 3 then supports 2 so we end up with: 2 victim, 1 persecutor, 3 support.

This is very simplifyed - an example is that victim is from a single parent family, where absent parent represents ‘persecutor’ and remaining parent and offspring switch support/victim roles.

Perhaps something in Danny’s life has changed/been resolved that you’d previously supported - now there is a void where a persecutor was and she’s decided to be offended (subconsciously, obviously) by something you’ve said.

There will be someone else, a girlfriend of hers or yours that fills the third place in the triangle, perhaps that person is siding with her, agreeing with her that you’re evil.
You now have: Speaker - persecutor, Danny (or Jane) - victim, third person - support.

Sadly, if this scenario is likely then it’s hard to get out without ending up as the evil persecutor (for not supporting the victim usually) and losing the friends. Making them aware of this model won’t help either as most people hate to be pigeon-holed, especially psychologically.

Good advice throughout. Let me just add that if you choose to play the headgames, you will lose. Whatever you did, real or perceived, intentional or not, there is no reason for Jane to freeze you out like this. Mature people don’t do that as a way to resolve differences, they confront them, discuss them, work them out, and resolve to do better in the future.

The real point is that you are being manipulated. You are supposed to go begging, to agonize, to plead, and to suffer. It puts her in the driver’s seat and makes you dance like a puppet. Not a healthy thing. (Let me add that, while this case is a female manipulating a male, it goes both ways. This is not a female-bashing post)

I agree with those who say that you need to place it in front of her that you don’t understand what you said or did, but you would like to know so you can work it out, then step back and let her make the next move. And, as difficult as it may be to accept, live with the consequences.

Painful as it may be losing a friend (or lover) is ultimately better than being jerked around by someone.

No, I seriously am an idiot. I made one bad choice and it’s lost me the trust of my best friend - something that few people have ever gained…

Speaker, unless you slept with her mother or told her worse enemy that she blew the football team, she’s overreacting.

You need to go do some excruciatingly diffucult physical labor for a couple days and see if that dosen’t clear your head. Go plant a garden or repaint your house or (if it’s like mine) shovel out your room.

Is it maybe, just maybe, just quite possibly an option to consider that this “friend” (and I use the word loosely) also made/is making a bad choice?

Relationships work both ways. You can give and give and give and want like bloody hell to have it work, but if the other person isn’t willing to give and want, and even accept what you’re offering, then it’s hopeless.

Quite beating yourself up over this. Do what you can do to mend this particular fence, and then LEAVE IT UP TO HER.

It’s starting to sound as if she’s not even worth the effort, if she’s going to let you twist in the wind like this. Some friend.


You don’t what you “did”, so how can you know if it was a bad choice?

Also, I really get irritated by this sentiment. It’s a made up piece on nonsense that comes from the mindset that something has to be rare to be valuable. Friendship and trust are not rare: there are millions nad millions nad millions of strong, trusting friendships in any good-sized city. However, friendships are still very valuable things. But don’t think that your “one chance for happiness” comes along at 18. Livfe gives us plenty of chances for happiness, and while no two are quite the same, they all have their strong points.

There’s also a certain competitive edge to that sentiment that bugs me: a relationships value comes from the fact that it is something that most people “have never known.” That comes from a sort of egocentric arrogance that dosen’t want to shre the emotions we feel with anyone else, the belief that common emotions–emotions that that asshole don’t the street or that idiot in the grocery store might feel–can’t be stong, and deep, and worthwhile.

For her to be able to jettison the friendship just because of one mistake tells me that maybe she isn’t the person you thought her to be. Friendship is a two way street, both people take and give. You may have made a mistake but from the information presented here, I’m not sure that you did. At best what you did was an extremely minor faux pas.

This really wasn’t your fault, and maybe this is all for the best. In the years to come you will see that she is being incredibly immature and stupid.

Best of Luck

This really wasn’t your fault, and maybe this is all for the best. In the years to come you will see that she is being incredibly immature and stupid.

Call me a horrid untrusting wench, but that’s an awfully big assumption when the OP apparently now KNOWS what he did wrong, but none of us do.

Yes, you are being an idiot. But not because of whatever it is she decided to be pissed off about.

You are being an idiot because this person is treating you like shit and you are taking it.

And many people in this thread, with many more years of experience in dealing with other people have told you that.

This girl may be your best friend, but you are not hers. From the way she is treating you now, and the way I have heard you talk about her treatment of you in the past, she considers you a tool to be used when she needs one, and a toy to play with when she’s bored.

Wrong, wrong and wrong again. First of all, this is a game called “One strike you’re out.” Friends don’t play it, but users do.

Secondly, many, many people have best friends, and trust is an integral part of that relationship. And true best friends don’t play “One strike, you’re out”

Finally, flapcats has a point about what is called a “drama triangle”. And you don’t need three people to play it, one is adequate. And you are doing it to yourself right now.

You can read about the drama triangle here: http://www.whitesoftheirlies.com/articles/triangle/2.htm

But here is a relevant section:

Sound familiar?

Sadly, I know this girl is going to end up breaking your heart. I can tell from seeing past threads about your relationship, that she is treating you badly and you are allowing it to happen, and you are going to have to learn that this is wrong the hard way. Until you realize that you deserve to be treated better, and to accept no less, you will continue to be victimized.

I predict that she will end up in a bad relationship with someone who treats her worse than she treats you. I hope that when that day comes, you remember what we have said here today, and realize that she is trapped in a drama triangle; and that there is a way out for you if you want to find it.

I qualified it in the previous paragraph by stating that from the information that he presented it did not seem that he had done anything wrong. Unless he did something truly horrible like sleeping with her friend or something of that nature or punching her out, it just doesn’t seem that what he did was that bad.

Hamadryad :

I don’t care if he raped her kitten: no behavoir on his part would justify her playing the “I can’t believe you did that awful thing but I am not going to tell you what it is” game. This is not how adults, or people who wished to be seen and treated as adults, behave.

Sure, maybe he did something so terrible, so unbelivable that the “one strike” rule should apply: but even if he has (which I doubt) that has nothing to do with the sheer immaturity of her behavoir. He may or may not have been acting like a friend–we don’t know. But if she played the “guess why I’m mad” game in any form or fashoin, she certainly hasn’t been acting like a friend.
Speaker, think of the happiest adult relationship you know well: now try and imagene one of those people behaving as this girl is. It would seem pretty ridiculous, no?

This is why a worldwide policy of Sheer Bluntness would solve SOOO many issues.

Speak your mind, be truthful.



“…no behavoir on his part would justify her playing the ‘I can’t believe you did that awful thing but I am not going to tell you what it is’ game.”

I know. I’m just saying that telling this guy, “Oh, we know you didn’t do anything that horrible, you’re an innocent in this horrid, horrid game” is awfully naive and possibly premature. That’s all.

Hear, hear! What they all said.

Listen to 'em Speaker, and wash out that “one true friend” bullshit. That’s for 18-year-olds coughcoughlikeioncewascoughcough

There’s plenty of people in the world to hook up with. Find them, and this will be just a bad memory.

Can’t you tell I’m a dad? :smiley: