For the Guys: Would You Do This?

In My Humble Opinion
61

How would that work, considering all they’ve ever talked about is business? Asking a personal question like that out of the blue would be suspicious to me, anyway. Valentine’s Day IS a good excuse for mentioning it, though. What if she said, “Any big plans for Valentine’s Day? God, it’s my least favorite holiday…” in sort of a disinterested way, maybe that would pass under the radar?

Methinks this crush is not based on an real interaction between the two, just on her observations of him. She’s kvelling about how patient and sweet he is with the little kids, how graceful he is, etc. Truly crush material.

My advice to her is to try to talk to him more than just a few seconds, but I think she feels inhibited, tongue-tied, what have you, considering he “makes her knees weak.” How one practices a martial art with weak knees also escapes me.

I think this is going to be a long-term project. I am now really having this conversation more for my own edification than hers, since she’s gonna have to get up the guts on her own.

62

I don’t know how this happened, but a girl at work actually asked me that. I really didn’t know what to say, it really took me by surprise. It was actually sort of embarassing because of my reaction. I had always thought that an immediate yes would flow from my thoat unbidden, but instead I stammered something like “I’d need to get to know you better.” Did I just say that? Did that come from me? Oh good god. There was the work factor, and plus she was asking for something on the side since she was dating another guy, but still…talk about dropping the ball.

63

I had more damned scruples in my early 20s than I would if I were suddenly single now. So I’m not sure what I would have done then.

I think your friend’s best bet, Ruby, is simply to lead the way: ask him out (or in: inviting him over to her place for dinner is good), then get him back to her place, pour wine into his glass, and come on to him.

If he could be dating nubile 18 year olds, he would. But guys and gals of all ages have problems getting what they want, it seems, and if your friend is attractive, available, and comes on to him, she’s got a 90% chance of hitting paydirt.

I don’t know what percentage of young men find older women attractive, but I was one who did. Still do - although now that I’m in my late 40s, it’s simply a matter of finding women of pretty almost* all legal ages attractive.

*[sub]Haven’t yet gotten the hots for a woman over 75. But I suppose it’s only a matter of time. :smiley: [/sub]

64

She can always go up to him and say, “You know what I’d like to unwrap on Valentines Day? YOU.”

That should cause all stated questions to be readily answered.

65

I would be very flattered if a 30+ woman showed that kind of interest in me. (I’m 22 by the way.)

My only reserve would be if she wanted a long term relationship. (Personally I would prefer someone closer to my age if it was a serious relationship - like marriage. But if your friend was looking only for some “fun”, that’s another story.)

66

You guys are definitely fantasizing out loud here-- I mean, really, can you expect a 30+ year old woman to go up to a guy whose age and relationship status are unknown to her and say something about wanting to unwrap him? Seems a recipe for disaster to me, esp. if she wants to keep taking his class.

Be honest: wouldn’t you think a woman who did that must be a wacko?

I suspect, if she does anything, it will be a longer-term project. First, she has to get up the nerve to make casual conversation with him. I think this is key, b/c a lot of information can be gleaned through seemingly innocuous comments. Finding out how old he is would be important too; what if he’s not even within 10 years of her age?

Also, getting rejected in this situation would be so terrible; she really likes his class, can’t afford to take a different one, and I know she would be crushed and humiliated if he said no (she had a bad breakup last year and is still a bit fragile).

This is something else that I’ve noticed coming up: the idea that this would only be a sex thing. How often, in real life, is that the case? Sure, if the first time is lousy, you wouldn’t do it again, but if it’s good, you definitely will, being human, and seeing each other on a regular basis. So then you’re having an affair, but the hormones kick in like pure heroin, and then you un a serious risk of getting hooked. We all know that"in lust" and “in love” often wear the same mask, and that’s when things get messy. It could be the woman who gets hooked, but then again, it could be him, esp. if this is the best sex of his life…

I really don’t know where I was going with this except to point out just how much more complicated this is than just a quickie one shot hump.

67

Uh, no Rubystreak, I, for one am not fantasizing out loud here. When I was in my late 20’s there was a woman who was nearly fifty whom I’d flirted with (figuring that there was no hope of anything happening with, her being married and all), who one day called me up, said, “Meet me at ________.” I showed up not knowing what to expect, next thing I know she had her tongue down my throat and her hand in my pants. Needless to say, a very enjoyable time was had by all.

68

I would think “Wanna go for coffee/a drink?” would work best. If he’s shy, having a woman (no matter how attractive) throw herself at him is more likely to scare him off.

Consider this line of reasoning: “She’s propositioned me out of the blue. Women do not normally do this to me. What the hell is wrong with her? Is she a psycho, like in that Glenn Close movie? Better not take the chance…”

Whereas an hour or two conversing and flirting in a neutral setting will allow him to get to know her better (and vice versa) and let him realize that she’s not seriously deranged, just hot for him. And if he declines the coffee/drink, it’s not a major judgment of her sex appeal.

How’s that?

69

If what your friend’s after is a relationship, then yes, I agree I wouldn’t go about it in such a “wacko” manner if I were her.

Yah, I’ve been here too, with someone who thought it was much worse if she was rejected rather than some random less sensitive soul. Sorry, but she’s the one with the power in this situation, both by virtue of being the mature adult and by virtue of being the teacher, so she’s the one who’s got to be the grown-up - which I assume you wouldn’t question for a moment if it was me, being a 42yo man, hitting on a female twentysomething. And you can take it from me, being crushed and humiliated is not a sensation that’s restricted to females.

Or if it’s the best sex of her life, and she decides once she’s dealt herself into the game that she wants to change the rules - which I’ve been on the receiving end of.

The sine qua non IMHO is that your friend should be clear and honest to the point of ruthlessness with herself about what it is she wants. Otherwise it’s likely to all end in tears.

Sorry if this comes over as a flame, but I’m having trouble expressing myself any differently.

70

Malacandra: No, I didn’t take it as a flame at all. But she’s NOT the teacher, he is. If he feels vastly uncomfortable after she throws herself at him, she’s going to be the one SOL. I don’t think she has any way of knowing if she wants a relationship with him b/c she really doesn’t know him. Changing the rules when there are no rules (how can she make rules without consulting him?) is a dicey proposition.

I’m not sure what you mean about being crushed and humiliated being a phenomenon limited to females. It does tend to be limited to the person who goes out on the limb and exposes herself. He has the power: he’s the teacher, he’s the person who has to decide yea or nay.

Bongmaster: Do you regret saying no? Did you ever get to know her better? Did you hook up, and how did it go?

Tuckerfan: You know you’re the rarity, right?

71

well hey… whatdoya know… i’m wacko!~

I hate games. I appreciate it when people are straight to the point, so I do my best to be the same.

I’ve said EXACTLY THAT… do you have a girlfriend? would you like to fuck?
AND, I made it very clear that I was not interested in a friendship. At the time, I was 25 and he was 21.
What’s the worst that can happen to your friend? HE SAYS NO. big deal.
She will never know unless she tries.
If she asks him to fuck, without worrying about social stigmas, hooray for her. I would rather be honest in requesting sex, than play some huge charade trying to coax someone into ther sack.

72

No, no.

It’s (curtseying) “May I have the honor of the next fuck?”

73

If she wants to keep taking the class then she should think very seriously about getting involved with the instructor. Even if all she wants is meaningless sex, the whole nature of the ‘relationship’ will change and if it all backfires on her, she’s not only missed out on the meaningless sex part, she’ll also be missing out on a class she wants to take.

As an alternative, I have a friend who will say an unreserved “yes” to meaningless sex every single time.

74

Eight years.
Six.
Five.
Three.
Now?

75

Sorry Rubystreak, despite reading the whole thread from the start I still managed to forget which of these two was the teacher :smack:

What I was saying about humiliation not being a female-only thing is that your friend shouldn’t let her fear of crushing humiliation deter her any more than it would deter a man. And if she does get knocked back in a particularly crushing and humiliating manner, it’ll give her an insight into the problems men routinely face. :slight_smile:

The alternative is passively waiting to be asked. You pays your money and you takes your choice… and if she doesn’t know this guy well enough to know whether she is going to end up wanting a relationship with him if they do have some wild, meaningless sex, I think she’s trying to find out the answer to the wrong question.

When push comes to shove, she either wants to know the answer badly enough to take the risk of finding out and standing the consequences, or she doesn’t. The rest is just so much whys and wherefores. There’s an entry in the book “Games People Play” that describes a “game” called “Why don’t you/Yes, but”. Someone can probably quote it.

Urendi Maleldil,

Malacandra

76

Mith, no offense was intended towards you. I too am not inclined to futz around with should I or shouldn’t I. However, I know I couldn’t just ask a veritable stranger a question like that. She doesn’t know how old he is, if he’s in an relationship, etc. (What if he’s underage, or close to it? It’s pretty unlikely but technically possible, and she’s a high school teacher!) I could see if he were an acquaintance, if she felt a vibe, if she knew he was single, then sure. Just blurting it out right outta the blue is too much to ask even a non-demure girl like me.

I also want to defend my friend against the allegation of game-playing. It’s entirely appropriate to assess status and gain info before one takes a risk like this. Don’t forget, the guy IS her teacher and the class would be well-nigh impossible for her to attend if the whole thing went South.

I guess my purpose in posting this was to see if, all things being equal, most guys would go for it. Most said yes, which answers part of my question. The next part is: how attractive would she have to be? Like I said, she’s decent-looking: nice skin, long pretty hair, a cute face, a curvy body (not particularly slim but not fat). How hot would a chick have to be for you to say yes to a proposition? Conversely, how UNattractive would she have to be for you to say no?

For me, I have a type that I like, and invariably I am attracted to men of that type. If a guy not my type propositioned me, no matter how empirically attractive or how nice he was, I wouldn’t be able to get it up for him. Are guys like that too?

77

Rubystreak–You’re way more hung up on the age thing than any of the guys are. Guys in their 20s definitely find women in their thirties attractive. How many “hot” movie stars are over 30? Or 40? Heck, even Ms. Bodacious Ass herself, Jennifer Lopez, is over 30. Her age will not be a problem at all.

I think if she wants to do it, her best bet is as follows:

Step 1: Ask him directly “do you have a girlfriend.” If he says yes, then she drops the subject. He’ll know she was interested, but so what. If he says “no,” then she proceeds to step 2. If he says “sorta seeing someone,” she can decide then whether to go on to step 2.

Step 2: Say “would you like to go out for a drink?” Not coffee. Coffee implies “getting to know you” and drink has more of a date-like implication. Going out for a drink with someone that you are sexually interested is fun and they can flirt, and they won’t have to bother with the whole dinner rigamarole. While they are having the drink, they can proceed to go home together, go home alone, or even go out to dinner after if they want. So, if she asks him to go out for a drink and he doesn’t want to, he can always say “I’m sorry but I don’t date students,” which may or may not be true.

I’m a female, so what do I know, but I suppose this scenario would work. It makes her intentions clear, but not too embarrassingly clear, and gives them both outs if they want.

Hey, did you say there were kids in the class? Maybe she could put some loudmouth kid up to asking him if he has a girlfriend?

78

Can you really compare the woman in question, sight unseen, to “hot movie stars”? The only comment I’ve seen on her looks so far is that she is “not Hagsville,” from Rubystreak. That doesn’t exactly put her in the “Jennifer Lopez” category. And Ruby is a female friend of hers, so therefore not as objective about how attractive men 10 years her junior would find the other woman to be. I think it goes without saying that most men would not react adversely if a “hot” woman of any age propositioned them. But that is a unique situation, and we have no idea if it applies here.

79

Have done it, some years ago. The proposition wasn’t quite as straightforward as you make it, but the situation was essentially the same. I was 21, she was 32. I can’t speak for her, but i know i had a good time.

80

Mhendo: Love your sig.

I honestly am quite surprised that people would just go up and ask someone if he has a girlfriend. Like I said, I’m not demure, but even I need to do some reconnaissance before I launch a full frontal attack. Minimizing one’s chance of a crash and burn is never a bad idea, esp. with someone with whom you have a professional relationship. There HAS to be a more subtle way to do it than just blurting it out. You call it game-playing, I call it CYA.

I think my friend is pretty and charming. She’s never had trouble getting guys, but then again, she’s just recently back in circulation after 4 years off the shelves. Not as irresistible as the allegedly irrestistible JLo, but then again, she’s not after Ben Affleck either.

Honestly, I think most people are incapable of having a strictly sexual relationship anyway. You think you’re going to, but someone always gets attached (unless one of you is flying off to Antarctica the next day) and then it gets messy. Maybe some things are just better left as crushes…

Nah.