Didn’t you guys have studying to do? Weren’t you supposed to be getting an education or something?
You know, this might be right. But I’m not sure it necessarily dictates how each individual must lead his/her life. If the person is “obsessing” over alcohol whether dry/drunk/or moderating, then I think each individual can make a personal decision as to the specific lifestyle that will be the best for them.
Absolutely. Can and will decide for themselves.
I’m just pointing out to those who say “just because you’re drinking X amount doesn’t make you an alcoholic” that the more important issue isn’t how much you are (or aren’t) drinking, but the amount of time you spend thinking about it.
As an alcoholic who’s been in recovery for well over 20 years, I spend very little time thinking about drinking, other than being incredibly grateful that I don’t have to any more.
Assholish nitpick: Who should be assigned. Or, “Whom should we assign…”
Maybe if I were in your shoes I would just make sure that the people I were drinking with didn’t drink to get drunk, so it wouldn’t motivate you to do the same. If that is what you want to do.
Respectfully,
TD
I don’t necessarily think it’s a bad thing. I’ve seen experiences on both sides. Two people close to me were sober for a time (AA for one, 30 day treatment center for the other) and then decided to drink again and both have been controlled, social drinkers for years with no problems.
On the other hand, another person I know, after being sober for 20 years, decided to drink again and things quickly got out of hand for her. The drinking escalated and she realized that she wasn’t able to drink socially. She went back to AA and is happily sober again.
I think AA has value and helps a lot of people, I don’t think it’s the only answer or the answer for everyone. I think each person’s experience is individual and only you know if you can handle it or not.
There are other programs out there. You might want to look into something called Moderation Management.
Best of luck figuring things out. Know what the good thing about the AA slogan “one day at a time” is? It applies to everything, not just alcoholism.
I’m getting kinda tired of people in this thread trotting out these lines. The OP is very clearly NOT rationalizing his behavior, nor is he lying to himself. He seems very genuinely confused and troubled by his actions.
It’s as if there is a reflex at work.
“I’m drinking again, but not in enormous quantities. However, I hate myself and the fact that I am obsessing about alcohol. I genuinely want honest opinions, because I think I might be going down a bad path.”
“You’re rationalizing.”
WTF? Where is the rationalizing?
I certainly envy you, because that has not been my experience. I have been sober for twelve years, and not a day goes by that I do not think about drinking.
I was self-medicating with alcohol for anxiety and depression for 20 years before I quit, and now I don’t have the problems caused by the alcohol. But I still have the anxiety and depression, which have been unresponsive to either the broad spectrum of anti-depressants, nor psychiatry or psychology, including CBT.
I envy those who wake up feeling great every day. I envy those who find sobriety so much better than intoxication. For me, sobriety is hard work every day, and I cannot say that I feel wonderful as a result.
Things could be worse. That keeps me sober, I suppose.
Just the fact that you wrote, “So far I’ve only had wine.” speaks volumes about where your mindset is.
What’s even in it for you if it’s not giving you a buzz?
The OP say neither of these two things. He said that he had wine, liquor & beer, but only liked wine so far.
Then he said he hadn’t been able to get drunk, not that he didn’t get a buzz.
I’m sorry this has been such a struggle for you, and admire your willingness to continue with the struggle. I’ll keep you in my prayers.
I’ll be another supporting data point. I have a best friend who nearly drank himself to oblivion college and post college. Blackouts, hallucinations, destroying relationships and property, the works. He’d routinely drain full fifths of vodka on the weekends after “warming up” with pitchers of beer at the bars, every night was “Animal House” behavior.
He quit completely for about ten years, and now is perfectly capable of handling and enjoying a couple of beers with the guys, or the occasional social cocktails, just like the mainstream public. My belief is that he now has a family, kids, and career that he values more and is unwilling to sacrifice. In the “party days” he could rationalize the behaviors since there were fewer valued attachments to keep him straight.
I’d stop drinking and start revising about 2 weeks before the exam period, and stayed sober all the way through that period.
When writing an essay it would generally be 6-8pm to write, 8-9 for food and 9-10pm to write some more. Then round to mate’s flats to drink and play video games and generally mess around until about 2am. This allowed me to get a 2000 word essay done in 3 days, with no marks lower than C, average B.
You most likely do. Just hasn’t set yet. There is no “blood test” for alcoholism - no real objective measure.* I think of “alcoholism” as recurrent, unyielding problem drinking. But what is problem drinking? The definition might change from situation to situation. Some social groups (like college students) will be more tolerant of regular, excessive consumption.
Consider that you most likely have friends now that get well and lit once, maybe a couple, three times a week. In the future, you might find yourself in a social group that considers more than a couple of glasses of wine once or twice a week to be excessive. What was normal drinking has become problem drinking. It’s likely someone won’t be able to make the adjustment.
The alcoholic (whoever he is) will be unable to do away with the heavy drinking, even when it’s inappropriate. He’ll increase his intake as his tolerance rises. He’ll drink as much as he can at every opportunity. He’ll create opportunity. Alcohol will be one of the first things he thinks about in the morning and will weigh on him all day. Over time, the drink will take its toll on his body. His liver enzymes will increase. He’ll know he’s killing himself. And yet, he’ll still drink, now mainly to forget his problems, which are ever increasing.
I am this guy. Drank experimentally in high school, heavily in college and even more heavily in law school. So did all of my friends. Yet we managed to get good grades and land good jobs. And we kept drinking. I wasn’t even the worse - not by far. But when everyone else tapered off (kids, job, whatever), I kept drinking. Drank right up to the parking lot of a rehab hospital. Checked in almost four months ago and haven’t had a drop since. I know I never should and that I don’t need to. Damn, that’s a relief.
Some of my college and law school buddies still drink problematically on occasion. And maybe they’ll have to confront that one day.
It’s still a bit weird – no one expected the drunk to be me. Except me. I new it for a long time. There was no three or four for me - never was. It was always eight or nine or fourteen or twenty.
- I am aware of the various diagnostic tools, like CAGE, but those seem to leave a good amount of wiggle room. There’s always the Ned Flanders in the crowd who has a glass of wine, refers to Ann Landers as an “old biddy” and convinces himself he’s alcoholic. An alcoholic will see this person as invalidating the entire test.
Thanks for sharing that whole bean, it’s quite enlightening. And worrying! I see a lot of my behaviours from 1st year in that. I’m glad now all the times my friends decided they weren’t drinking that night, and I didn’t want to be the only one drinking, so I didn’t. I wonder how things would have gone if I’d have kept up with the 1st year lifestyle…
If there were not exceptions, there would not be definitions.
There always seem to be people who try to convince others that there is no such thing as addiction. ( I have no idea why they fight for that so hard.)
There is always a story about someONE who is not like the other 50 million that are just like the definition.
I never have not ever nor will ever be that 1 :50,000,000 that gets lucky.
I used to really care about helping other addicts. No more. I wish you the best and will leave you alone if that is what you want. As long as you do not mess with me, mine or my recovery program. You do that and I will actively work to have you put in jail.
I can chose to die for you but I’ll be damned if I’ll die because of you. You chose to go back to drinking. It and all it’s consequences are all on you. No slack. You made the choice.
18+ years clean & sober.
*My ability to intellectualize
Allowed me to rationalize
Which got me institutionalized. *
An addict who is not using a drug but has switched to using people is neither clean nor sober.
I don’t know if this would work, but if I were trying to be sure I didn’t slippery-slide into consuming too much of something like alcohol, I would decide ahead of time what my maximum limit per sitting/day/week/whatever time span(s) could be before I’d start suffering unacceptable negative consequences (you could use your past history of being an alcoholic to get this information) and keep track of my consumption, being sure never to exceed that limit.
And if it got to the point where I often came too close to losing control (if my limit before not being able to be functional enough to hold down a job/other severe consequences was, say, 4 glasses of wine a day and I found myself being extremely tempted to drink a fifth glass of wine once I got to 4), I’d scale it back even further. This requires a great deal of self-awareness and self-control, though.
(I find in general it helps in these kinds of situations to decide before you’re actually in the middle of the situation where you draw the line for something, so you don’t get caught up/unable to make decisions on the fly/succumb to peer pressure or rationalizations.)
This is exactly the kind of thing that an addict wishes they could do, thinks they can do, and which they cannot do. They may attempt to build all sorts elaborate rules and barriers to convince themselves that it’s “not like last time” and they “can control it” but it doesn’t really work. Some will avoid their drug of choice and drink something else (i.e., used to be scotch drinker but decides to stick to wine, or beer). Some will say it’s OK “as long as I don’t get drunk.” Some will say that as long as they only drink socially with other people, that’s OK. Some will say, as you suggest, that X drinks per Y time period is fine, and they won’t go over. Etc. etc.
All of that is the disease talking. If you’re a true addict, then one drink is too many – doesn’t matter what, where, how. One drink is all it takes. OP has already had that one, and more. Again, as I and others have said, none of us will know if he’s on the slippery slope, and he won’t know until he’s already slid quite a ways. The question is, if he does start to slide, will he see it? Will he be able to stop? And, even if he thinks he can stop before it gets too far, is he willing to take that chance?
The fact is that alcohol isn’t necessary. It’s common, it’s legal, it’s sociable, it’s tied to good food and entertaining, many people can enjoy it and not get drunk or suffer health or mental consequences, and it’s absolutely completely not necessary. If someone spends a whole lot of time and energy thinking about it, wishing they could drink it in moderation, not knowing if they can, wanting it, etc., then it’s playing a lot larger role in their life than it does for a non-addict. That, right there, is a big ol’ red flag.
I have to agree with this. Just like a million drunks before me, I counted beers, swore off whiskey, the whole bit. It never worked long term because people without problems don’t need to do those things and people with problems can’t do those things. A shrink once asked me if I thought I had a drinking problem, and I said that my only problem was my wife thought I drank too much. No effort at controlled drinking suceeded, and like they say in the Big Book, with each failure came a wave of pitiful and incomprehensible demoralization. There is a beauty in realizng that you don’t need it. You never needed it. It is unnecessary.
Another friend of Bill W. checking in (not an alcoholic, but an addict’s an addict).
Yes, you are playing with fire. Something drove you to AA 12.5 years ago.
Let’s look at the odds. Which is more likely: that you are somehow “special” and you’re that 1 in a billion alcoholic that really can be taught to drink reasonably, or that you’re heading for another crash? Is it worth losing the life you’ve built sober to find out for sure?