The only thing that is unrealistic about your conception of dating is that you expect other people to share it. As you have discovered, many people feel differently.
We’ve discussed this general topic before in different contexts. And the consensus seems to be “communication is key.” If this is how you want to conduct your personal relationships, then that’s fine. But do be sure you discuss it with whoever you’re dating early on. You can never assume that anyone else has the same ideas of when (or if) a relationship becomes “exclusive.” And you can’t assume that anyone else thinks that a “relationship” is in contemplation of marriage. Someone may like you as a boyfriend, but have no intention of marrying you. So it’s best to clear that up.
I disagree with your mom, though. You don’t become exclusive when there’s a ring on your finger. You become exclusive when and if you and your partner decide to become exclusive. I think it’s really shitty when people are like “oh, we’re not actually married yet so it’s not cheating,” when it clearly is cheating because they’ve agreed to be exclusive to their boy/girlfriend!
Furthermore, even if a relationship is sexually exclusive, that also doesn’t necessarily mean that you “have to abandon all interest in cute and interesting people.” And I’m not talking about polyamory. I’m saying that in many traditional couples, some mild flirting is allowed and expected. I personally consider it healthy. YMMV. Best to clarify things.
And remember that what you define as a “failed relationship” might be a “great relationship that came to a natural end” to someone else. Not everyone is seeking marriage.
Anyway, good luck to you and enjoy your twelve night stands! (I think I’m going to adopt that terminology!)
Mild flirting? Hell yeah. You can’t take that away from me. But I treat any of that like maybe a particularly hot waitress I have or somesuch. It’s fun for a minute, but it’s not a serious consideration. The only thing that will make me decide if I want to leave someone is if I am happy with her. Nobody else has input on that.
Depends on how and why it ended I suppose. A relationship where the two people have grown appart and don’t share the same interests anymore has come to a natural end. A relationship that has ended because one person is incapable of maintaining it due to some character flaw has failed.
msmith, I’m not really understanding your problem here. You understand the difference between “cheating” (which I think we can agree is a character flaw) and “not being monogamous”, right? Because they’re not the same thing.
I just wanted to drop back in to say I do agree with this to a certain extent - just because you can’t assume that someone wants to be exclusive, doesn’t mean you can assume they don’t, either.
If I had dating to do over again, I’d like to think I’d approach it with a perspective a lot more like yours, Influential Panda. In my youth, I considered dating as an opportunity to get to know a wide variety of guys, the vast majority of whom, in retrospect, were pretty obviously not compatible with me on a long-term basis. We were often the kind of couples the “Love Cop” on the cartoon strip Sylvia tries to break up. I approached dating like a buffet, where I really should sample a little of everything, even the weird stuff.
In my early 20s I became a Christian. Not a dramatically evangelical type, mainstream Protestant. The Christian approach to dating is generally that you should treat dating as a search for your marriage partner and, if you realize the person you’re dating is not the one, should take the relationship back to the just friends level. This is out of respect for yourself and your partner. I don’t think a person needs to buy into all aspects of Christianity to see this as a respectful approach to dating for someone whose ultimate goal is marriage. If your goal is marriage, you owe it to yourself to pursue that goal. It also isn’t respectful to someone else to date them once you’ve identified a dealbreaker that means you’ve got your eyes open for a better opportunity with someone else.
It sounded ideal to me at the time, but in retrospect it was like a frog-kissing contest.
It would have worked out a lot better to get to know that broad swath of humanity as friends, but realize that for a certain level of relationship I was only interested in that subsection of the population that shared some of my core values.
Like everyone else has said, you’re idea of dating is just fine for you; just make sure you find someone who shares it. Your mother and her friends have their own ideas that may (or may not) be right for them; don’t allow their ideas to make you feel like yours is wrong. Yours actually sounds more mature than theirs.
Influential Panda, your idea of dating sounds pretty similar to my own. Monogamy comes very easy to me. I’m a one-man kind of woman and have never played the field much. As long as you’re honest and upfront about what you want in terms of exclusivity, it doesn’t seem like a problem. Not everyone is going to share your view and that’s cool, but I’d recommend keeping those folks as friends rather than contemplating them as romantic partners.
I am seriously appalled at the casualness so many here are evincing.
I am by no means a prude. One night stands are great in my book. Booty-calls are fine in my book and so on.
But if I am dating someone in a serious fashion then they had better damn well not go on dates with other guys (nor would I go on dates with other women). Kissing other guys, except a chaste kiss on the cheek to an old friend, is likewise not cool.
We may not be married but presumably I am viewing her as marriage material and if you think I will view any woman as marriage material who would do such things to me you have another thing coming. I am astounded anyone would.
If you want to play the field then play the field and avoid committed relationships. What the hell is the point of a committed relationship is you aren’t, you know, committed! If you are in a committed relationship and see another guy/girl who grabs your interest more then man/woman-up and have the guts to end your current relationship before pursuing another.
Funny thing is with people I have known who are more casual about it tend to think what is good for the goose is not good for the gander. When they do it there is no big deal, no worries. When their SO does it they all of a sudden take a very dim view of it all. Oddly they never seem to recognize their own inconsistency.
Note: All the above goes out the window when you are in high school.
I knew a number of people who had this exact experience:
They meet someone in their teens or early 20s who they feel quite passionate about but don’t get together with. (If they do get together, it is brief and disastrous.) Both parties go their separate ways, and date casually but don’t have any successful long-term relationships. Then they reconnect in their 30s, fall head over heels in love, and immediately settle into the best, most stable long-term relationship they have ever experienced. This exact pattern has happened to three different close friends of mine (six people altogether).
This is the kicker for me: They all say that if they had tried to seriously date the first time they had met their partner, it would have been a total trainwreck, and would have killed all potential for their future.
This is not unusual: most people I know are nowhere near ready to get married until they have had at least one serious relationship, usually lots more. And if you’re not ready to get married, then you’re not ready to meet the person you might be meant to marry. I know that I’m a much better partner because of my past failed relationships: they taught me a lot about what I want, what I need, what I can expect, etc.
I don’t regret any of my past relationships (well … maybe one or two …), even the total failures. In retrospect, I consider them a sort of practice. “Fear of failure” is not a good reason on its own to deny yourself a relationship.
I’m saddened by the number of people I know who married their first love, and then get bored and frustrated in their 30s or 40s and do something stupid to wreck their relationship. Usually this involves sowing wild oats that they feel they didn’t have the opportunity to properly sow before they settled down.
But that’s kind of the point. What are you going to define as ‘dating in a serious fashion’? Does it line up with the view of the person you are dating? Have you established that this is an exclusive relationship?
My basic point is simply that your viewpoint is as valid as anyone else’s and if it is what works for you than go with it. Just be certain that the person you are dating views it the same way.
At what point does it become a committed relationship?
I’m not against ‘playing the field,’ but honestly, I am so anti-social I can’t imagine myself seeing Bill on Wednesday and Ted on Thursday, at least not without them knowing about one another. It’s all so very Archie comic, which is odd, because it’s often portrayed as something modern and morally inferior. Though I guess sex may have something to do with it…
I have a couple of friends who did this - actively dated two or three guys at once (all were in the know) and saw each once a week. They said it was like a part-time job. I can imagine.
If there’s anything that I think this thread has shown, I think it’s that there are many views on what is considered acceptable behavior when dating, and you should set those ground rules early.
You’ve wisely stated that her concept of how things should be makes you feel like she’s keeping her options open, and she probably is. You can’t change her worldview, but you do have control over yourself. It’s your decision to make whether or not this is a dealbreaker for you as a couple or whether it’s something you can deal with. If it’s not, don’t worry, someone else will come along that shares your perspective.
I wonder if those same women would be cool with dating a guy who had one or two other girlfriends as well.
If they are all cool with it and on the same page then fine although frankly it sounds more to me like what you get just having a bunch of friends (although I suppose this way they get their dinners paid for). If it is about the sex just have some booty-calls handy in your little black book.
Guess so. Not in a million years did I ever think anyone could say they had their tongue in another guy’s mouth and not consider it making out or evince surprise that it would upset their SO standing there and looking on.
I mean seriously…what planet are these people from? :rolleyes:
Some people don’t work on the same definitions as other people (let’s have another discussion on ‘this Friday’ vs. ‘next Friday’, for example). I have a different definition of mild flirting than my husband, because I grew up with a social group in which casual touching, hugging, and cuddling, were standard between friends. My husband grew up with a social group in which the above behaviours happened only between people who were in an intimate relationship. I don’t consider these things flirting, he does. Carry this example to a more extreme point and you end with WhyNot’s situation.
Every relationship has rules. Please don’t look down on us because we use a different ruleset from yours.