Fuck all you warmongering pieces of shit

The BBQ Pit
1181

As I mentioned in my post, the real brains behind the coup were the UK. The US took quite some convincing to actually go along with it.

And of course Mossadegh was not a democrat. But he seemed to be genuinely popular (especially in the cities), and I would bet my right arm that the UK did not give a fig that he was a wannabe dictator: had Mossadegh not touched the oil concessions that the UK had, the UK would have left him alone. They cared not for the Iranian population, and I guess they never did.

I am convinced that the UK acted and convinced the US to help them because of the nationalization of the British oil companies operating in Iran with concessions that would have been valid until 1993, and that they didn’t care whether Mossadegh was a democrat or a tyrant; only that he dared fuck with the British oil companies.

That does not make Mossadegh a hero or a martyr. He makes him the target of an UK that was really angry at the loss of the Iranian oil. Other considerations (that Mossadegh was not a democratic leader) were not relevant for the UK at the time.

1182

If he had not touched the oil concessions but dissolved parliament anyways, you don’t think people loyal to the Shah like General Fazlollah Zahedi might have tried to counter-coup him without American or British support?

Seems to me that a counter-coup is a natural consequence of an auto-coup, whether Britain/America are involved or not.

Like most of the supposed US backed coups in Latin America or Eastern Europe, I think Western involvement is greatly overplayed and local support for the couping faction is greatly underplayed.

1183

Reporting that we destroyed a desalination plant. Why the fuck would we do that? How does this help anyone at all?

Fuck the warmongers.

1184

I coulda swore that the intentional destruction of vital civilian infrastructure was a war crime.

Practice relating to Rule 54.
Attacks against Objects Indispensable to the Survival of the Civilian Population
Section A. Attacks against objects
I. Treaties
Additional Protocol I
Article 54(2) of the 1977 Additional Protocol I provides:
It is prohibited to attack, destroy, remove, or render useless objects indispensable to the survival of the civilian population, such as foodstuffs, agricultural areas for the production of foodstuffs, crops, livestock, drinking water installations and supplies and irrigation works, for the specific purpose of denying them for their sustenance value to the civilian population or to the adverse Party, whatever the motive, whether in order to starve out civilians, to cause them to move away, or for any other motive.

Protocol Additional to the Geneva Conventions of 12 August 1949, and relating to the Protection of Victims of International Armed Conflicts (Protocol I), Geneva, 8 June 1977, Article 54(2). Article 54 was adopted by consensus. CDDH, Official Records, Vol. VI, CDDH/SR.42, 27 May 1977, p. 208.

Additional Protocol II
Article 14 of the 1977 Additional Protocol II provides:
Starvation of civilians as a method of combat is prohibited. It is therefore prohibited to attack, destroy, remove or render useless, for that purpose, objects indispensable to the survival of the civilian population, such as foodstuffs, agricultural areas for the production of foodstuffs, crops, livestock, drinking water installations and supplies and irrigation works.

Protocol Additional to the Geneva Conventions of 12 August 1949, and relating to the Protection of Victims of Non-International Armed Conflicts (Protocol II), Geneva, 8 June 1977, Article 14. Article 14 was adopted by consensus. CDDH, Official Records, Vol. VII, CDDH/SR.52, 6 June 1977, p. 137.

Clearly, this was just a fever dream brought on by my deep hatred of my homeland.

1185

This action likely WOULD be prosecuted as a war crime if the perpetrator were willing to be constrained by international law.

Since it’s not, it won’t.

1186

We did it in order to make Iranians suffer and die. They are already suffering from a water crisis, so I expect “die” isn’t hyperbole. There’s a recent thread about how bad it is in Tehran; I expect it just got worse.

1187

Right. It’s not like they’ve been hiding it. They’ve been triumphantly talking about “death from the skies” on the same day that it has basically been accepted that a US missile destroyed the girls’ school, killing 170+ children.

Not only do they not care about civilian life, but on the contrary – they want to rack up the score.

1188

Might have been the case, but that is a counterfactual that we will never be able to resolve one way or another. The fact is that Mossadegh did touch the oil and that was what made the UK plan for his overthrow.

As to coups in Latin America, some of the most outrageous ones were definitely US-arranged and promoted. Árbenz in Guatemala and Allende in Chile come immediately to mind. I would also include the failed invasion of the Bay of Pigs, although that one was not a coup per se.

It may well be that most of the coups in Latin America have not had the US behind them, but that does not mean that all of the coups were free of direct US intervention. And the ones that were orchestrated or assisted by the US are enough to make a lot of people in Latin America rather mistrustful of the US.

1189

Not worse in Tehran, but in 30 villages affected by the strike.

Iran’s response: to bomb a desalinization plant in another country.

1190

Note that the only source for this claim is the Iranian foreign minister. OSINT sources have seen satellite evidence of damage to nearby air and naval bases, but not the desalination plant.

Is it true, or just an excuse for Iran to launch strikes at Baharain’s water plants? No way to know yet.

1191

It’s weird that Iran thought of that! You never hear about one country bombing another country’s desalination plant.

1192

War? What war? This is “Project Epstein Fury”!

1193

No plan for Hormuz. So yes, in addition to be highly immoral, warmongers are dumb as fucking bricks. Yes, starting a war with idiots in charge, no mission, and no plan, is a terrible idea.

Dumb as a motherfucking brick. Yes, this means you, @Babale. Fuck you and all the other warmongers.

1194

I’ve been calling it Operation Epic Fail.

But yours is good, too.

1195

Seen in the SDMB: “Operation Epstein Bury”

1196

I named it that because you would have to be deliberately ignorant not to see that “Epstein Files” and “Epic Fury” have the same fucking initials.

1197

More consequences - increased prices for food:

Fucking idiot motherfucker warmongers. How the fuck could you trust Trump and his team of clowns to manage this properly? How the fuck did you get this stupid, @Babale? What the fuck were you thinking? You weren’t this dumb a few years ago. You should be ashamed. You should crawl into a hole and think about what’s wrong in your head that’s made you this stupid, and not come out until you’re ready to apologize and explain yourself.

1198

A cautionary example of how hardened ideology can lead a mind down some dark roads.

1199

I’m remembering nearly a quarter-century ago when the long-inactive poster @Sam_Stone, a self-professed libertarian and dedicated critic of Big Government ™, went all in on credulity about the Bush administration’s propaganda for the Iraq war. (Remember back then when the Exec Branch was talking up their invasion plans in order to coax official approval of declaring war from Congress? Ah, how naively we just took for granted back then that government lies were deployed in order to trick us into giving them permission, rather than simply as an accompaniment to doing whatever the fuck they wanted without permission!)

1200

I’ve been occasionally referring to it as Epic Frenzy.