Hey, CanvasShoes? Can I use this as my sig?
Yes, I have. Now let me ask you a few questions:
Have you ever spent 10 months on the Atkins diet (no carbs) - no soft drinks, no chocolate, no fried foods, no bread, no pasta?
Have you ever fasted for 8 days (nothing but water)?
Wrestling team! Pah! Four months of dieting! Pah!
Just admit that you’re a fucking idiot who doesn’t know a damn thing about dieting.
Thanks, leander! (My friend will be mortified that you think he looks like Tobey Maguire. He wants to look like Tom Cruise! Personally, I think he looks like a thin MeatLoaf when you see him at a certain angle, but that’s neither here nor there… 
)
And while I’m on my art tangent regarding talent, aptitude, “laziness”, etc:
There was a guy in one of my classes that was a Big Cheese artist at Disney. Had a great education, and was very successful. Worked on their movies, etc. Even had a story about him in TV Guide years ago. He also did (and does) science fiction book cover illustrations. But he couldn’t draw people very well. Sure, he could draw and all, but his people looked kind of dead and rubbery. Weird, considering how fantastic an artist he was in so many other ways. And I know he wanted to learn how to draw people better, because the class I had with him was a figure drawing class. And he worked hard in that class.
There is NO doubt in my mind that this guy was rather concerned about not being able to draw people well. And gradually, he did get better with drawing people, but I don’t think he’ll ever be as good as other artists and illustrators doing the same kind of work he’s doing. Is he “lazy”? He very well may stay up nights stewing about how he can’t draw people that well. But I guess that if he really wanted to draw them, he’d just do it, right? Because “it’s as simple as that”. Right?
Interestingly enough, in this class this guy asked me a few questions about drawing faces and heads, because I was having less of a hard time with it. Does this mean that I was a “better person” than he was, because I was able to do something he was not?
The connection between art and obesity is that the people who don’t have as much trouble with it sometimes cannot grasp that other will have a devil of a time. (Like the Brilliant Disney Guy and his faces.) There are a lot of reasons, (some of them complex) why some people won’t be as good as something as other people. It’s not as easy as waving your magic wand and saying, “I’d just learn how to do it.”
Even though I believe that hard work is a big part of art (talent is important, but not everything) I cannot deny that we all are NOT created equal, and each of us has a different set of aptitudes and strengths. While I know of some lazy artists (they just want to be called “artists”, they don’t want to put in any effort), many artists work very hard, and just have to struggle more than others. I struggled very hard in pottery at first, while I watched a whole class full of people do wonderfully. I had to work MUCH harder than everyone else to finally get only decent at it. Was I “lazy” because I sucked at pottery for a long time, and will NEVER be as good as some people? I don’t think so.
This is just crazy. Losing weight is difficult. Very difficult. Especially when you have a lot to lose. It means changing your entire life. Moreover, being able to lose weight and to maintain a healthy weight is often a perquisite of the wealthy. The working poor cannot afford health clubs nor organic foods. They also skew uneducated and hence don’t make the best nutritional choices. I could go on and on about this.
But it’s wasteful to attack obese people for not losing weight. I happen to believe that they have a moral obligation to lose weight, and I’m willing to bet that the vast majority of obese people would like to lose weight, understanding that it would make their own lives better and enrich the lives of their friends and families. But the answer is not to kick them for not losing weight, or accuse them of lacking willpower.
Getting to and maintaining a healthy weight is a societal problem. This is something the public sector should invest lots of money and effort in – as we as a society would reap great gains from a healthier and slimmer populace. We as a society have invested a lot of money in getting people to quit smoking? Why are we suddenly unwilling to help people lose weight? It’s just as much a lifestyle change…
Ladies and Gentlemen:
I have read this whole thread (whew!) and have a thing or two to say:
Thin People: Don’t kid yourselves, not all of you are thin from iron-clad will power. Some of you are, and that is commendable. But some of you have naturally high metabolism and/or a digestive system that doesn’t retain as much from food as an overweight person.
Overweight People: While you may have tried all methods, pills, diets, etc., IF you find yourself sitting on the couch eating a big-ass bag of Doritos, then I’m sorry but at that moment you can’t fall back on metabolism, glands, hormones, big-bones, emotions, etc. as an excuse.
Just for the record, I am happily married, used to weigh 350lbs, have gotten down to 280, and have 40 more to go. Yup. 240 is my goal. 110 less than what I had gotten up to. Now of course when I get to 240, I might say, “220 sounds good…”
I knew that I didn’t know the whole equation to weight loss. I don’t think that an overweight person needs to know the whole science, at first. I started with the obvious stuff. I started eliminating crap food from my diet, one thing at a time. I eliminated things like fructose-sweetened soft drinks, vending machine garbage (chips and candy bars), cake, and pastries. At the same time, I didn’t even dwell on my weight. I knew if I did, then I’d be discouraged. I started walking a mile per day (twenty minutes). I’m up to 6 miles now. I walk to lunch every day, and go out in the afternoon. I have a very understanding boss. He doesn’t want to see me die from heart disease. I’d also like to avoid getting type II (adult onset) diabetes. I am now to the point where I am drastically reducing carbs. You can’t go cold turkey on food. The body will protest by lowering the metabolism. So you got to be sneaky about it.
So my perspective is more from that of an overweight person. I have been over my “ideal” weight most of my adult life.
I would never ever ridicule someone for their weight, whether they were lazy or not, because frankly what the hell does it matter? As long as I don’t have to pick up the person and carry him/her up a flight of stairs, then they can weigh a thousand pounds for all I (or anyone) should give a damn. But to my fellow overweight (no I don’t use the term “fat”) people: Stop making excuses, start weighing long term happiness (and health) against short term gut-stuffing-pleasure. Hey, I love eating! I know what hunger feels like! I know the lack of concentration that comes from dieting! But I also want to be around for my kids and grand-kids! Go to the doctor, ask her how much you should be eating and what exercise to start doing. She’ll probably say to start walking. My doctor did. No surprise there.
And another thing, love yourself! The fact that thinner members of the opposite sex had nothing to do with me, I had to learn to stop being held down by that. My attitude now, is that if someone doesn’t like me for what I am, then he/she can EAT MY CRACK! Rejection works both ways, too.
-BigBadKatt
Unless an overweight person decides to use my head for a chair or block my breathing passages using their love handles or syphon their fat down my throat forcing ME to gain weight - I for one could not give a shit about how much any given stranger weighs.
Hi BBK (may I call you BBK?) Welcome to the SDMB.
I agree with you to a point.
However, at this juncture, I have to present the case of my mom. Mom is a snacker, she likes to have deserts, she likes gravy on her roast-beef and potatoes. She’s always managed to keep pretty slim and trim with exercise and moderation - yummy stuff, just smaller portions.
After X-mas, she started gaining weight. A LOT of weight. She felt like crap and wasn’t eating much - just a bowl of popcorn while watching TV because that’s all she could stomach.
It’s now the beginning of March, and mom has gained over 40 lbs. In about 2 months. People will see her muching on popcorn, because it’s all she can manage and say "Oh - look at that fatty, munching away. (40+ lbs is quite a bit on my moms 5’ frame).
Of course, what they don’t know, is that mom just found out shes got hypothyroidism. You know - that gland thing that makes you fat that “nobody really has - they just use it as an excuse”? Yah well, she’s got it.
She’s not happy about being fat. She eats about 1,000 calories a day and is still gaining weight. She’s having trouble getting out of bed, let alone exercising. She needs some serious medical intervention.
But, from the sounds of a lot of the posts in this thread (not yours, BBK), mom is just lazy. She lacks will power. If she wanted to be thin, she would be. She may have a gland problem, but that doens’t really count because is a small gland problem, and only those with EXTREEEEMMMMEEE gland problems should be cut any slack.
Barf. It makes me totally sick that some of the ass-munches in this thread think they have the right or obligation to expess how “fat and lazy” people have nothing to complain about, and have no problems that aren’t self induced, and would be just fine if they would just shape up.
The day before she was diagnosed, these shit-heads would have said - “Well. She’s just fat. I’m sick of her fat. She deserves to be fat.”
Bull-fucking-shit.
You ass-clowns have no idea what sort of medical issues the people you’re critizing have, either physical or psychological. You’re acting like pompus, arrogant, holier-than-thou shit-faces and it’s really, really pathetic and sad.
Just for the record, I would rather spend time with my poor, fat mom than any of you cock-sprockets that would judge her so harshly.
Alice - who’s skinny, but can still spot an asshole when she sees one.
Anyone want to join me at the Chinese buffet for lunch? Damn, I’m hungry.
Alice, I hope your mom gets medical treatment and doesn’t have to endure the asshole comments and ridicule from the judgmental busybody jackasses.
Indy, you may be thin, but you’re one ugly fuck knob.
Thanks Diane. I’m really worried - mom has had bouts of clinical depression, and she’s very sensitive about her weight and appearance.
I’m worried that some butt-munch will decide they need to comment on her size, and send her into a depression.
Fortunatly, she is rural, and I think usually rural people are more sensible about these things.
And for what it’s worth, I just thought folks might like to know that even though mom has been diagnosed, and is going to be receiving treatment, her weight issues are not over. It takes a long time to stablize medications, and then she has to lose the 40lbs the old fashioned way - except she didn’t put it on because of bad diet or lack of exercise, but she has to take it off as though she did. It’s hard to modify your exercise and diet habits when they’re already quite healthy.
Oh. And I heard this from an Endocrinologist. You know - like a Dr., as opposed to the “fit” people in this thread that believe anyone can be skinny if they’re not lazy slobs.
::…grumble grumble grumble…::
Indygrrl, you make me giggle. Here you sit in judgement of overweight people. You feel free to mock and deride. But you complained when someone calls you shallow and unnatural for getting fake tits.
Hypocrit much?
I know this was replying to somebody else, but I want to make a quick remark about the lunacy revealed in this reply.
You know what’s really bothering me?? There have been several people who have made broad remarks like this in retaliation towards someone on the other side of this discussion. The people in this discussion who perceive themselves as defending the overweight have been insistent that they don’t want anything about their character to be judged from their appearance. OK, fine. Yet they turn around and declare somebody a wholesale jerk, through and through, on the basis of a couple brief remarks on a very limited topic made on an internet web board. You don’t know this guy any better than he knows you, but because he suggests in a post the idea that most overweight people lack willpower and he finds that an undesirable attribute, you think you know enough from that alone to judge him to be “ugly on the inside”.
This is absolutely frickin’ ridiculous. If you disagree with someone, say so. If you think someone’s making invalid assumptions, say so. If you think someone is being unfair, say so. But don’t presume to know that “so-and-so is an absolute jerk” or has an ugly personality on the basis of a single remark on a narrow topic made with no clearly malevolant intentions. If you don’t want people to infer a lack of willpower from your weight, then be fair in return and don’t go around thinking you know the entire content of a person’s character from a single frickin’ post.
If you react so violently to a single adverse remark that you feel compelled to pigeonhole that person as a complete jerk without knowing anything else about him, then I’d say you are the one with some issues to deal with.
I think that people who judge others negatively by what they look like are bad people. I think it is just about the worst flaw a person can have. Maybe I shouldn’t judge by that one statement, but he made sure we all knew exactly how he feels about fat people. I just made sure he knew exactly how I feel about people like him.
Hi Alice, thanks for the welcome. BBK is fine with me!
As far as your Mom, I’m terribly sorry to hear of that. My mother had thyroid cancer, and is on synthroid now. It plays havoc with one’s metabolism. Synthetic thyroxine is no substitute for the real thing. Add to that her asthma, and you get a recipe for obesity. She is not able to aerobically exercise without the danger of an asthmatic attack. It sucks. She has to control her weight with diet alone. I wish people would stop putting so much g*d-damned importance on weight. I will get in someone’s face and “take it outside” so to speak with someone who even hints that they reject me as a human being for my weight. But not all overweight people have the stones to do that. I didn’t for the longest time. I will not crawl off in the corner, and cry. It’s time for overweight people to start dishing it right back!
MeanSkinnyPerson: You’re Fat, BBK!!!
BBK: Yeah, but you’re UGLY and STUPID, at least I can lose some more weight!!!
I haven’t mocked anyone. Where do you see that? I talked about the dieters in my office and the fact that they complain all day about being fat and then eat a bunch of junk. I also said that I think most obese people don’t really like being that way. It wasn’t a judgment. Diet and exercise does make you feel better and helps you live a much healthier life.
My Chinese buffet comment was a snide remark in the face of Son of Arizona and the like who are reluctant to let this topic go. I didn’t mean it in an offensive way, but obviously I need to draw it out for you. It was like saying, “Fuggit, let’s all take ourselves to the Chinese buffet and forget about this stupid debate/argument/insult gallery.” 'Mkay?
Oh, and LunaSea? Spell much?
They (the doctors) will only prescribe synthyroid, or it’s medical equivalents if a person’s count is at or above a certain level. If not, then they are diagnosed as having hypothyroid problems but are not helped much by the doctors other than to have the doctor tell them to get plenty of rest and eat leafy green vegetables and take iron, or other useless stuff.
Unless a person wants to go on a round of doctors and attempt to find one that will prescribe the meds…
I was diagnosed with that “just enough to have hypthyroid probs, but not enough to qualify for meds” disease too.
Have your mom try Tyrosine. It’s naturally occuring in avocados, and you can also buy it in the drug store in the vitamen section.
It works wonders, stops the fatigue, the cold night sweats, the crankiness, and the weight gain. At least it has for me, and some of my students who’ve had the same problem.
Hope that helps.
Earlier you did say…
It seems to me that it’s ok for you to criticize others, but you didn’t like it when someone did it to you.
OK, I was wrong about the mocking. I did take the Chinese buffet comment as a crack, this is a thread about over-eating after all.
So, all that being said, I’m sorry, I went too far.
Hey, it’s not my fault my 'e’s like to migrate. 
I think it’s ok to criticize on messageboards, and I also think it’s ok to be criticized. However, that doesn’t mean I won’t stand up for myself when I feel I’m being personally attacked.
My feelings didn’t get hurt on the boobie thread, but I do think there are some hurt feelings on this one. It’s a heated subject for good reason.
Well said, Rexdart, well said. There seems to be a lot of hypocrisy here, wouldn’t you agree?
It is human nature to judge others by what they look like. You cannot claim that you don’t do it yourself either, because to some extent you must. Don’t tell me you don’t see the homeless guy on the side of the street and think negetive thoughts about him… or maybe you don’t look at all? Maybe you see a large breasted blonde woman on television and automatically assume she is a bimbo or stupid? Maybe you are afraid to approach that good looking guy across the room because you fear his rejection, yet you have no problem approaching the balding guy with the spare tire around his waste because you don’t care as much if he rejects you? Or you assume he won’t reject you because he must have lower standards due to his less than average appearance? I could go on and on, but the point of the matter is this. We all judge. Some of us are honest about it. Some of us aren’t. While I am not saying I would treat an obese person any differently, the thoughts within my mind may contain some negativety to them.
It’s human nature to judge by appearance, to what extend can we overcome this prejudice?
We can overcome it when it comes to treating people with respect.