These stories usually start out the same way and mine is no different. So there is a girl at my school that I have fallen for hard. I have known her for the past few years but I did not start hanging out with her socially until the fall semester. We play sports together constantly because she is extremely athletic. She has also been bringing me baked goods for the past few weeks when I am working through dinner. When it comes to girlfriend material she is everything I want and more, if not for one detail. She is very Christian. She regularly attends bible study and various church groups and she goes to services every Sunday. It took me a while to realize how Christian she was, however, because unlike most religious Christians that I have encountered, she is not preachy. She does not wander around demanding others to accept Christ as their personal lord and savior and she does not spend her time spouting bible passages and propaganda. I only found out how religious she was by adding up the various group meetings she attends. The list is substantial.
As a point of clarification, I was raised Christian and now I am agnostic. Personally, I am indifferent towards the existence of god and when it comes to Jesus he was just another preacher who said some nice things about morality. I do not think that all Christians are idiots but the idea of dating someone who gives Christianity priority in her life scares me. I have only dated faux Christians who go to church on Easter and check the ‘Christian’ box on surveys. I am, generally, not an asshole about religion but I often have difficulty hiding my true feelings about the hypocrisy of it all. Eventually, whether we date or not, my disdain will surface and threaten the relationship.
I thought that I would be able to draw some experience from my friendships with people of faith but I soon realized that zero of my close friends are practicing Christians. I would like to hear from dopers of faith who are with or have been with atheists/agnostics and vice versa. Why did your relationships work and why did they fail? Any and all advice and insight is very welcome. Thanks for your time and consideration.
I was in an eerily similar situation. I’m a Christian and was friends with an indifferent agnostic who had previously been a Christian. We crossed the line and started dating and fell madly in love. There was a bit of pressure from my side of the family - “do not be unequally yoked” and all that. When we got more serious and talked about marriage, most people were very skeptical. The bottom line? We’ve been married twelve years and have two children. And I’m still a Christian and he’s still agnostic. For us the key has been accepting each other as we are. We agreed to tell our children about what we each believe, along with explanations of other religions/life philosophies. And, most importantly, we made a commitment to each other to NEVER try to change the other’s stance. We discussed this before we got married, when I agreed that while I would not stop praying for him (safe travel, recovery from illness, etc.), I would never pray for him to become a Christian (something I have honored). And he agreed not to ever slight or mock my beliefs.
There is a big difference between discussing what hypocrites abortion-clinic bombers are and asking your girlfriend why she believes in such garbage. My husband and I do discuss religion of course - it’s not like it’s taboo. He’s quite free to express disdain, but at something other than me!
If you start dating, and it becomes serious on your part, you first need to figure out if your lack of religion is going to exclude YOU from *her * pool of eligible partners. It could very well be that she won’t want anything to do with you outside of a warm friendship.
If she accepts your lack of faith, you both fall madly in love with each other and pledge your hearts for eternity, you’ll need to decide if your children will be raised within or without the church. It sounds like she could have strong feelings about this. Will you be willing to sacrifice your children to a mindset and lifestyle you are uncomfortable with?
You’ll have in-laws. Gotta feel out that sitch, too.
That said, folks work it out all the time. It’s not impossible, but it may be too big a sacrifice for some. The answers to all these questions will take time to flesh out. Good luck.
My SO is Christian. I am not. I am a Deist that leans more towards the agnostic view that it doesn’t matter if we can prove he exists or not (nor that we can). I have issues with the typical “mainstream” Christian ideologies.
My SO is from what I can tell, old earth Creationist, old school religion. She isn’t too preachy, and she doesn’t force me to church or anything of the like, but she doesn’t “believe” in evolution, and her political views are pretty much what her church tells her.
I love her and think she is the one. She knows my feelings on things like Evolution, Hell and the all the other controversial topics and loves me anyway.
Relationships aren’t two identical people. Everybody has differences, and it is those differences, I think, that makes a relationship stronger.
I’m a 27 year old athiest who’s been dating an American Baptist for just about a year now.
Everyone has given good advice so far.
We’ve been very happy, and have even been able to discuss religious/moral issues in a fun and engaging way.
The big question, though, and the small elephant in the room that’s getting larger and larger in our relationship is this:
if we were contemplating marriage and children, how would we raise our kids? I would have a very hard time with kids going to a Christian church. It might be a deal-breaker for me. I think that she would have a very hard time with her kids not going to a Christian church, and it might be a deal-breaker for her.
Like I said, we haven’t really talked about this yet, but I imagine that in the upcoming months we may have to.
She is very smart. Probably on the lower end of what the average is here at SDMB, but definately as smart or smarter than myself (I think she said her IQ was 120 something, mid 20s). She is a bit gullible and maybe naive, but I don’t think believing what you are brainwashed into believing from a very young age is a mark against intelligence.
I have high respect for her, regardless of her erroneous beliefs.
I see two potential red flags from your post. The less serious is on her part. Many people who are devoutly Christian do want LTRs with other people who are also Christian. Do interfaith relationships work? Of course; all the time. But it certainly can be problematic and may even be a deal-breaker. But this girl sounds like a very nice girl, she isn’t prostletizing you, and you enjoy her company. I don’t see any reason why you couldn’t go out and see how things go.
The more serious red flag, IMO, is on your side, when you say “Eventually, whether we date or not, my disdain will surface and threaten the relationship.” If you know that to be true and are willing to predict it as a certainty now, before you’ve even dated her, then I think you should leave the girl alone. Someone you respect and like should not be placed in the position to experience your eventual disdain, regardless of whether you’re talking about religion, cooking methods, or the utility of the designated hitter rule. If you can’t trust yourself far enough to know that you will be respectful of her beliefs and chalk them up to just one of the ways people are different, then I don’t think you should do anything other than casually date her, with no expectation it will go any further.
I say this because I am a Christian and if I knew a guy was thinking, “I’d love to date her but I know my disdain for her faith will eventually come out and threaten the relationship,” my response would be “No thanks, keep walkin’.” I’m not interested in dating someone who disdains my beliefs AND is confident he will not be able to resist letting me know that someday, and in a way that threatens the relationship. Pass.
I’m a Zen Buddhist married happily to a Reform Jew, and when the time comes, we’ll raise the kids with the Jewish structure until such time as they’re old enough to be interested and able to easily find their own way to God (or, as the case may be, G-d, or enlightenment, or whatever).
It takes a lot of understanding and a whole-hearted belief from both parties that there are many routes to comprehending the Divine and what it may or may not want, and it takes one devil of a lot of mutual respect.
This is why a lot of religious people just won’t date outside their faiths. It’s really hard to invest time and deep emotions into a relationship only to find out that it has no chance of working. OTOH, there is a lot more room for compromise that may first appear, if two people really love each other and want to be together.
You don’t. You already used the word ‘disdain’ in connection with the situation. I couldn’t even conceive of using such a word in any connection with someone I love. And the fact that you used the word ‘brainwashed’ means you think that she can be ‘reprogrammed’ someday to what you seem to think is more reasonable.
Leave her alone. You already believe something false; that people who are religious haven’t sufficient intelligence to choose religion and apprehend it intellectually. This does not equate with thinking they are smart.
Respect is a vital element of love. Where disrespect exists, love dies. Find a fellow scorner and live together happily mocking those you deem ‘brainwashed’.
Or why a lot of non-religious people just won’t date into a faith!
It is tough, but as you say, there may be more room for compromise, and more desire to find compromise, after you’ve already found out that you can have a satisfying and loving relationship.
And, I think it also depends on how much a person is an “in the moment” person vs a “planning for the future” person. I don’t know where I’ll be a year from now, but my life this past year has been very much better than it would have been without her, and I know she feels the same. “Better to have loved and lost,” etc etc etc. (Not that I’m predicting an end to my relationship, but there are definitely some weighty and important decisions that will have to be made by the both of us at some point).
Aside from the faith issues that others have mentioned, there are also the time issues. What if, for example, she were really into tennis? What if she spent a substantial amount of time each week playing tennis and coaching tennis and watching tennis on TV, while you had no interest in tennis and thought it was pretty much a waste of time. Would you be happy with a girlfriend who spent so much time doing (and hanging around with other people who were interested in) something that you had no interest in? Would you try to get her to minimize her involvement, and would there be resentment on your part if she didn’t or on her part if she did?
In my opinion, I think potential children are the biggest issue here. Perhaps you and she can agree to disagree about faith but if she would like any children to be raised with her belief, you will need to be willing to support that 100% and leave your opinions to yourself. The same goes for her if you agree to raise the child without religion. Religion isn’t just faith, it is tradition and many people who feel wishy washy about it often decide they want the kids to follow the same traditions as they were brought up. I guess that is a discussion you should have sooner rather than later.
I’ve been able to forge a good marriage with a Christian (our relationship is similar to what Blue Mood expressed. We leave each other alone about our beliefs). Part of the reason it works for us, though, is that my wife is a very open minded and tolerant sort of Christian. She’s a church going Catholic but she might be more accurately described as what some people call a “Red Letter Christian.” She doesn’t proselytize and has never shown any interest in converting others. She’s socially liberal (pro-gay rights, pro-choice) and educated. She not only accepts evolution but loves the subject and is fascinated by hominid evolution (she majored in physical anthropology as an undergrad and can identify all the skulls and stuff).
Really, there isn’t much difference between us except that she prays and goes to mass on sundays and I don’t. I do think that if she was a hardcore fundy type it would be a lot more difficult. I think I would have also had a tough time staying with someone who “didn’t believe in” evolution. It would be hard for me to respect someone who showed such a lack of critical thinking skills.
The key point is whether or not the two of them can agree to disagree about religion and just leave it at that. A couple of my friends just broke up a few weeks ago because one is fairly Christian and the other is converting to Judaism. The guy who’s Christian couldn’t accept that she was converting and kept trying to convert her back; she was perfectly fine with dating a Christian so long as he stopped preaching at her. He would stop, she dumped him.
Well if the girl is not as sensitive as **Quiddity Glomfuster ** appears to be it can work out.
Mixed marriages work all the time. She might be devout and yet understanding. I would think the biggest issue would be if you two get very serious, how to raise the kids. It seems few mixed households do as mine does and raises the kids without faith. I am ex-Catholic agnostic and my wife is Jewish but not practicing. We are not subjecting our kids to any religion. They can make such a decision as informed adults and I will try to support them or they can choose to be agnostic or atheist.
She might insist on the kids being raised in her faith. You would also have to find out if her faith insists on you being of the same faith for Marriage. Several religions are tough on this area.
Who knows, maybe she only goes to church groups because she already is having a crisis of faith.
No matter what, I would say go for it and see how it works out.
