Yep, her loss, and you’ve gained some insight. It’s good.
There is some seriously bad advice going on in this thread.
Don’t care about her feelings? Are you kidding me? Of course you should care about her feelings, but don’t make your existence about her feelings. You should care about everybody’s feelings, women or men; at least a decent person would in my opinion. Simply caring about how someone feels does not make you unattractive, it’s the attitude and demeanor you have about the situation.
tdn, no offense intended man, I like most of your posts but recently you strike me as a guy that just learned all this stuff and you are overzealous about it. The funny thing is, I believe you have stated that you’ve already gone down this route and are just now doing it again. Some of the information may be true, and I certainly believe Beware of Doug has the wrong idea about it; but if you truly want to be attractive you should be your own man. I don’t mean that in the way that you always hear people say it too, “If she’s not happy with me not having a job and eating Cheetos all day then fuck her, I change for no one.” Always improve your life, always, but do it for yourself. Not for women, not to become a master pick up artist, not because you saw it in a video, you do it for no other reason than because you deserve to become a better man then you were the day before. If you don’t at least try to grow as a person, you may as well be dead.
Autolycus you are approaching this the wrong way. Fostering attraction is not a goal or skill, but simply a by-product of living life the way it should be lived. Take pride in who you are. Be passionate, strive to do your best, enjoy life. Walk tall with your chest out, shoulders back, and head held high. Make your life one that impacts others, and people will want to become a part of that. Be confident without being arrogant. Be humble without being meek. Become a man that someone would be attracted to, and then you are attractive. Learn what you want out of life and do your damndest to get it. Attitude is key. Be a genuinely nice guy, and not one of the whiny, passive-aggressive bullshitters who complain that women don’t like nice guys. Life is beautiful, and girls are but one aspect of it; act upon that. Also, remember to respect other people without forgetting to respect yourself (this is where many younger guys fail).
msmith537 has it right, too. If you are interested in someone romantically, pursue them as such. Make sure they know where you stand on the matter (by your actions and not your words), and take it from there.
I am not calling you out or anything TokyoPlayer, as I agree with what you have said thus far. I am just commenting on this because it happens quite a bit, but it depends on the situation. Some girls are very indirect and are using this as an opening to see how you feel. As an example, some girls will say that “so-and-so” thinks you are cute when they are really trying to say that they think you are cute. Some girls are trying to play games with your mind. Some girls are trying to gauge how you feel by trying to make you jealous. Then of course there are girls that genuinely want to know if that guy likes them. The important thing is learning from each experience so you begin to understand how to read these types of things. More importantly, as you learn you can react to them in the way that you want to; not by basing your actions off some script.
Well said. And that’s pretty much where I am. Overzealous? Yeah, but I’ll mellow. I tend to get excited about new things.
I’m the same way. 
In fact, I recognized the overzealousness because I did the exact same thing on this subject a few years back. I hope I didn’t come off as a jerk.
You should have seen me when I got a new train set a few years back. No adult should be that enthused about a train set.
Like, when she goes to sleep at night, be right there in the corner of her room so she wakes up and thinks of you.
Aren’t I supposed to feel good about myself on my own, and not need a man to do that for me??
Brandon knows what he’s talking about. Listen to him.
Here has what has worked for me over the years in fostering attraction:
Make friends with people who are social - You will increase the boundaries of your experiences as your friends will be both willing to join you in activities and will come up with activities you may not have thought of. Plus people are naturally attracted to people who have friends.
Join a gym - You’ll look and feel beter. Besides, it’s kind of nice when a girl grabs your arm or chest and is pleasently surprised. (These days, mostly my girlfriend “fluffs” my stomach area to make it more comfortible to rest her head on 
)
Join an athletics team - In high school, I found people looked and treated me differently once I started playing ice hockey. I wasn’t awesome, but I gave it serious effort and people respect that.
Join clubs or other social networks - Fraternities were big in my school so I joined one. They are a good way to meet other people and get noticed. Other activities are good too. Anything where people see you doing something where you stand out in a positive way.
Graduate from good college - Lets face it. A girl is going to be more impressed by someone who graduated from Harvard than someone who graduated from UMass. In the short run, all the dumb girls you went to high school with will still be after the jocks who went off to State. But you probably wouldn’t give any of them the time of day four years later when you’re off making money and they’re either knocked up or working as a waitress in some diner.
Throw a party now and then - People like being invited to stuff, even if they don’t know you that well.
Get a good job - Your much more appealing to women as an architect, lawyer, investment banker or doctor than you would managing a Staples branch.
Live in a neighborhood where other young singles live - There’s nothing worse socially than living somewhere where there are no other people around.
Be knowledgeable about interesting things - You should be able to discuss current music, know some decent restaurants, bars and clubs, and be versed in current events. Basically you want to know enough about enough things to hold a conversation with just about anyone.
and some things to avoid:
Downplay your geeky hobbies - The world doesn’t need to know how much you like D&D, Monty Python, Lord of the Rings, anime, Sci-Fi, videogames or The Simpsons. These things do not make you more attractive to women. They make you appear juvenile.
Avoid associating with jerks - Whether it is the arrogant asshole variety or the immature weirdo, avoid associating with people who turn off other people.
Avoid anti-social subcultures - I don’t know much about “Emo” or “Goth” kids, but growing up, joining the small close-knot band of all-black Robert Smith wannabees helped ensure that those would be your only friends. Then again, that might just be the look these days and sometimes a lot of messed-up promiscuous girls hang out with those groups. So I guess use your own judgement.
Don’t discuss what makes you attractive - The quickest way to lose attractiveness is to all of a sudden point out to people why you are attractive. It will immediate make it the lamest thing about you. For example “I learned to play the guitar to meet girls”.
I am immediately attracted to men who take a real interest in what I say and indicate later that they they have heard and remembered it. I am also immediately turned off by invasions to my emotional space and attention (often called creepy or stalkerish behaviour, because that’s what it feels like). There is a thin line. But here is how men have navigated it for me:
In the early stages of getting to know each other, he indicates that they he has heard and remembered something I’ve said to them that I found important in some way. Once or twice, and nothing really heavy - preferably something that made me laugh when I told him about it the first time. Any more than once or twice (in the getting to know each other stage, that is) makes him seem obsessive.
A good way to do this - in group conversations, meet my eye and share an inside joke, and when I smile, rejoin the group conversation. This makes me feel like you’re thinking about me while still being interested in the rest of the group.
But really, Brandon’s should be the last words on the subject (reposted for truth from upthread)
Great advice, but a) why does the gym have donuts, and b) why do you have to be mean to them?
This isn’t an overarching theme, but just a few sidenotes:
-
You know how guys make fun of each other for laughs? Reverse it for girls (and knock it off w/ the guys while girls can hear you). Tell them something random that’s great about them. Example: While passing in the hallway at work, I just said “Jess, I like your style.” She giggled…“What style?” “Just…your style.” and carried on. It didn’t mean anything, but it was obviously positive. She liked that.
-
On a scale of 1 to 10, 1 being aloof or even asshole-ish and 10 being a lost puppy, don’t try to be a 5. Be an 8, then a 3, then an 8. At the high end, the girl figures she has you. At the bottom, she doesn’t want you. In the middle, she’s your friend. If you cycle through it, she’ll check back w/ you to see if you’ll be an 8 that day and if not, she’ll try to make you be an 8. It’s the old intermitent positive reinforcement trick. Slot machines can hook people using it. So can you.
I don’t claim to be an expert but I’ve got no shortage of girls liking me.
I’m horrible at talking to women in clubs - partly because I find it hard to think of things to say, but mainly because I CAN’T HEAR YOU, THIS MUSIC IS REALLY LOUD.
Er, sorry. So yah, that never really works for me. That said - I think the best thing you can do to attract women you spend a lot of time with (for instance, I’m in law school) is to just do interesting things, and be ready to talk about them. If you’re athletic, join a sports team. If you’re a giant nerd (like me!), go to guest lectures, or get involved in student politics, and make a point of saying/asking interesting things. You’ll get noticed by people - some of those people will be women, and some of those women will be ones you find attractive. So, do what you do anyway - but do it well, and with style.
For example, a really cute girl I know just asked me to get involved in some student politics stuff. (The details don’t matter - and trust me, you don’t want to know them.) So I wrote a couple of essays for the student senate webpage, and made a couple speeches at a senate meeting, and now she thinks I’m kind of cool. In fact, I’m pretty sure she wouldn’t mind going on a date or two - she makes a point of inviting me to her shindigs, giving me a very warm “Hi, Mr. Excellent!” when she sees me, and so forth.
Of course, none of this matters, because (a) I’m totally gutless, and (b) I’m not sure I even want to go out with this girl. (She’s very cool, but there’s someone else I’m more interested in). But my point still stands - doing whatever it is you do, and doing it well, can absolutely provide you with opportunities.
My post was a critisism to the “Ladder Theory” which was calling women bitches because wimpy guys hang around girls for months or years waiting for the girl to fall in love with them. They then allow themselves to become a sounding board for the girl’s love interests. That’s stupid on all levels.
There is a world of difference between indirect comments which are used by them to test the water and getting relegated to a “girl friend of the male sex” kiss of death. If the girl’s comments are the start of flirting, then you flirt back and if all goes well, you’re in.
If it’s an ongoing head game to make you jealous, then run like hell 'cuz people who play head games all the time aren’t worth it, not matter if they are wildfires in bed and cute as hell. Been there. Actually, there may be worth in going out with a fucked up chick at some time, because the sex is great and you will really appreciate women who have their heads screwed on straight. I just couldn’t take the damn games, though.
Brandon and others who have given good advice on living an attractive life are correct. It’s not a show and it’s not a play. I think that’s one of the serious problems with books like The Rules and other advice which recommends game-playing. It may attract people, (and I’ll get back to that in the next paragraph) but if it’s not you, then what do you do after you get them? Wait for a book The Rules, Part II – How to Live a Live of Games? That’s worse no fun; it’s not being yourself. I couldn’t imagine living in worry that my wife were going to discover that she had been attracted to something that wasn’t me and then is going to dump me.
The main objection I have to The Rules et al, is the type of people that it attracts. This would be great junior or high school material when everyone is still trying to figure the dating stuff out and you get dumped for wearing the wrong color of socks, but adults who get excited about manipulative behavior are not the type of people I want to hang around with, let along contemplate sharing a bed for the rest of my life.
When you start off with low self-confidence it’s hard to understand the advice about being confident. You don’t need to start off feeling confident about how you are with women, and really it may be impossible to have confidence in something you aren’t good at. For me, it went the other way. When I was working at a previous job, I got a major promotion, where I became the sales manager. Suddenly, I was excited about what I was doing, I was getting results and was more confident in myself. Women could sense this, even when I wasn’t talking about work. Especially when I wasn’t talking about work, because that’s when I would tend to brag (which I’ve learned to tone down).
The sex columnist Dan Savage talks about the importance of not hanging around in mediocre relationships because it supplies a partial answer for your needs. Instead, he says to get motivated to doing what is required to be attractive. Go to the gym. Etc. etc.
Some people understand this better. Others need to learn and some people never get it.
Throw out some shotgun negs.
I’ve found a neg here and there really does work.
Steppin’ up my game, being a nice guy has never gotten me laid… they want to be dicked.
“We have to stop bumping into each other like this. There must be some law against it.”
"That would be pretty hot. It would make our relationship a total taboo. Quick! Take my hand! We must remain hidden before we’re caught!
run her behind the nearest building
Great post, but this is the part I found most interesting.
“Hey, I went to Harvard and not UMass. I’m teh hawt.”
Fucking braggart.
Wouldn’t it be much more interesting if you carried Harvard in your eyes, or in your walk?
This is an excellent point. Some have said that PUAs lie to girls to get them into bed. That they are not being themselves. The best ones are not faking it, they are being themselves more than they have ever been. They are basically living up to their potential. I think this is the point that Brandon is making.
I heard one really fascinating gambit that I would never try. I’ll tell it to you, but I urge you not to try it. It might get you laid, but it also might get you arrested.
Go to the rich part of town. Go to a bank there. Fish through the trash until you find an ATM receipt with a huge balance printed on it. $6,000? Good. $10,000? Better. $102,576? Fantastic.
Pocket it. When you meet that special someone, write down your number. Write it on that ATM receipt. Guaranteed, she will call you. You will get laid.
But what’s wrong with this scenario? Hint: Make sure you wind up at her place. You run a huge risk of being seen as a phony if you live in a tiny apartment.
You are correct (if I read this correctly). A guy who goes around throwing is Harvard degree in people’s face is regarded as a douche (there’s actually a whole thread on this somewhere). If you went to Harvard (or any elite school) it should be obvious by your dress and mannarisms. I can tell the difference in two seconds between someone who went to a top school and someone who went to a regular state college.
I’ll just echo what **Brandon ** said. Don’t be a phony. People can spot a phony. “Fake it 'til you make it” doesn’t work. Whether its a phony display of wealth, career, ability, interests or attitude, you will give away subtle clues that you are full of shit. My girlfriend (an NYU MBA) used to get hit on guys who would pretend to be investment bankers. Aside from the $5,000 watch you aren’t wearing, why do you not know where the Lehman Brothers building is? Why can’t you explain what market you are in?
And don’t go around acting like a jerk because that’s what you think women respond to. I don’t even know what that means “be assholeish”. What, like call them a dirty whore or something?
You read it correctly.
What are you basing this on? I’d either think the guy was writing on a scrap of paper he found on the ground or was an obnoxious prick who assumes every woman he meets is a gold digger. Calling him back or screwing him would have more to do with, oh I don’t know, whatever I’d felt for him before getting his number.
And most women I know make more than their SOs.