Here’s my vote for doing it now. There’s always fall-out from a break-up - even if (and you should, although easier said than done) have zero contact with him, you’re going to feel pretty weird afterwards. I’d view this new move as a chance to start completely afresh, leaving all remaining baggage behind you. So you can view your last couple of months in your current place as your ‘get-over’ period.
Another vote for doing it now. There’s no point in dragging this out. At the very least, it’s unfair to him*, but at the most, there’s no point in keeping yourself miserable. July is not that far away…you’ll be very busy finding a new place to live, work, etc.
Remember, stand strong. After you tell him goodbye (and no long drama scene, either) do not take his phone calls, do not answer the door if he stops by, do not respond to his e-mails.
*I know, major roll eyes here, but since she’s planning to break up with him, why stay in the relationship another six weeks?
If he has ben able to manipulate you in the past such that you can not dump him because he refuses and to get you to apologize for things he’s done/not done then why give him another two months to smooth you over into you deciding to stay with him?
Dump him ASAP.
Wouldn’t you be wasting the month of June in a relationship you don’t want?
This is a bit of a sidetrack, but since everyone’s out to lunch when it comes to the actual topic, I suppose it doesn’t hurt to indulge your curiosity.
No I don’t think 99 people agreeing with me would make me irrational. However, if 99 people chimed in with identical sentiments to my own, not a single one giving any support for their statements, nor even offering a significantly different interpretation… just echoing what has already been said. I would worry that I may be missing something, and double check to see if I really did have any justification for my view. I would want to be sure I wasn’t just automatically accepting a preconceived notion as everyone else is. The way I see it, truth is rarely so clear-cut and absolute. Lies on the other hand survive and propagate where people don’t care to examine and question something. Consider what Scissorjack said:
Yet here we are in a thread where the first two and a half pages are nothing but mindless parroting of the same unsupported idea over and over and over. Scissorjack failed to see the significance of this, but what about you? Don’t you think what you’ve seen in this thread is somewhat out of place here? Don’t you think it’s a bit odd how many people feel driven to echo what has already been said and how few are willing to examine whether this sentiment is actually justified? This is what I meant by my comment at the end of my original post in this thread. But, while I was typing, astro came along and provided the conspicuously missing criticism much more eloquently than me. Kinda taking the impact out of my rant.
grumble…grumble
Anyway… so I wondered if I might have overreacted to the ignorance here. Maybe the first two and a half pages were just some kind of aberration and people would be willing to think critically after all…But sure enough… just 5 posts down Diogenes raised this moronic question of whether I’m the boyfriend. His reason to think this? None. Except that it’s a convenient way to avoid thinking critically. Not a good sign… but it’s just one person… So I let it go… maybe he was being funny on purpose, maybe not, but surely most people could see how ridiculous the accusation is. Maybe, someone will even pipe up and ask him what gave him this idea… Nope. Instead one person after another made reference to this idea, and nobody, not one of you so-called critical thinkers shows a hint of awareness of how moronic it is.
And it gets worse. Some of you even start pretending that I’m “trying to preserve this relationship” where did I do that? It’s a delusion. I’m doing the exact opposite. I’m trying to show her a real reason to leave this guy… instead of some lie about how horrible he is which will break down when the irrational anger fades and leave her running back to him. Meanwhile Maastricht concocts his ingenious test for witchcraft… or something. Whatever. Ooh, I didn’t answer the question directly. He wasn’t interested in a direct answer. How do I know? because if he were, he would have looked for a direct answer… and he would have found one. Did anyone notice that I DID answer that question directly when it was first asked?! These things are easy to overlook in the frenzy to manufacture support for your paranoid fantasies. Any pretence you have to pretend that I am her boyfriend and dismiss me, is so valuable to you that you will accept it without question. I tried to urge people to go back and look at it clearly… but everyone is utterly immune to reason. Clinging more and more tightly to your only way to avoid reality. The paranoid fantasy that I am her boyfriend. Careful… don’t read what I’m saying. Don’t let me “twist the situation”. I have the magical power of manipulation so it’s important not to think about anything I say. Gimme a break.
NJ actually made some good points in the original contrarian rant- for instance, the OP’s BF signed on as a polyamorous dude who was not going to make any commitment in the first place, and didn’t have any particular obligation to be 1) nice 2) faithful 3) open 4) committed to the relationship. For the OP to want these things was arguably unreasonable.
Most of the posters (including me) simply identified the fact that the OP was unhappy, and that the BF has stated a desire to change and not done so as being the key points of consideration - leading to a near-unanimous dump the boyfriend conclusion.
NoJustice made a more legalistic analysis that one can hardly abuse the guy for staying in a relationship to which he has made no formal obligation, but persists in getting sex, food and generally nice relationship-style privileges.
Further, the OP could explicitly point out the lack of a contract in the breakup speech, and say something like: “Dude, I am no longer content with our interaction, although it complies with our initial agreement. I regret that I can no longer continue my end of the deal, which apparently involves providing sex and other benefits, for it turns out I would actually like some return on my input in the form of real affection, fidelity and such. I don’t think you can successfully renegotiate this deal to my satisfaction, based on your failure to make changes when you volunteered to do so, and so I must, with some minimal regret, terminate our arrangement”.
Which I think is where NoJustice was headed. If not, my apologies for my interpretation of your intent.
Nota Bene: I am not NoJustice’s boyfriend.
NoJustice, your condescension is grating, and I’m not even a target of yours, given that I haven’t posted in this thread before now. Ranting on about how everyone but you is willfully close-minded instead of simply disagreeing with you is obnoxious and arrogant, not to mention sure to make people automatically defensive instead of willing to consider the validity of your statements. Sure, everyone’s seeing this through their own prejudices, just as you are. Frankly, you don’t strike me as being any more logical and reasoned than the posters you’re criticizing. Just off the top of my head, you just spun the op’s statements about promises her boyfriend/whatever made to her to suit your original conclusion rather than admit that you may have misjudged the situation. Talk about manufacturing support for your paranoid fantasies.
And by the way, **Maastricht **is a she. Who had a good point, I thought. You say you answered that question earlier - I must have missed that and don’t care to wade through the previous pages to find out. That happens on messageboards. No need to sneer about it when you could have just civilly answered the question again.
Missed the edit, sorry: I agree, he had some good points in his original post, if you view life through the stance that people don’t owe each other anything that isn’t explicitly negotiated, which is a valid if not compassionate view point. Me, I prefer to believe that in a civilized society, we have some obligation not to just milk other people for all they’re worth because they made the mistake of assuming that certain things regarding interpersonal relationships (reciprocity, gratitude, for example) should be a given.
I agree with your view of society*. However, I’m working on the theory that NJ’s tough love approach was exactly that, advising Phoenixundone to be brutally honest about her explicit and implicit expectations, in part so that she can identify exactly why she is there, why he is there, and why she wants out, so that she can actually do it. If she’s fooling herself as to what’s going on and what the expectations are, it will be harder.
I think NoJustice is here to help, as a representative of the Vulcan Institute of Love and Romance.
*Please note that I am not in any form of romantic entanglement with Supergoose.
phoenix, sweetie, I’m afraid I’m another vote for breaking it off now instead of later. And you know I’m on your side, but hanging on to him for a couple of months past the point when you had decided to end it would be not a nice thing to do. It’s like ripping off a band-aid…do it quick, in one smooth motion. Peeling it off a bit at a time hurts a lot more (for both of you).
Question…why are you moving? Was it something you really want, have been thinking about for awhile and would have done already if it wasn’t for this relationship? Or are you moving just as a mechanism for cutting yourself off from him?
Or, maybe it was your unpleasant, combative way of disagreeing with everyone that had people thinking you had some kind of emotional investment in the collective opinion of the OP’s current sexual partner.
Think on it. The second line of your OP in this thread was WTF is wrong with you people? Maybe there’s a better way to communicate your disagreement.
wait, hold on. polyamory, as my boyfriend himself explained and as i’ve read and talked to other polyamorous couples can be different with different couples, but it is generally speaking an open practice where all parties involved are committed to be honest to each other about everybody and everything. when i agreed to be in a polyamorous relationship with my boyfriend, we agreed on the terms that (a) he would keep me in the loop about his sexual relationships with other women and men (b) tell me if things were getting serious with someone else (c) ideally, let me meet them. it also doesn’t mean that he’s not committed to me, (which he could or couldn’t), but in my case, he said that he was – that i was his primary. those were the terms we agreed on.
what happened was that he followed through with (a), and sometimes only if i pried him enough or sensed something was going on. so i still believe that my requests are reasonable and that he ultimately fucked up, because he agreed and then violated those agreements in all kinds of ways, i forgave him, he said he would change, and then he didn’t. rinse and repeat.
now, whether or not one is obligated to be nice or respectful is another story, and you’re right, maybe i’m silly to expect people to be as such. but it depresses me to have to think of having to go up to every person i know and be friends with and ask for them to be nice and respectful to me.
in the case of my boyfriend, it came down to the point where i just had to explicitly ask for these things. again he said yes, and again he didn’t follow through.
i hope this explains things a little bit better.
my reasons for moving are more than just him…one is that i’ve been in this area for many years now and i generally think it’s time to move on. but also, my support system (close friends) are spread all over the world and i have barely anyone here where i live now where i can turn to, which will make it all the harder to not run back to him when i’m grieving our break up…
The sooner you do it the better. I’ve been reading this thread but have not responded till now.
I was once in a relationship with a wonderful woman. We were in our late 20s/early 30s. She ended up dumping me completely out of the blue after 3 years of exclusively dating one another and I was devastated.
Looking back on it now some 17 years later I realize that we were not compatible and she was completely correct in ending the relationship upon those grounds. I always wanted a family, and she adamantly swore she would never have kids. I capitulated and thought that my love for her would trump my family expectations. Somehow she seemed to know that I would be longing for kids and a family if we were to get married.
There were a few other issues, but what it came down to was her knowing me better than I knew myself. It took me a few long months to get over it, but in the end her decision was right. I am now married and have 2 wonderful kids whom I love more than life itself. I never would have had that if I continued down my original path.
My wife and I have our differences, some of which I’ve aired here, but what we do have are two great kids and I would not change my life for anything at this point.
The moral of the story is that what seems painful in the short term most likely will lead to other opportunities that are more fulfilling and will be beneficial to both of you.
For what it’s worth, I am still in contact with said ex-girlfriend and we remain good friends to this day, even given the crappy way in which she unilaterally ended our relationship.
It does, not that you have any need to explain anything. The legalistic relationship analysis I interpreted from NoJustice’s posts is, I think, primarily useful for making sure that you are clear on where you stand, with respect to what your expectations were and what his expectations were.
I think it is otherwise very simple: you aren’t happy - you should get out of it. Good luck.
I could go either way.
If you’re going to be moving, you’ll be finding his things. You’ll be packing. You’ll be encountering bits of your past together and throwing them out. Or giving them back, if they belong to him. It’ll be a cleansing process for you, both literally and emotionally. It’ll be helpful for you to phsically remove his artifacts from your things, from your space, from your life.
I could see that this packing-and-cleansing process might strengthen your resolve and make it easier to dump him … or I could see how dumping him first might make the cleansing process more of an emotional closure.
If I had to recommend a way, I’d say sooner rather than later. You’re going to be moving and you won’t have energy to spare on his needs and wants (since he seems to fulfill none of his own).
I’m sorry, I haven’t read every post but I have read the OP saying she doesn’t believe her boyfriend is abusive. I’m not saying he IS…he might not be. But those who are can be extremely manipulative to the point where you don’t even recognize it for what it is. I’ve been in the situation and read a book called Why Does He Do That: Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men by Lundy Bancroft. It would be impossible for me to overstate how helpful and affirming I found it and how highly I recommend it for ANY woman. You don’t even have to read the whole thing, just give the first chapter a chance and then you’ll know if you want or need to read on. Good luck to you.
Another vote for do it sooner rather than later. You’re in the right headspace and need to make the most of it.
Are there any logistical issues with doing it sooner rather than later (apart from the living in the same town as him thing)?
Is the O.P. sure that their"relationship"isn’t all in her head ?
They don’t even actually live together aren’t exclusive and in fact don’t have any of the trappings of what is usually considered to be a partnership.
It sounds as though she would very much like it to be the case and that she goes out of her way to try and convince him to commit by doing him every possible favour but it doesn’t actually seem apparent that he in anyway is aware of their so called relationship.
Sounds like wish fulfillment to me.
I don’t think there is any reason to believe that’s the case. Some men (and women…but more men if you ask me) would love that type of arrangement if they could get away with it. It may not be a “real” relationship in that it’s all take and no give on his side, but it’s not hard for me to believe he would call it a relationship, and even genuinely consider it to be one, in his apparently twisted view of relationships.
Dealing with a narcissist (a real one - I’m not just namecalling [though I am namecalling too]) has taught me many things. Unfortunately. My narcissist is really trying to change, supposedly, and he is in therapy, and still the things that don’t occur to him (like about other people existing for reasons that don’t pertain to him) are mind-boggling.
phoenixundone, You know what you need and he either isn’t capable or he isn’t willing to give you those things. Why prolong the agony? It really isn’t fair to him or to you to keep up the pretense. Get it over with and let both of you move on with your lives. Waiting until July just means you have to start in your new place with that baggage to get over. Do it now and then you have a better chance to get a clean, new start. And you won’t be lying to him, or pretending around him, for the next month and a half. I’d say it’s better to make the clean break now, than to let him figure out that something is going on and have it be an argument or long-drawn-out explanation and discussion. You know what’s the right thing to do, for both of you. Waiting won’t make it easier.