No, it’s the Lower Algonquin Round Table³.
Thie SDMB is three blocks over and in another dimension.
And their Pit is much warmer.
START - I may have missed it, but have you taken the oft-given advice and sincerely apologized to her now? If so, what was her response? If not, why not?
StG
Just to be clear here; all you said was “sorry”? If so you’re weaseling out of doing the right thing again. Do not take the fact that you can’t make it perfect be your excuse not to give a sincere, meaningful apology. “Sorry” is not an apology, it’s a couple of worthless syllables grunted by a callow, shallow cretin. “I said and did many hurtful things to you in the past and I regret that I did them and that they caused you pain. I was wrong and I apologize,” is an apology. You might even throw in something about how you’re going to try not to do things like that again and you hope she can someday forgive you.
There is no magic fairy that sprinkles sparkle dust on you and poof! you’re an adult. You are an adult when you act like one and here’s your chance to practice being a man. Do what you have to do, whether you like it or not.
Let me add my voice to those saying make a sincere apology, tell her what you’re apologizing for (“I was an asshole, I hurt you badly, and for that I am truly sorry.”), own your past behaviour, and then leave it alone.
I also agree with those saying that you don’t have to take shit from her, or anyone else, either. You have boundaries just like anyone else; she’s obviously stepping all over those boundaries, and your past with her doesn’t change that. You’ve said that you aren’t planning to fight with her, and that’s good - you do have the right to not take abuse from her. If she is treating you badly, excuse yourself and leave. If she can’t be around you without treating you badly, don’t be around her. It’s not good for either of you.
Well of course you’re willing to let bygones be bygones.
For much the same reason that people being convicted of crimes are remorseful.
Your transgressions have caught up with you and now you’re facing not only the prospect of getting as good as you gave; but looking in the mirror and not liking what you see.
It IS up to her how much crap that she can dish out.
But it’s up to you how much you take.
You’ve ALREADY apologized once… and she got burned by buying into it.
Once bitten; twice shy.
If you feel strongly about it, apologize sincerely. Then avoid interations with her.
And THEN let your actions TOWARD OTHERS speak to your newfound nice-guy-ness.
Keep in mind, she’s grown too! It might just be that she’s into mixed martial-arts training.
What was once a slap across the face might turn into a punch in the solar plexus.
Exactly how old is START?(Sorry if I missed it)
I cant say I have read alot of your threads,
However I can say that alot of whats being posted in this one are a bit misguided, I work with 15 year olds. some of these kids are on the BALL at that age, more organised and more ready for life than I am. others are still figuring out the basics, stuff that most kids learn by 12 or so…
your’re young and whatever anyone says in here its pretty obvious that you ARE trying, trying to better yourself, trying to become the young adult you will quickly be.
its a bit hard to empathise due to the age difference and the fact that I am usually only an ass to people who ask for or deserve it in the first place but heres a thought.
tell her how you feel, tell her how you regret who you were, tell her you dont expect her forgiveness, then tell her to go to town. ask her to hit you with every single drop of venom she can summon, in public if thats where you happen to be when you appologise. if pouring her anger and hate onto you is helping her then theres no real hurt in her words for you.
its hard to explain to the young (or for that matter the old/kinda young/whoever) another persons opinion of you and its effect on you is a REFLECTION of your opinion of that person. see her and her hurt for what it is and it will hurt you alot less. show her your willingness to let her have her say and it will probably change her mind, even if only to swing her to a more neutral attitude.
You don’t need to take shit from anybody. If she persists in being a raging cuntrag, tell her how much she reminds you of yourself from a few years back.
:smack: Okay, he’s 15.
In response to some posters: People comment on being a good Christian, because START has told us in previous threads that he is a Christian.
-Tikster
Now you’re getting it! Applause! When you apologize, tell her just this: “I know I ruined most of Junior High for you and I can’t give it back. I was wrong. I have learned better and I am trying to reform.”
Back in Junior High, when you apologized and went back to your old ways, it taught her not to trust you. In my case, too, there were people who’d convince me to trust them more than once before going back to making fun of me when their friends were around. I learned quickly not to trust people, but my best friend got burned that way several times. People would change depending on the company they’re with. It may not just have been you teaching her those lessons and they last a long time.
As for the nasty comments she made, and they were very nasty; I admit that; think about them in terms of what you called her and what’s said to other unpopular kids in your school. When I was young, beinc called a “virgin” was an insult because it implied no one would ever like you or want to have sex with you. This was in a prudish small town in the 1970’s (I swear the town was stuck in the 1950’s!), so we didn’t have the range of invective available to kids today. I vaguely remember other, worse, insults about my sex habits. Since I was a consummate prude, those really rankled.
Here’s one other thing to consider. How do you act when you’re around kids other than your step-brother’s crowd? If you’re saying one thing and acting one way around them and another, crueler way around the kids at school or when you’re hanging out, and Laura’s aware of it, that’s one less reason for her to believe you. Remember, she saw you be nice to you one-on-one and cruel to her when others were around. I knew kids who did that to me in high school. I didn’t consider them my friends.
You are indeed STARTing. I wish you luck.
CJ
Because, as I said, he is still an attention whore. That was the reason for his bulling and that is the reason for his posting. That’s his reason for putting his picture on ‘Hot or Not’ and that is why he linked to his photo there here on the boards. He seems to have this constant need for people to love him. He expects this girl, who by his own admission he ‘ruined her life’ to now love him.
Lets look at his post here.
This is the 63 post in this thread and START breaks everbody down into two groups.
Those that hate him and those that love him. He has picked the two most extreme comments on the ends of the spectrum because that how his mind is working. That is how teenagers minds work. He see this issue, the board, and basically the world in a black and white mentality. You’re either with me or against me. I’m either your favortie poster and you treasure me or you hate my guts.
Read the thread up to this post. It’s not like that at all. Yes, people have given him harsh critizism but you know what? The people who treat you nice aren’t always your friend and the people who yell at you are sometimes your best friend.
In short brownie55, I’m not reading his mind. I’m reading his posts.
Where the hell do you get this? Where does he say that he expects her to love him? START has repeatedly stated that he doesn’t expect her forgiveness nor does he expect her to like him.
You seem to be holding him to standards that are usually reserved for adults who have their shit together, not teenagers who don’t. START’s not an adult.
and START is the one who needs to realize this.
Comments like “Oh START, you are so much deeper than most people because you’ve thought about your actions.” are IMHO not what he needs to hear.
Did you read the OP. Sure he is all I was terrible but I said I was sorry! Shouldn’t she forgive me?
He EXPECTS her to forgive and forget. That is the theme of his OP. I, and many other dopers, are simply pointing out that he shouldn’t expect forgivness.
And read the OP again. He acts suprised to run into her. Then he points that she is closely connected to his step-brother. This sounds like ti shouldn’t have been a suprise. He also admits that he see her quite frequently. Not a suprise, I can’t believe who I ran into sort of thing as described in the OP.
He is not telling us the whole story. We only have his point of view of this. And by his posts, IMHO he isn’t sorry at all.
She said something really mean about his dead brother. That hurt him tremendously. He does have enough sense to realize that he was mean to her in the past and that his past behavior maybe somehow linked to her behavior now. But he thinks she went too far with her comments. (I do too but she is a teen and I don’t know if she has any class at all to begin with) This is why he started the thread although it isn’t in the OP at all. START isn’t a deep boy in touch with his and other feelings. He is just an average teen. Someone said something mean to him and he is here to complain about it. That is fine. But his, posters think I’m scum or they love me, view of this thread is completly wrong.
Personally, I think he is an average kid. The death of his brother is something he is still dealing with and someone crossed a line there and he doesn’t know what to do. What she said was inappropriate but he doesn’t know how to deal with it and the fact that he made her life hell previously fills him with guilt.
He should have said to her, “look, if you want to make fun of me, I understand, but leave my dead brother out of it.” If she persists he should talk to his parents and her parents. I’m sure they would set this girl straight.
I hope START gets things straightened out with this girl. I hope she realizes that what she said was wrong. (and that curses don’t work) I hope she realizes that she is going to have to learn to live with START and the two of them and draw boundries that they respect. But since they are both teens this is going to be hard without some adult help. Adults on the scene, that can deal with both of them.
Well, hopefully START will apologize to that kid & get crossed off the “To be shot” list right before the kid puts on his lipstick.*
- I hate to feel the need to explain this but “Billy Madison” reference.
Sigh.
I can totally see where Laura is coming from. What seems like aeons ago, I was her. When I was in 6th grade, there was this one boy, Joseph. He was a good-looking boy, but he was terribly cruel to me without any provocation. He shoved me, punched me, hit me, forced me to walk through thigh-high stinging nettles from which my legs still bear scars, and called me lovely names like “fat bitch” and “ugly cow”.
That was 15 years ago. I have no idea what he’s like now; he may have regretted everything he did to me, or he might be the same old cowardly, sadistic bastard he was then. I don’t know. But I’ll tell you this. When I think of him, I think of the worst times of my life, I think of humiliation, pain, and fear. And the old hatred comes back. I hate him more than you can imagine.
Now if one day I suddenly received a letter or phone call from him saying he was sorry for what he did in the past, and I knew he was sincerely regretful, I would forgive him.
Maybe, START, if you write a letter or give her a call - explaining your feelings just as you did in your OP - she might forgive you. It’s worth a try.
I would disagree with that but YMMV.
Of course it’s not “okay” that she is making mean hurtful comments to him. It’s no more right than when he did it. But it happens: treat people like shit and they might just do the same to you in return, so keep that in mind when you are tormenting them. START seems kind of surprised that Laura would now be doing the same to him that he did to her - sort of, “How could someone be so mean???” He should look in the mirror and see how.
I do believe he has changed for the better and probably regrets, in some manner, what he did. But to expect that she should forgive and forget is not realistic. And further, he feels that she better not keep it up since he has so much more experience being a dick, he will mow her down again if she doesn’t stop. That is not the way to deal with the situation.
We’re dogpiling on START, here.
Give him a little slack.
He is a kid, after all, and some of us are getting very intense, more than the subject validates.
How many of you could hold your youth up to a microscope, & still seem simon-pure? :dubious:
I think START is still at that stage when we think appologies make everything better, and that once a person states, ‘But I’m changing!’ everything is better in an instant.
Now, he’s learning the hard way that trust is something that can’t always heal over night-or maybe never at all. That sucks for him, but that’s part of life. No, Laura isn’t in the right either, but one can hardly blame her.