I mean “hear about you boyfriend”, not “here”.
I agree that in your home, what you say goes. But in someone else’s home, it’s his or her call (not just about the things you mentioned - guests are always free to leave). What I can’t believe was that you “caused a scene” during someone’s acid trip and YOU aren’t having flashbacks (joke).
I have two toddlers myself, and while I’d like to believe they’ll never try the things I have tried, I know that realistically, it’s not probable. My mom is about as pure as they come, and my sister and I indulged, indulged, indulged. I just hope that my kids will grow out of whatever phases they grow into.
[[Ok, first of all, let me say that I don’t care whether pot or alcohol or even cigarettes are legal or not. I don’t care, I don’t care, I don’t care.
I do not indulge. It’s my choice, and nobody has ever questioned me or tried to talk me into it (except in France, they just thought I was a freak of nature.)
I do not like people to indulge around me (that is, drink alcohol or take any form of drug, even pot). I have also been known to ask someone to put out a cigarette, because, even though it doesn’t bother me, I have friends who are allergic and who don’t have the courage to ask for themselves. I am not trying to tell people what to do, but I insist that if they are going to, they must do it somewhere else.
The problem is, I feel this is my right (even if I am in someone else’s home, and it is the homeowner that is indulging – this has only come up twice, when I was staying with some friends and once they smoked hash, the other time they tripped on acid. Both times I strongly objected, and actually caused a scene. I feel that as a guest, my wishes should be respected.), and everybody else seems to feel that I am being a nuisance. ]] Cessandra
Ifr you or others are sensitive to smoke, that is one thing. Regarding everything else, though, you’re being a pain in the ass and nobody should feel much need to “respect” such patently unreasonable “feelings” in most cases.
[[I do ask close friends not to indulge in anything *illegal* even at clubs, etc, however, because I expect them to respect my feelings. Perhaps you should understand that my father was an alcoholic, a drug addict, a wife-beater, and he recently died of Tuberculosis which he contracted from sharing needles. My friends know this (I’m fairly open about it) and know that I consequently view all drugs and alcohol as forms of poison. That is why I expect them to understand my feelings and not indulge around me. They know how much it hurts me.]]
While it’s nice of your friends to cater to you, you need to remember that you’re the one with the problem, so ultimately you need to be the primary one dealing with this discomfort, since the indulgence of others is actually doing you no real harm at all.
[[ If you don’t really know me well, and you aren’t doing anything illegal, I don’t usually say anything.]]
If they don’t know you AND it’s not illegal (e.g., pot), THEN you USUALLY won’t say anything. Gee, that’s mighty white of you. <g>
ok, I get it. I’m an asshole. I’m sorry. I’ll stop.
The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation.
– Henry David Thoreau
As you may realize, you are behaving as an enabler in this situation. Tell your friend to either complain to the drinkers or not (it might help her to express her views if she knows if they get drunk at her house, any damage they do later gets her in BIG trouble) but to stop complaining to you. (Hey, as long as you’re being frank with people…)
Cassandra-
It is people like you that really tick me off. You think you’re so high and mighty and that anybody who does something you don’t like is just WRONG. Well, guess what. Some people like to drink, and some people smoke a little pot. I’m not hurting you so you need to take your prissy snobbery and just go someplace else. If you don’t like it, don’t hang around.
Woah-oh, folks. Everybody stop and take a deep breath, okay, and calm down. This is MPSIMS; I brag to all the other moderators about how nice we all are to each other heree, no controversy, etc. I never have to do any work here!
Cessandra is young (she’ll dispute that on another thread! ;)), and she is still checking out her ways of responding to things. The fact that she was aware enough to make her post and to ask if she was being a jerk is enough of a sign that she is trying to find out what’s what that we should at least cut her some slack, even when we think her approach (telling others what not to do) is wrong. And she has come out and said already that she understands that, apparently, she HAS been being a jerk. So instead of running her down and calling her names, let’s appreciate the fact that she was concerned enough to ask the question, and maybe she’s learned something here.
My dad always said you catch more flies with honey that you do with vinegar. Vinegar goes well in barbeque sauce, so if anybody has any more of it to share, please take it to the Pit.
-Melin
Board-Goddess-In-Training
You know what? I’ve changed my mind. I don’t understand how I’m being a jerk. Let’s look at this from a different angle:
Say Mary and Johhny are friends. Johnny has a habit that really bugs Mary (say it’s something trivial like popping his gum or picking his nose in public, or even cussing). Mary asks Johnny to please not do that around her, because it really bothers her; it’s her pet peeve. Johnny tells her to f*** off, and then tells all his friends how Mary’s got a stick up her @$$.
How exactly is Mary being a jerk in this situation? Oh my gawd, she asked a friend to not do something that bugged her! How awful!
This is almost the exact situation that has repeated itself several times between me and many different “friends” (the only difference being that “Johhny” was drinking or smoking out, both of which are illegal considering that all of my friends are minors.)
I have only asked my friends to respect my feelings, and the only time I threw a fit was when I had no recourse but to breathe the hash-smoke caused by supposed friends who were already complaining that I was a b**** just because I’d asked them to put it out.
Yes, I’ve asked close friends to not drink alcohol in their own homes, but these were people that I considered close friends, people I would have gladly done the same for (in fact I have several friends who do not like cussing, and I gladly watch my tongue for them, simply because I like and respect them.)
I really do not understand why this makes me an asshole.
The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation.
– Henry David Thoreau
Cessandra.
Tobacco smoke–a considerate person should put out a cigarette if you tell them it’s bothering you.
Hash smoke–Hash is not legal and if your group is busted you will be considered just as guilty as they are. If you do not like hash smoke it would be a good idea to remove yourself from that group as quickly as possible and really, really not go back.
The way i see it:
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In your own house, YOU set the rules. If you want there to be no smoking or drinking, then there will be none, and you have the right to ask people to leave if they insist on doing it. Your home is your castle.
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Conversely, in somebody ELSE’s house, THEY set the rules. If they say smoking and drinking is OK, then it is, and if you don’t like that, well, you’re free to leave if you want.
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In public places, it depends. If what somebody is doing is not causing you any harm (maybe they’re having wine with dinner), then it’s none of your business. You are free to disagree with their actions, but they’re also free to ignore your opinion on the matter. OTOH, smoking is a slightly different issue, since it can affect more than just the smoker him or herself. But, clearly there IS some precident for being able to do things that cause small amounts of harm to other people. For instance, you can drive a car, even though it contributes to air pollution and there are people who would prefer you not. So I’m not sure where the line is drawn here.
For smoking, I think a polite smoker will try not to smoke near people it bothers, and a polite non-smoker will opt to move away if that’s an option rather than ask the smoker to quit. But it’s not always an option, so in that case i tend to side with the non-smoker. But I also think it’s become “Fasionable” to bash smokers and some people go out of their way to do that even when they could easily avoid the situation.
I don’t indulge in either smoking, or alcohol, or pot, or any other harder drug, but my opinion on THAT is that people should be free to do anything that doesn’t directly harm somebody else. OTOH, I also believe people should be responsible for their own actions, so if you smoke and get lung cancer, don’t expect the public to pay for your medical bills, and if you do crack and screw up your brain, don’t expect public handouts when you can’t keep your job. But if you can use responsibly, then I don’t think it’s anyone else’s business, and I don’t think such “victimless” crimes should be illegal. I’m willing to let people fall to any depths whatsoever if it’s of their own free doing, and I don’t think anyone should ever be “protected from themselves.”
–
peas on earth
[[Say Mary and Johhny are friends. Johnny has a habit that really bugs Mary (say it’s something trivial like popping his gum or picking his nose in public, or even cussing). Mary asks Johnny to please not do that around her, because it really bothers her; it’s her pet peeve. Johnny tells her to f*** off, and then tells all his friends how Mary’s got a stick up her @$$.]] Cessandra
Or Johnny could politely explain to her why she is being unreasonable.
[[How exactly is Mary being a jerk in this situation? Oh my gawd, she asked a friend to not do something that bugged her! How awful!]]
Well, it is kind of obnoxious to be making unreasonable demands on people.
Mary and Johnny are friends. Mary has a habit of trying to control Johnny by telling him what to do, and what not to do. Johnny has repeatedly told Mary that it bothers him when she tries to control his behavior and he does not appreciate any whining and bitching in his presence.
Why won’t Mary stop trying to change Johnny?
Can’t she see that by not honoring his wishes she is disrespecting his feelings? What kind of a friend is Mary to always cause a scene when things don’t go her way?
Poor Johnny… how do we get him to realize that he should STOP HANGING AROUND WITH MARY IF HE DOESN’T LIKE BEING WITH HER!!!
Cess,
People have many facets and are always changing. If your friends smoke weed and drink all the time and this bothers you, maybe it’s time to find new friends. Were these people always your friends? Have they all changed? Or is it you that is changing? There is nothing wrong with growing away from old friends. We can’t be the same people we have always been. It is called growing up. We all do it at different rates, some people never do.
If you have a serious problem accepting the behavior of other people you CAN’T CHANGE THEM, you can only change yourself. Go out meet new people, (who don’t drink, smoke, or do drugs) have fun. It may seem harsh but the world DOES NOT REVOLVE AROUND YOU!!!
The only choice you have regarding the behavior of other people is 1) Accept that you can’t control them and have fun with them while not participateing in any drinking/drugs. Maybe you could be the designated driver.
2) Not participate and try unsuccesfully to control them by bitching, thereby ruining your fun and annoying them so that you become the whiny bitch that gets talked about behind her back and everyone hates. 3) Don’t go around if they are going to party. You can ask if they are going to partake before commiting to a planned outing.
I can gaurantee you, people know when they are going to drink and smoke in advance.
Have you tried this?
You: Hey, before I commit to going to X place with you tonight… is there going to be any smoking/drinking?
Friend: Yes!!!
You: Thanks but I think I’ll go somewhere else. You know it makes me uncomfortable.
You have maintained control of the situation by modifying your reactions. You have made a conscious choice to NOT place yourself in an uncomfortable situation. This takes guts Cessandra, it means you have to choose to miss out on some possible fun, and stand up for yourself in the only way that you can, by not showing up. Badgering and nagging people does not make them change, it only makes both parties resentful towards each other. You will lose these people as friends one way or the other. Bow out gracefully Cess…or just learn to chill out and save yourself some heartache.
Seriously kid, life it too short to stress over things we can’t change. You survived the prayer at graduation didn’t you?
Yes, you’re being a jerk. The reason you can’t see it is because you are too self absorbed to care about anyone else but yourself. In other words…a jerk!
“If you stick your finger in a pie, whatever is in the pie will be on your finger, and whatever is on your finger will be in the pie…unless you wear a rubber glove”----some demented old lady
Reading this thread has made me feel really sad. You people have no sense of courtesy for your friends. I’m not asking for a law here, I’m asking that people that supposedly care about me act like they do. What’s wrong with that? What’s wrong with respecting your friends’ feelings? I would never intentionally do something that I knew would seriously bother or potentially hurt one of my friends, and they do know how much seeing them slowly poison themselves hurts me (and they are poisoning themselves, there’s nothing like a 17-year-old alcoholic).
I picked my friends based on that most of them had the same feelings as I do about alcohol and other drugs, but recently they seem to have changed their collective minds. I tried to help one friend, who is seriously over the edge, but he’s now off somewhere in Montrose giving blow-jobs for money. I can see that they don’t want to be helped. So what’s wrong with asking that they not make me witness this self-destruction of people I care about, at least until I can bear to leave them behind to their own devices?
It was hard for me to see at first, that my friends no longer care about me as I care for them, that they consistently treat me in ways I would never treat them. I see that, now. But it makes me really sad to see that you would all treat your friends the same way, not caring if you hurt them, because, hey, it’s a free country and you can do whatever you want.
Maybe that’s what is wrong with this country, the idea that you don’t have to care about anyone else. And if they get upset that you are intentionally hurting their feelings (how terrible! how dare they be upset with you!) you can just call them a selfish prick for ruining your fun.
What a lovely way to live.
The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation.
– Henry David Thoreau
Dear Cess., Some people just don’t want to be helped and there’s nothing you can do. You can pick up the pieces, perhaps, after they give themselves cancer or liver failure–if they’ll let you. But sometimes you just have to let people destroy themselves, slowly or quickly. “Smart people don’t need advice, stupid people won’t take it.”
As far as smoking, I have a slightly different problem–new downstairs neighbors just moved in, and they smoke like fiends. So my whole apartment smells like an ashtray and my eyes sting. I am totally at a loss here, there’s nothing I can do. If they won’t stop smoking for their (premature!) newborn, they sure won’t stop for a total stranger. But when I move (which may be soon!), I will have it written into my lease that no smokers are to live below me. If they won’t sign, I won’t move in . . .
Wow, that’s really kind of scary, Flora. If they’re smoking enough to bother you in another apartment, they must be doing some damage to that baby! I’ve read so many news stories and article in Reader’s Digest of kids with health problems which the doctor’s think may have been cause by the parents smoking. It’s really sad that they don’t consider the effect they may be having on their own child. 
Hey, Cessandra, what if your friends had once asked you not to fuck a different man every night for six months because it bothered them?
I’m the most militant anti-smoker you could ever meet, but it would take me centuries and thousands of testosterone injections to grow balls big enough to tell someone they couldn’t smoke in their own fucking house! You know what I do to avoid smoke? I don’t hang around with smokers or frequent places that smokers frequent or that don’t have a nonsmoking section. Real difficult, huh?
OK, this has gotten to be a pretty long thread, so if I am repeating a bunch of stuff that has already been said, just ignore me! 
Cess, I don’t think anyone here is saying that you aren’t supposed to care for your friends, or that you shouldn’t help them with their problems. Nor is anyone saying that your friends shouldn’t try to be respectful of your feelings either. However, there are right ways to go about these situations and there are wrong ways. Unfortuantely, you seem to be going about things in the wrong way. In your posts, at least to me, you come across as sounding somewhat preachy and holier than thou. Confronting people in the manner you do would put most of us on the defensive. I think that is why so many people have reacted so strongly to this thread, even people who (like myself) don’t smoke, drink or do drugs. The people who have told you to remove yourself from the situations that make you uncomfortable are on the right track. I do it all the time. A few of my friends are on the wild side. If they ask me to go to dinner and a movie, I go and have a great time. If they invite me bar hopping in Ybor City (sort of like a mini Burbon Street in New Orleans), I decline. I don’t like to be in large crowds of drunken people, so I just don’t go. Granted none of my friends are hard core alcoholics or drug abusers, and it sounds as if some of your friends are heading that way. Still, I have to say that it is not your place to try to save them from themselves. As a friend, you can be there to offer them advice IF they ask for it, you can be there to help comfort them in times of need, but you cannot tell them what to do. They may be making the biggest mistakes of their lives by doing what they do, but ultimately it is their lives, and they have to figure out what is right or wrong for themselves.
Anyway, just my two cents. I don’t think you are a bad person for what you are trying to do, Cess, just a little misguided.
I confess that I find some irony in the fact that this is the same woman who couldn’t accomodate those around her who wanted a prayer at graduation, even if it was done in a manner so as not to violate the Establishment Clause.
Person’s got a right to smoke cigarettes and drink alcohol in their own homes (and there’s no law against a minor DRINKING alcohol; the law is against them buying it). You don’t like it? Nobody’s forcing you to be there.
-Melin
Phenomenal woman
Bitch Corporate Lawyer
That's me