That interview is very revealing. He blames the problems on the format - it is not that it is “a flawed way of telling a story.” He’s telling a flawed story. The story is a mess. The characters are a mess. The plotlines are a mess. And that has very little to do with my ability to DVR and everything to do with his inability to write a decent book, worldbuild, or run the show.
The way his writing staff works explains why there are wild changes in personality from week to week. That he doesn’t see how disastrous that is is an issue.
He doesn’t understand that the show’s comic book fans have long memories. and the show’s DVR/DVD fans don’t need them.
And this:
is just stupid. Normal people haven’t gone underground. I know what he means, but the words he chose to express it do not inspire confidence.
I don’t think it’s nitpicking to point out that they just had a flashback show making the point, over and over again, that most of the characters were living non-superpowered lives one year ago.
I really thought the eclipse in the pilot was just symbolic. So now it’s a Magic Eclipse? And do they have to be so aggressively wrong astronomically? Mohinder referred to it as an annular eclipse, but also referred to night becoming day. You don’t get those two things together. And, of course, neither an annular nor a full eclipse can be seen from both the U.S. and Japan.
ETA: I’m doing it again – complaining about the show, yet I keep watching it. I think we can all agree that, given the premise and the production values available, if the show had a great writing staff it would totally rock. It has occasional flashes of brilliance; enough to keep me hoping.
I sympathise. I had a long post pointing out most of the cast were already using their powers prior to the eclipse and then deleted it. And yeah, I should really just stop watching. I’m aware pointing out all the flaws week after week is like continually sticking my hand in the fire and then expecting people to sympathise over the blisters. But like you, I keep desperately hoping it will turn things around. Now I think this won’t happen unless Tim Kring can be ousted from the show
Yeah, like me and my newsletter;) I still watch because there’s a whole bunch of fun in there still, and I think they may be developing a story over the long view that will pull it all together. I have also sent my letter to Santa this week, so take that as you will.
Hubris, the Kring party is here. Actually it wouldn’t take much to shake the stupid off this show at all- figure out who these characters are, and have their actions be consistent with what we’ve seen of them. Then, let them grow and change through what they’ve experienced. They were getting there with Niki-trying to incorporate her ability into her life and stay sane, she only grew strong once she lost her strength- and died doing it. Coulda let that character play out, and still have figured out how to get her and Nathan in the sack. Ando, too- I like him, he’s got spunk. Evil decapitator is trying to take your best friend’s head off? Come charging at his like a madman! Hey, it worked. Boy’s got courage. He’s Zander-no powers, but always the first one to pick up an axe and start swinging at the vampires.
I’m sure there’s some writers in Whedon’s posse who could sign on-they were great at long term character development.
I think Kring took people’s bitching about season 2 and its meandering lack of cha-cha plotting too much to heart. Too much time on Claire and her dopey romance and evil road trips through Mexico? Well, allrighty then- we’ll shoot season 3 straight out of a cannon, maybe you nerds’ll like that!
As someone who paid cash money to see The Core in the theatre I have a pretty high tolerance for shit science(Mohinder born with an antibody for a virus he was never exposed to? 'kay.) But geeze, let’s hope the eclipses are just concurrent with people getting/losing abilities and not a contributor. Hey, when Hiro got dropped into the 17th century he stopped time mid eclipse to dodge some arrows- so hope they’ve worked out the technobabble. See Kring? When people watch an ep a couple of times on the ipod, we remember this kind of goofy shit. Embrace it, dude.
I am desperately hoping that Bryan Fuller’s new availability hasn’t gone unobserved by the PTB at NBC and that they bring him back, this time as showrunner (has anyone ever been fired from a show they created, I wonder?) I agree with you that there’s still plenty of potential left in Heroes, most noticeably that fantastic cast. Certainly they’re the only thing that keeps me tuning in at the moment and it’s one of the reasons I sometimes feel a bit bad for laughing at it - they all look like they are desperately trying to make it all work and build bricks without straw. Still, ironic detachment is indeed probably the way to view it for now
I think only by offering up said cookies and backpack of cash, or indeed whatever it takes, do they have any chance of being able to make that final quarter of a season and beyond. As it is, with Tim Kring in charge, I think this show has had it.
Think of it like this. If people like us stopped watching, the ratings would drop and Heroes would have joined the other “didn’t order the back 9” shows that got their cancellation notices this week.
We’re keeping it on the air.
Ando may be my favorite character on the show; he usually talks sense, shows real courage and friendship, and at the same time has started standing up for himself more.
I wonder if Hiro’s sister will ever come into the picture? It would be strange if she didn’t have some kind of power. (Come to think of it, did we ever find out what power Hiro’s father had?)
I don’t think Hiro could function without Ando. Neither of them are exactly brilliant strategists by any stretch, but I think Ando often serves as the voice of reason and anchors Hiro to reality.
There was a deleted scene on the DVDs (when Hiro was gone to feudal Japan) between Kaito and Ando where he revealed he had accelerated probability (or something like that… basically he was very very good at the stock market, and other similar things). It was never aired and I don’t think they ever made it “cannon” however.
I think the writing suffers from a lack of pre-planning, ultimately. It seems like they have only a very broad outline of the entire season arc, but don’t bother to drill down to specific things that need to happen along the way. So the episodes are basically just slapped down one on top of another, with a vague sense of having to get from point A to point B but no plan on what path gets them there, so if one writer strays off into the wilderness, the others are scrambling to correct it, which leads to more tangents, more corrections, and ultimately a big discontinuous mess. Sigh.
They did it well the first season, the story seemed to be very specifically planned out. Why’d they give up on outlining? This is the worst kind of writing-by-committee. Each writer writes for one character? You do know that characters have to interact with each other, right? That all together they have to drive the direction of the plot?
I’m still hoping for a salvage, here, but man is it getting hard.
Only if all you are concerned about is financial gain. Since much of Heroes is derived from comics anyway, I would bring up Marvel comics’ Scarlet Witch, a mutant with the ability to affect probability. That ended up being a MAJOR factor in some storylines that had nothing to do with material wealth.
Don’t the experts tell you to diversify your portfolio anyway? I mean, I’m sure having some of your money in precious metals is great, but not all of it…
