In case you don’t know me. I am a gay pagan living in the Washington DC area. I have based my beliefs on mnay animistic ideals. Mainly that everything possesses divinity to an equal degree. I went to two different private Christian schools in my life (the first a Baptist one) and the second a Catholic University. I have found Christianity doesn’t speak to me. How would you convert me?
Shouldn’t this thread be called, “This Pagan’s Switching Teams”?
:::: ducking and running ::::
The most effective way historically was to burn your village and threaten your family (or vice versa). :D:D
If you love, you already are “converted”.
I was actually wondering what his conversion tactics would be as I am pretty well grounded in my faith that way I can use them to convert all you puny mortals into my brand of dvil worshipping heathenism. Did I say that out loud? It seems that Christianity has a track record with forced conversions and I would like to see the process for future reference.
PS. \me shoots Phil. HUGS!
Lib of course means: if you love God (the xtian God) you are converted.
Why should you love the christian god? Because to keep the commandments, as taught by Jesus, is the equivolent of love for your neighbor, with spiritual humility thrown in for good measure.
Why should you love your neighbor? Beats me. I tried to start a thread on that and didn’t get any good answers. However, if you live a life of loving God, and hence your neighbors, you will have a good and happy and long life, and rumors have it there is a life in the next world as well.
Does that help?
JMullaney of course means: I would not presume to be vested with the mystical power to speak on Lib’s behalf.
I meant what I said. If SqrlCub loves, then SqrlCub and I share the same “religion”.
I can agree with that Lib. I do love and see loving as a higher form of being. I don’t see loving the Christian idea of God as something that is too admirable since it is too ideosyncratic and weird in my opinion.
What if SqrlCub loves… fish? Therefore he loves. Therefore you share the same religion?
SqrlCub – what do you mean the xtian idea of God is too weird? Does “God is Love” throw you for a loop?
There is only God. There are many who know Him. And there are many who call Him “Lord” whom He does not recognize.
One who knows Him is Jesus. Of God, He said:
“Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit… God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and in truth… The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life.” — Jesus of Nazareth [John 3:6, John 4:24, John 6:63]
Do not let me or JMullaney or Jerry Falwell or Madalyn Murray O’Hair tell you what that means. Decide for yourself what it means to you, if anything at all.
It is thought that is it illogical for human beings to act in a way that you would not wish to become universal law. This is not an invention of Christianity… more a fundamental human belief.
Phrases such as “Love thy neighbor as thyself” and “Do unto others as you would have others do unto you” are merely echoing the same sentiment. It’s covered a lot in legal studies as well - i.e. if you do not abide by certain moral absolutes, you give up your status of “agency” within society.
I forget what the philosophical term for this is and I can’t remember the name of the guy who came up with the “agency” theory (Geworth, or something, I think). I’m sure someone on this message board can fill in the gaps, otherwise you’ll have to wait until I consult my wife, who knows a bit more about this.
The Biblical evidence for God being love is nonexistent. (Job can be a prime example…but the examples are too numerous to list here.) Thank you very much. The God is Love ideology is more along the lines of New Age thinking than anything.
Do not do unto your neighbour as you would have him do unto you. His tastes may be different. - George Bernard Shaw
“Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.” — 1 John 4:8
Well, hypocritical anyway. Does an anarchist pay his taxes?
Interesting. Explain further?
SqrlCub – I never read Job – it is a comedy right? A lot of the O.T. is myth and shouldn’t be taken that seriously. Who was that prophet who wins at the end? That one is clearly a parody (when he is done even the cattle bow down to God) of the prophets who failed.
“God is Love” is Christian belief and has been for 1,940+ years, at least since the Gospel of John was written. So don’t tell me it is some New Age kitsch.
It sounds like you’re talking about Immanuel Kant’s Categorical Imperative.
This is simply not true, and someone who was raised Baptist/Catholic would know it. I could quote a thousand Scriptures to you that clearly show God’s undying love, perhaps the most famous of which is John 3:16.
The best example of God being love is Jesus, who is God. His life showed pure love, and holiness. Jesus is no less God, than God the Father. Yet Jesus got angry, proving that anger is not sin. (I know you do not believe that Jesus is God SqrlCub, but since you said there is no “Biblical evidence,” I had to use Biblical teaching as an example)
It took me a little while, but I realized a while back that trying to change somebody’s heart, while on a message board is practically useless, especially on this board, where the individuals are very ingrained in their beliefs. What will truly change people’s minds is when Christians start acting like…well, Christians. IRL that is.
I love my fellow man as often as possible before closing time.
I remember now! That thing about fundamental morals I was talking about. Alan Gewirth (of the University of Chicago Law School, no less) wrote a book called “Reason and Morality”.
Any way, my point is that religions tend to agree on these universal morals, but on everything else, they disagree. You get a number of people of identical religious persuasion in a room and I guarantee you can get them to disagree on something. This is why religions then produce separatist factions ad infinitum.
My point is, why bother with all this? Why join a group with whom you can never share exactly all of the same beliefs?
Be like SqrlCub and define your beliefs on some simple moral absolutes. As long as you don’t give your beliefs a name, then no one can really oppose you.