I Pit Martin Hyde

[BigT]

@Do_Not_Taunt

@BigT

If someone tells you their true motivations, you believe them. It’s bizarre to try and find excuses for them. @Martin_Hyde told us who he is, and why he’s here.

I found the quoted blurb in the OP to be quite disgusting, but this is in no way a reasonable restatement of what Martin said. He did not say that he’s only here (in that thread) to slap sheep, nor did he say that was his principal reason for beginning engagement with that thread.

You’ve been an advocate of the principle of charity in the past - use it. The charitable, and IMHO reasonable, interpretation is, “I showed in in that thread to have a legitimate argument. Unfortunately, excessive group-think from the left made that impossible, so once that was clear, I was happy to slap the sheep around a bit.” Yeah, there are some problems with that, but not what you’re saying.

This will be a lot easier to talk about if I quote the actual part of my post you seem to be taking issue with.

Since when is being angry an excuse to say that the only reason why you ever post here is to attack everyone on the left, calling us sheep and mentally ill?

That one word I bolded seems to be the point of contention. I will concede that it is not an accurate summary of his post. He did say he sometimes posts for other reasons. In my anger, I forgot that. However, I would argue that making such a huge deal out of that misses the forest for the trees.

The main point of my post is that, in this excerpt from his post, has told us that what type of person he is, and that we should believe him, rather than needing to come up with ways to defend him. It was that no amount of anger at being misunderstood justifies the garbage that he said.

You agree with me that what he said is disgusting. I thus do not get your need to defend him, let alone demanding I follow the principle of charity. You seem to have forgotten that I’ve also said that I have my limits with that principle.

I’ve made it abundantly clear many times that I do not tolerate those who attack the mentally ill. What he did in my eyes is no different than someone saying that the posters here are bunch of leftist n-words. He used mental illness as an insult.

And, if you think that’s harsh, consider that he has now replied to my other post, where I gave him a chance to take it back. He instead doubled down, saying he’s “not here to make friends.”

So, no, he didn’t say he only ever posts to troll or try to “slap sheep.” But he did admit that is something he does here. And he decided that it was okay to attack the mentally ill and that this describes those who disagree with him. That’s disgusting.

In other words, he told us what type of person he is. We should believe him, rather than feeling a need to defend him.

Edit: And I just now read that he attacked @Sunny_Daze with the fact she had previously sought out therapy. You know, the same thing Shodan did that was the beginning of the end of his posting here.

So, yeah. He told us what type of person he is. It wasn’t a fluke. I will argue that, for such a person, the principle of charity does not apply.

Someone who was just angry would have taken back the worst parts, not gone further with them.

[mistymage]

I’m like you: my dad was a German American, but due to I’m looking like my Native American mother I have had the “fun” of identifying as one part of my heritage while seeing how people treat me as though my other half doesn’t exist even with my German Maiden and Married Names.

I think I might have told the story of needing a new pair of panties after giving birth and then almost bleeding out. The treatment I had initially vs after my Aunt-in-law (Mistermage’s maternal aunt) and his mom (both Nurses in that hospital) heard I almost died… was remarkable.

Day 1 to Day 3 (amazing that insurance only pays for 3 days when it comes to giving birth. And for those women with sucky or nonexistent insurance it is less than that.) My care went way up. Due to my lovely in-laws!

[crowmanyclouds]

@Martin_Hyde

Note that as per this thread (Unclear Moderation + New Rule Protecting Nationality - #6 by Miller) I will be unable to continue to participate in this discussion due to mod commentary. You all enjoy yourselves, I doubt my responses would do any more than your stupid and infantile comments could do on their own to show your lack of intellect and critical thinking ability.

[thorny_locust]

@GIGObuster

As noted in the threads that led to this pitting, he makes a mountain of the idea that we are calling him a Nazi or a holocaust denier, that is not the case

To be fair, while nobody called him a Nazi or a Holocaust denier, he was accused of genocide denial, IMO accurately – while at some points he claimed to be acknowledging it, he was also repeatedly minimizing this particular genocide and trying to claim that other aspects of it had nothing to do with it; as well as recommending tactics that would contribute to it.

[Euphonious_Polemic]

He later clarified that he was not denying that cultural genocide had taken place against the indigenous populations of North America. He simply did not think it was a big deal, and also is of the opinion that we should finish the job properly by encouraging them to integrate into western society and then take their remaining lands.

So no. Not a genocide denier at all. A genocide proponent.

[GIGObuster]

@thorny_locust

To be fair, while nobody called him a Nazi or a Holocaust denier, he was accused of genocide denial, IMO accurately – while at some points he claimed to be acknowledging it, he was also repeatedly minimizing this particular genocide and trying to claim that other aspects of it had nothing to do with it; as well as recommending tactics that would contribute to it.

That is why I mentioned the term lukewarmer, it is not only for climate change deniers; many conservatives that are smarter than the average Trump supporter fall into not denying things like evolution or climate science or genocide. However, the minimizing of the harm is there in high quantities. While they could not be aware of it, the result is about the same thing that total deniers of an issue want.

They do want inaction and lack of solutions coming from governments that could take perpetrators to task, or to make reparations to victims, they also do want to not educate all the young ones and the future generations about the injustices.

[Lance_Turbo]

We never even got into his Confederate apologia.

He’s a pretty hardcore Confederate apologist.

[crowmanyclouds]

Now, now, the slave owners had the best intentions . . . the whippings woulda stopped as soon as morale improved.

[Miller]

@Martin_Hyde

You were thinking of getting therapy–you probably should, you obviously have emotional/mental problems.

[Moderating]
I overlooked this yesterday in my focus on the warning, but this is also worth noting. Going into MPSIMS threads looking for people talking about health issues and attacking them over it is also not cool.

Just a mod note on this one, since this is a different thing than what you were warned over. I hope the explanation of the issue here is sufficiently clear.
[/Moderating]

[Euphonious_Polemic]

@Lance_Turbo

We never even got into his Confederate apologia.

He’s a pretty hardcore Confederate apologist.

Well, I’m shocked by this news.

(narrator; He’s not actually shocked)

[Do_Not_Taunt]

@BigT

You agree with me that what he said is disgusting. I thus do not get your need to defend him, let alone demanding I follow the principle of charity. You seem to have forgotten that I’ve also said that I have my limits with that principle.

Yeah, I mean, I do agree with that. And what he’s posted in this thread between the post of mine you quoted and here is equally terrible. I’m not here to make some sort of defense case for ole Marty.

So why did I argue with you on that one narrow point? I guess I’d summarize it this way: I’ve been spending a little more time here lately because work is really slow, and I’m really burnt out on working from home. So then the next question is what to post about? I’ve never been much of a Cafe Society guy, football is out of season, so I’m not going to spend much time in the Game Room, and - this is the big one - let’s face it: when the conservatives send their posters here, they’re not exactly sending their best, are they? It’s almost pointless to argue with them. Their arguments are weak, they don’t listen, and by the time I’ve read them, there are typically already 20 replies arguing with them, with variable levels of snark.

But, when a somewhat left-of-center poster makes a weak argument, it’s often - not always - left alone. It actually creates an opening to have a bit of a conversation. And left-of-center posters are usually more receptive to thinking through their arguments than our conservatives are. And if you decide to tighten up your arguments a little, that’s a win for everybody. Conversely, I’m actually likely to learn more from engaging with left-of-center posters. You might point out an angle on something I didn’t see. Win-win.

There are tons of great reasons to pit Marty. “He said he’s just here to slap sheep” isn’t one of them.

[ASL_v2.0]

@Martin_Hyde

@Stranger_On_A_Train

Thank you, but no; I’ll take a liberal social democracy with a well-educated populace managed by the balance of competing ideas and political philosophies negotiating to pragmatic solutions rather than some arbitarily enforced societal good.

Ah, a citizen of Utopia, didn’t know your lot spent much time on the SDMB.

One more would-be fascist who thinks the masses need to be protected from themselves by a benign dictator. Fuck off, @Martin_Hyde, you goose-stepping moron.

[Skywatcher]

@Euphonious_Polemic

@Martin_Hyde

If it was in the late 70s when I think the last of these ceased operations, that would raise a lot of questions. If it was in the 1890s, somewhat less.

No, you don’t get to play the “oh oh it was a long time ago, let’s not make a fuss now” card.

Yes, many of the deaths of children no doubt occurred many years ago. But we are just NOW paying proper attention to actually what went on and why. It has been hushed up and forgotten for too long. We can’t just brush it away again because it happened in the past.

As was posted in the MPSIMS thread:

@elbows

“It is readily acknowledged that Indian children lose their natural resistance to illness, by habitating so closely in these schools, and they die at a much higher rate than in their villages. But this alone, does not justify a change in the policy of this department, which is being geared towards the final solution of our Indian problem.

It is quite within the mark to say that 50% of the children who passed through these schools did not live to benefit from the education they received therein.”

Duncan Campbell Scott
Deputy Superintendent General of Indian Affairs
1913-1932

To emphasize “the final solution of our Indian problem” Kind of paints the picture, I think. What the Government did as policy and the churches enacted with cruelty is not taught. It should be. For decades, this has been ignored. It should not be ignored or excused any longer.

Guess which part was responded to and which part is being ignored by the subject of this thread.

[Euphonious_Polemic]

I posted the quote again, just so the asshole knows exactly who he is aligning himself with.

[Sunny_Daze]

I believe Martin said he was done with thread because of the mod note within the thread. Time for a new thread?

[MrDibble]

@Sunny_Daze

I believe Martin said he was done with thread because of the mod note within the thread.

Hasn’t stopped the lying little denier in the cultural genocide thread, he’s back there despite getting modnoted in it.

[thorny_locust]

And he’s basically just snarling at people there for (he says) lying about him (which they aren’t). Which would be far better suited for this thread, and is effectively a hijack of the other one; but that thread’s also in the Pit, so I doubt it’s reportable.

[wolfpup]

As I mentioned elsewhere, I haven’t engaged much (or at all, really) with @Martin_Hyde, so I’ve had nothing to say one way or the other in this pitting. But one of his comments recently really pissed me off. In the Windows 11 thread in IMHO, several of us mentioned that we had no intention of upgrading in the foreseeable future and were in fact still running older versions of Windows, in my case, Windows 7. I mentioned that I’d possibly still be running Windows XP on at least some systems except for the fact that some components had become obsolete and no longer functional.

This post is not about the debate of staying current or not with the latest OS, which is a matter amenable to reasonable discussion and greatly depends on individual circumstances. This post is about @Martin_Hyde being an asshole. Instead of a reasonable comment or attempt at discussion, in this post he drops the following threadshit:

The type of people in this thread that are celebrating using operating systems like Win XP for 5-10 years after they were serious security risks, application compatibility troublemakers etc are a major impediment to good computing generally and a blight on the world of software.

To which I have the following response.

Listen you pompous malodourous dumbass, the only “blight” around here is you, who seems to specialize in toxic accusations and gratuitous insults whenever you post. You know absolutely nothing about me, my background, the environment in which I operate my systems, what I use them for, and how they are secured. And maybe you missed the fact that major financial institutions are still running Windows 2000 (or worse) in customer-facing frontline systems and branch back office workstations. As someone who has made what I think are notable contributions to software engineering over the course of my career I find it humourous in a pathetic sort of way to have a random douchebag on the internet call me “a major impediment to good computing generally and a blight on the world of software”.

Just as a random example, there’s lots of buzz currently about the PrintNightmare vulnerability in the Windows print spooler. How are you doing with that, with your “latest” version of Windows? Turns out, Microsoft’s hotfix for Windows 10 is both buggy (in certain cases) and ineffectual. It’s no better for Windows 7, but I haven’t even bothered yet because I address threats like that in other ways, like Group Policy restrictions on remote access to services, enterprise-class malware protection, and safe computing practices generally.

This is not about whether it’s wise for most people to stay with supported operating systems. It’s about the fact that you’re an annoying arrogant douchebag. Go fuck yourself with a cactus.

[Sunny_Daze]

Well said. Unfortunately it appears a new Pit thread is required for the honoree, as he claims to have hidden this one.

[k9bfriender]

I can still see it.