Fatherless

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
1

Hey all, I’d love an intelligent point of view so I chose this forum. Everyone’s opinion is welcome though. I am 19 years old and very self-conscious. I am having a tough time becoming my own man. I notice my self acting differently to everyone, like I’m trying to please everyone that seems friendly to me. It is actually embarrassing at work because it is VERY obvious and I come across as fake. I don’t know what to do so I just won’t think about it to get through the days, I accepted it.

I swear people want to tell me about myself but no one will. I am real cool with the VP at my company and on the way to the post office he said “I don’t like telling people what they should do, but I think you should establish a relationship with your father, you may regret it in the future. I just think you should give it some thought.” He never explained why but said he was happy he connected with his father in the last 5 years of his life. Discussion ended

Now I don’t see how not talking to my father is causing my failure but maybe the VP does. I’m not quite sure what he was implying. Guys, don’t stick with the father thing, it may not be the cause. Please ask questions to help you get better insight.

I don’t like to just blabber, especially if it is irrelevant. So if you guys need more information, just ask.

2

Is your father a jerk?

Are you being too self critical?

Do you often tell yourself you are a fake and a failure?

3

My mom separated from my father before I could remember. Very few memories of him. He was in jail throughout my childlife. Me, my sister, and grandma picked him up the day he got out. The next day we spent the whole day together, just talking… I’m not too sure of my emotions then, I was 13. Next thing I know, I’m sneaking (from mom’s boyfriend) him in my room because he had no where to stay. He was very needy, money, place to stay. Addicted to pills also. Not someone I want to look up to. Very disappointed I’m his prodigy.

Self critical? That may be true, alot of stuff doesn’t make sense. I do need to start and think highly of myself but I always find reasons why I shouldn’t.

One reason is me being fake. Picture being in one room and talking to one person a certain way and with a certain attitude and then turn around and talk to another person completely differently. I need to establish one attitude that I can be happy with, not 100 different ones to make everyone else happy. I really like who I am and am very confident in alot of areas but I just want to be one person.

4

Doesn’t sound like you father is much of a role model (plus, it seems he took advantage of you), so I’m not sure I would give the VP’s advice too much weight. If you admire the VP otherwise, can you turn him into a mentor?

Not having a father is not a liability if he is a poor role model. It could be an asset. It does leave you with a blank spot to fill in, particularly when and if you have children, but you have the freedom to fill that blank spot with whatever (hopefully better) ideas you develop. My mother died when I was 6, but she was a poor mother, so I am free to develop my mothering skills as I see fit and do a much better job that she was able (according to family lore) to do.

On the messages you are giving yourself about you are fake and a failure: You need to quit telling yourself this- it is very destructive. Most people feel like they could have done some task in a different way that would have been more sucessful, useful, efficient, friendly, whatever, etc. I think most people, too, have a running dialog in their heads. This should be be used to examine the situation and spur better performance in the future, but shouldn’t be used to berate yourself. I used to think “Gah, I’m so stupid” until I realized how self-hurful it was and consciously decided to stop. Try saying “What can I/did I learn from this?”

I’m not so sure how talking differently to different people is a problem. I speak to different people in different ways as well and never considered it a problem. I talke to the housekeeper differently than I do the doctor. I’m very friendly and slightly goofy and will talk to anyone about anything. I think this is an asset. If you are feeling shallow and/or superficial, try asking people questions to get to know them better. These little bonds can be interesting and fulfilling.

Also, you are still pretty young and developing. I think you are doing OK- you have a job and are gaining lots of various experiences with different kinds of people. I’m not sure you should be ‘settled’ yet.

5

It sounds to me like he had a good experience reconnecting with his father, so he is assuming that anyone else in an estranged relationship will also have a good experience reconnecting. However, that isn’t always the case.

I had a similar situation where a work colleague had sought out his birth parents, now had a great relationship with them and they had been ‘integrated’ into the adoptive family. He was really persistent that I should seek my own birth parents because it would be such an amazing, life-changing experience. In the end, he became overly-persistent and I had to tell him quite sternly to stop prying into my personal life.

There’s nothing wrong with considering another person’s point of view, but you are never under any obligation to take their advice. That decision rests with you. So if the VP comes back to you, you can just say something like, ‘Thank you for your advice, I’m thinking about it and if I decide to do it, I’ll let you know.’ And leave it at that.

The other thing I would say is that, at the age of 19, you’ve only just entered into the adult world, and it’s pretty natural to feel self-conscious. It’s an age where you’re still working out the kind of person you want to be, and that’s probably why you find yourself trying on different personas when you’re around different people. We are all like that to a degree if you think about it, the type of person you are when you are around an elderly relative (polite, respectful, etc.) is probably quite different to how you are around friends of your own age (louder, coarser language, etc).

I think the most important thing at your age is to be truthful when you interact with people. Don’t say you like something just because someone else says they like it and you’re trying to be nice. People see right through that. But be respectful of other peoples opinions - don’t say, ‘But that’s rubbish, I don’t know why anyone would like that.’ Instead, say, ‘Oh that’s interesting, that’s never really been my thing, what do you like about it?’ Seek to understand why people think the way they do, rather than trying convince them the way you think is right.

The other thing you can do is look at the people around you that you admire, and take note of the way they behave, the way they speak, the body language they use, and try to integrate aspects of that in the way you behave, speak, carry yourself. Obviously you don’t want to become the carbon-copy of one person, but to take on the good aspects of people you encounter throughout the course of your life.

6

Sometimes it’s good to restablish contact, but just as often it is unhealthy.

We all watch TV and movies and they always push this “family,” angle. I’m not saying it’s not good, what I’m saying is it’s not always correct.

Americans are a nation of immigrants. Before modern times it wasn’t at all uncommon to leave and never see your family again. People moved across the country and communicated, if at all, by letter. Even in the 70s, I knew of people who left Europe and were told their mother died in a letter, a month after it happened.

There are some relationships that are unhealthy and not everyone is worth salvaging. But there are some.

At 19, unless your father is dying or very old, you would have time to establish contacts once you work it out.

It never hurts to talk to someone but think of it like this, "If you choose to talk, make sure, make DARN WELL sure that after you’re done talking to him, things will be better not worse. Unless you’re pretty sure, you’re not ready. (And I know nothing is 100% but you get my meaning)

There’s a side issue that is very important and it’s VERY good you’re learning this at a young age. Keep your private life PRIVATE away from co-workers.

If the VP of your company is pressing you about personal things, he ain’t got enough to do and you need to learn from this so in the future you can keep business, business and private stuff private.

Now this is not a slam, it’s just something we all have to learn. You’re learning it young. And for the future, keep this in mind so the next time you’ll learn how to avoid this

7

I wouldn’t focus too much on the father aspect (unless you feel you need to). I think the key is that what you are going through is universal at that age. Teenagers go through a very tumultuous period where they are figuring out who they are and what type of person they will be. I would suggest that you embrace this process and just focus on who you want to be, for yourself, and not for anyone else.

In my experience, the people that end up happiest in the world are ones who’ve learned to be who they are for their own reasons. Don’t change because a VP suggests something, or your father does, or whatever. But take time to prove to yourself that you can become your own man. For example - I went through some stuff as a kid (as many do), that proved to me I can survive on my own. Then, at age 17, I moved over a thousand miles from home and never looked back. Similarly, my wife went off to Africa and worked in the Peace Corps for 3 years. For both of us, these various experiences allowed us to figure out ourselves, first. And once we became comfortable with that, then we were able to develop lasting relationships with other people.

All this is another way of saying - don’t worry what other people think. But do take this time in your life to figure out who you think you are, and what type of man you hope to be.

8

I can pretty much assure you that the reasons you are coming up with are bullshit. The question is, why are you seeking reasons?

And remember that at 19, you’re not really grown up yet. Your brain isn’t even fully developed, and won’t be for a couple more years. So it’s OK to be a little confused. Hell, I didn’t start getting a clue until I was 30.

9

You’re 19. Some people play chameleon a bit earlier than that, but it’s normal. Why do you think so many people travel to Europe to “find themselves” (aside from hot guys and women, amazing museums and Amsterdam)? Some are just better at pretending they’ve got it all figured out.

10

I’m with Markxxx, one of the most evident problems here is that you seem to be overpersonalizing your work situation. The workplace is not a good place to work through personal issues.

With your family background, it is normal to have difficulty establishing healthy boundaries. That includes deciding who to tell what. It also includes the boundary between yourself and others in terms of having respect for yourself independent from how others feel about you. Here’s a book I’d recommend: Where to Draw the Line: How to Set Healthy Boundaries Every Day by Anne Katherine

Having healthy boundaries helps you attract other people with healthy boundaries into your life. Lacking them does the opposite and often leads to drama.

11

Is your father someone you think might be worth knowing better? If this seems likely, knock yourself out.

(Personally, it took me longer than was strictly reasonable to work out for myself that mine was a worthless sack of shit and that trying to cultivate any sort of relationship with him was a monumental waste of time.)

12

Agreed 312%.

About a year and a half ago I posted something about boundaries. A lot of people seemed to find it useful, so I’ll quote it here. Sorry about the misspellings. :slight_smile:

13

*I am 19 years old and very self-conscious. I am having a tough time becoming my own man. I notice my self acting differently to everyone, like I’m trying to please everyone that seems friendly to me. *

Sounds like how I was, right through my mid-20s. And my parents didn’t divorce until after I was grown.

Growing up just takes time. Most of us don’t really know who we are by 19. Cut yourself some slack.

And remember that there are no quick answers to the question of how to grow up, how to figure out who you really are, and gain the inner resources to be true to yourself. Tracking down a father who you never knew is just someone else’s quick-and-stupid solution to a complicated problem inherent in living, and it’s not particularly likely to give you any deep insights into yourself. Most of us learn by blundering about, trying to do the best we can, and gradually figuring ourselves out. And that simply takes time.

14

It sounds like you have to find out who you really are, as you yourself don’t have a clue. You need to understand things and be strong enough to stand up for them instead of being blown with any wind in any and every direction. One place I highly recommend starting is the Bible, learning the principals of God, what is truth and what is error, the strength to stand in faith, and ask God for guidance as He is not only able to help, but wants to help.

There most likely is a issue and a reason to reconnect with your father, but you may need God’s help in finding it.

15

Totally. (I disagree about the Bible stuff, though.)

Don’t think, though, that one day you’re going to get it all together and then you’ll be done. It’s a lifelong process. The most any of us can hope for is to be further along the path tomorrow than we were yesterday. And to have a freakin’ BLAST along the way.

16

I’m a little drunk so please forgive if I’ve skipped where this has been said before, but I think there may be a very specific reason why the VP has suggested you reconnect with your father, and it has nothing to do with how the VP relates to his own father.

You, like me, are essentially father-less. My father and mother broke up when I was about two years old. I’ve had a relationship with him over the years but he has never been my immediate role model. In lieu of Dad I’ve had various other role-models, from my Mum’s long term boyfriends to other men who have played an important role in my life. I am lucky, I suppose, in that all of these men were apparently happy to take on a little boy and teach him a little bit about life. But it’s always possible that you look up to someone as a role-model and they don’t particularly want to be in that position.

What I am thinking is that you say you are very cool with the VP at your work. Perhaps you are a little too cool with him and he can see that you are looking up to him as a father figure. He is basically saying, “please don’t look for a father figure in me dude, get close to your real father and sort it out directly with him.”

I don’t mean to say that he wants you to piss off altogether, just that he might not want as close a relationship as you are subconsciously looking for.

The other poster’s points are all valid. There is nothing wrong with changing how you act so that you please different people. This only becomes a problem when it conflicts with your own needs or the needs of others. So if, for example, you are being nice to Bob and nasty to Mike behind Mike’s back, but you’re also being nice to Mike and nasty to Bob behind Bob’s back, then that’s not good. On the other hand, if you’re just emphasizing different aspects of your personality depending on who you are with, then that’s fine. I change a little depending on who I’m with, but I’m still being true to myself, I’m just bringing different sides of me out depending on what’s appropriate to the situation. In addition, if you are putting yourself down, or doing things you don’t like just to please other people, then that is bad, however if you are doing things you wouldn’t normally do but still enjoy then that is fine, you’re just pushing your boundaries a little.

BTW, I’m 35 and my relationship with my father is getting stronger all the time, but he never has been, and never will be, a role model to me.

17

Too late for the edit. Good luck with everything, I probably sound all nice and clear cut in my previous post, but the truth is that I am very unclear on my own relationship with my father. I say that he is not a role model but I know that in many ways I model myself on him. Having intense relationships with people is not easy, and one way or another, your relationship with your parents is normally intense, regardless of how much they are there for you.

18

Real good people here. I really like the boundaries thing. I will keep that in mind forever. Me and the VP are not cool as in close we are just cool. He doesn’t know nothing about me unless my mom tells him. My mom got me in the warehouse part of her job. I got to get out of that place and my moms place. I have had my life handed to me without struggle unless you want to call my depression a struggle(I call it an excuse). I can’t be a man unless challenges are thrown at me. You know, to experience the feeling of a real man. I am self-critical because I want to perfect myself. Who knows why I feel why I want to perfect myself.

This is my situation when my happiness went down the tubes and I became overly self-conscious. I found a role-model in my sisters ex-boyfriend who was only a few years older than me, call him J. He always called me lil brother but I never gave it any real thought as to why. I was never aware he was my role-model until our relationship ended. I also was close to some other people and also a girl-friend.

How could I bring my girl around my friends when I treat her differently than them… How could I bring her around J when I look up to him, that’s unattractive… Well, the girl is gone now thanks to my self-confusion. We are still cool as it seems like she is waiting for me to fix my confusion.

Anyway, what through me in the gutter was when J and my few friends got together and became real close and cool. I was trying to be the role-model to the friends to better myself and then J comes in the circle and you get the idea, I wasn’t ready.

Sad part is, I insisted on bringing him to hang out with all of them. Even when he said he didn’t think it was a good idea (not sure of why). I was clueless on how to act and quickly became confused. My personality turned into grits and to this day, I am alone until I can find myself. I could go be with these people this very second but I won’t go until I feel I am ready (on their level at least). I pretty sure everyone knows and accepts this and that I have to do it on my own.

The bad part of the situation above, I don’t know if it is true. Does anyone else around me see it the same way I do, hence my confusion and becoming my own man. I’m almost certain that it is true as it seems like common sense, but not sure. Affirmation would be nice but how do you become a man when you need affirmation, you know? Also, say I felt this situation was 100% true, what next? I can recognize problems easily yet can’t act on them.

This isn’t a depression thread, these are actual challenges that people of all ages go through. I know I got a bit personal but I do not need sympathy what soever; I’m just trying to see if I can enhance your guys opinion. This is not just a challenge, it is my mission. I also have a lot of pride and a crazy ego. I’m sure therapy works but I will leave that as my last resort.

19

Awesome. If you’re thinking along those lines, then you’re doing better than you think.

By affirmation, do you mean validation from others? That is, do you need other people to tell you you’re OK? A huge part of becoming a man is learning to validate yourself. That’s really vital. You need to create your own reality where everything is amazing. Don’t get sucked into someone else’s reality, because if you do, you will never be in control of your life.

YES!!

20

That’s…fucked up, dude. Mind you, I mean that in the nicest way possible. Treating your girlfriend differently than your friend-friends, or respecting and admiring someone, is normal. Stop freaking out about it. Your platonic friends don’t expect you to treat them the same way as you treat your girlfriend, and honey, I’ll promise you your girlfriend sure as shit expects to be treated differently than your platonic friends. That’s how normal, healthy relationships with normal, healthy people work–different sorts of relationships get different treatment. You don’t freak out about your friends being around your mom because you treat her differently than them, right? Same thing, so chill. And unless you’re hovering around J bathing him with your slavish adoration, it’s not unattractive. (Although, if he’s hot and you’re literally bathing him…but I digress.)

As for all that about perfecting yourself–ain’t gonna happen. Nobody and nothing on this big old round world is or ever has been perfect. You can constantly improve yourself, certainly, and I think that’s a laudable goal. But you will always have flaws and shortcomings. If you think perfecting yourself is an option, you’re doomed to a lifetime of beating yourself up for the horrible crime of being a mere mortal like the rest of us.