[QUOTE=Otto]
Per Tim Kring, Zach was intended from the start to be gay. From here (some minor spoilers):
Following NBC’s announcement, Tim Kring gave this response
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Why did you quote me during this response? I never said you were wrong about the creators initial intent. The line you quoted was me questioning if the myspace page you were using as a cite was official or fanfic. The page looks sloppy, gives no real information and can’t be proved to be from NBC or anyone else associated with the show. Until it can be proven otherwise it shouldn’t be used as a cite. This doesn’t invalidate any of your other points and I wasn’t trying to imply that it did.
[QUOTE=Otto]
Um, because you were the one I was talking with?
[/QUOTE]
When you say “Per Tim Kring” you were answering to a particular point. You quoted him as saying he intended Zach to be gay. You used it as an answer to my post of:
[QUOTE=Me]
I’m not digging my heels in and saying it isn’t. I don’t know either way. Unless proven otherwise it shouldn’t be used as a cite for anything.
[/QUOTE]
I was not talking about if Tim Kring intended Zach to be gay. I never said he didn’t. I was questioning your use of the myspace page as a cite. You quoted me and then made a completely different point which was unrelated to my quote. Thats why I asked why you quoted me. No need for the Um.
[QUOTE=h.sapiens]
They’ve been getting weaker ever since he was unable to save Charlie’s life. Last week he managed to slow time way down in the museum, but not stop it altogether like he meant to. This week, he couldn’t do anything. Personally, I think it’s a matter of self-confidence, and doesn’t have anything to do with the sword.
[/QUOTE]
Hmmm. Maybe he needs a magic feather or something.
[QUOTE=Loach]
When you say “Per Tim Kring” you were answering to a particular point. You quoted him as saying he intended Zach to be gay. You used it as an answer to my post of:
I was not talking about if Tim Kring intended Zach to be gay. I never said he didn’t. I was questioning your use of the myspace page as a cite. You quoted me and then made a completely different point which was unrelated to my quote. Thats why I asked why you quoted me. No need for the Um.
[/QUOTE]
I really don’t care enough about this to continue. Sorry for any damage caused by responding to your post with my post.
[QUOTE=Loach]
This is a comicbook show. It wouldn’t be a comic book without psuedo-science. Or maybe I missed something and you really can get super powers from being bitten by a radioactive spider.
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I don’t have high standards of scrutiny for the science of this show, I understand that much. I just wish they’d leave it mystical or mysterious or even just invent some sort of made up concept to explain this. Hell, midichlorians would beat completely misusing real science and real things that exist to the degree that they do.
I mean, it’s a big deal to the show - one of the main characters is a geneticist, a key to the plot is his father’s genetic “theories”, etc. And in those heavy handed voiceovers, they’re always talking about evolution erroneously, and like it has a consciousness of its own - as if evolution were some intelligent force deliberately manipulating humans in some way.
Just all of it - all the genetics stuff, all the stuff about evolution, is nails-on-chalkboard irritating to me, since it’s so wrong. I’d much rather they invented some sort of mystical crap about it, or even just left it a mystery as to why it’s happening.
Edit: As a prime example, remember when one of the characters asked “If genetics can determine I go bald or get fat, can’t they determine if I can fly?!”
[QUOTE=Otto]
I really don’t care enough about this to continue. Sorry for any damage caused by responding to your post with my post.
[/QUOTE]
Anytime you really want to respond go ahead. Just try to respond with something related to what I was talking about. Your lack of comprehension did no damage so no worries. But thanks for your concern.
[QUOTE=SenorBeef]
I don’t have high standards of scrutiny for the science of this show, I understand that much. I just wish they’d leave it mystical or mysterious or even just invent some sort of made up concept to explain this. Hell, midichlorians would beat completely misusing real science and real things that exist to the degree that they do.
I mean, it’s a big deal to the show - one of the main characters is a geneticist, a key to the plot is his father’s genetic “theories”, etc. And in those heavy handed voiceovers, they’re always talking about evolution erroneously, and like it has a consciousness of its own - as if evolution were some intelligent force deliberately manipulating humans in some way.
Just all of it - all the genetics stuff, all the stuff about evolution, is nails-on-chalkboard irritating to me, since it’s so wrong. I’d much rather they invented some sort of mystical crap about it, or even just left it a mystery as to why it’s happening.
Edit: As a prime example, remember when one of the characters asked “If genetics can determine I go bald or get fat, can’t they determine if I can fly?!”
I hate to disappoint you but I don’t think it is going to get better. I wish it would too but I’m just going to think happy thoughts when they start talking “science” and enjoy the rest of the show.
Sorry to go on about this, but Loach, at least with a radioactive spider, there’s a … radioactive spider. There’s at least an effort made to give us something that goes from A to B to C (like SenorBeef said, at least give us midichlorians).
With the list of people, there’s no link. How does the Human Genome Project provide DNA evidence for all these people? It doesn’t. There’s no B there. It would be like saying that an ordinary old spider bit Peter Parker, or Bruce Banner just cut his hand on a tire iron and turned into the Hulk.
Give me something I can use. I’m willing to suspend my belief, but I need at least something to suspend it on.
[QUOTE=Hentor the Barbarian]
Sorry to go on about this, but Loach, at least with a radioactive spider, there’s a … radioactive spider. There’s at least an effort made to give us something that goes from A to B to C (like SenorBeef said, at least give us midichlorians).
With the list of people, there’s no link. How does the Human Genome Project provide DNA evidence for all these people? It doesn’t. There’s no B there. It would be like saying that an ordinary old spider bit Peter Parker, or Bruce Banner just cut his hand on a tire iron and turned into the Hulk.
Give me something I can use. I’m willing to suspend my belief, but I need at least something to suspend it on.
[/QUOTE]
Ok let me try. You got genes. You got a genetist. You got the Human Genome Project… Ok I got nothing. No idea how he got street addresses from the HGP. Maybe a spider was involved somehow. Or radioactivity.
Or there are steps in Papa Suresh’s work that they haven’t shown, like that he has been using DNA samples from actual people along with the genome project as some kind of baseline.
[QUOTE=ArrMatey!]
Theory: Jessica isn’t dead. Niki is. Niki is an alternate ‘repressive’ personality of Jessica.
No particular evidence to support this one, but it’s the sort-of twist that I’d expect.
Speaking of twists… I avoided this show like the plague because I heard it wasn’t bibled- that the stuff isn’t really planned in advance, and when you have such a complex storyline with so many diverse characters, it means continuity errors sneak in (and I hates me some continuity errors. Let’s start with Claire’s age…). Sadly, my comic-book-geek-ness and the excellent use of cliffhangers has drawn me in.
I -am- getting a little peeved about the ‘adding more metahumans every other week’ thing they seem to be doing. Hey, writers? Tie up some storylines, PLEASE?! Otherwise, you may start getting the same disatisfaction that people are starting to get for Lost. Thank you.
[/QUOTE]
I’m a continuity geek myself and I like spotting them. But with this show, for now, I’m thinking of cutting them some slack. I really think the show has changed direction in this second half of season one. Maybe some characters who were originally going to die aren’t going to now. Or vice versa (hah! I said versa. Pay me).
Niki’s story feels a bit like they’re not sure where to go with it. Telepacop also feels like that. And Mystery Sock (Isaac) really seems strange right now. I almost liked him better as a junkie. He’s kinda chirpy now, isn’t he? And he really needs to work on those arms. He’s got girl arms.
Then there’s Peter and Invisible Guy. Where’d that come from? I wonder if Peter was originally slated to die but now they’re setting him up to live. And Invisi-Brit has been mentoring super beings for awhile now? Years? It feels like they just came up with that.
I agree with you in that I don’t want it to turn into an episodic super-being of the week show. The 4400 started doing that and it’s a little boring. Is that show even coming back or was it canceled?
[QUOTE=Loach]
I believe you are reading too much into it. I have said it before, this is not a very twisty show. What they show you is what it is. Jessica died, she was killed by her father. Niki created the persona of Jessica as a defense mechanism against her father’s abuse. When her powers started to manifest they stayed with the Jessica side because that is the strong personality, the one that always protected her. There is a mental block keeping Niki from using her powers, not a physical one. There is only one person with another personality formed because of childhood trauma. Now that Niki is starting to understand this she will probably integrate Jessica and her powers into herself. It has already started, she broke the baton as Niki.<snip>
[/quote]
Perhaps. They do want to give us some twists and turns, and I think Niki will be one of those.
They may be a comic book, but they’re still basically following the sci-fi rule, as most shows of this type do (and for a good reason - you can only leap so far and expect the audience to stay with you).
[QUOTE=featherlou]
Perhaps. They do want to give us some twists and turns, and I think Niki will be one of those.
[/QUOTE]
You may be right, just my opinion. I don’t have any inside information. Time will tell. But I know I’m right
[QUOTE=featherlou]
They may be a comic book, but they’re still basically following the sci-fi rule, as most shows of this type do (and for a good reason - you can only leap so far and expect the audience to stay with you).
[/QUOTE]
I’m expecting no hard science fiction. The best I can hope for is not retching during the science talk. I can leap pretty far if the rest of the show is entertaining. I just pretend that they are discussing alternate evolution theories as intelligently as Greg Bear did in Darwin’s Radio. You have to realize this show was created by Tim Kring, the man who gave us Crossing Jordan. Don’t expect science, expect pretty people doing entertaining things for your amusement.
I would just like to say that when a 17 year old actress is playing a 15 year old character, I’d much appreciate it if they wouldn’t have her falling out of her top, and having her hair obscure her chest isn’t much help. Cut us hetero guys who haven’t been a teenager for a couple decades a break and keep the young’uns fully dressed, okay?
As for Zach’s sexuality, why can’t you just think of him as bi? The raging debate about what big meanies the NBC suits are for “inning” him is tiresome, especially given the cite that implies it didn’t come from NBC suits at all.
IIRC, that’s exactly what happened. In a recent tv guide interview the creators said exactly that, though there’s a slim chance they were talking about Nathan. I’m almost sure it was Peter, though.
