Its a birth NOT a public spectacle!

This is a bit tangential (okay, sort of a hijack) but I feel compelled … after agreeing that it is completely inappropriate for anyone to want to be with you during the birth process other than babymouse’s dad … to share this story. Many years ago on a small island far, far away, we had a resident loony who was obsessed with the physical processes related to childbirth (in a demented way, not a wonderful way like WhyNot). Although none of us were particularly pregnant at the time, nor did we know - or desire to know - her especially well, she invited us to her house to watch a video of her giving birth.

She also – in a restaurant, with lots of patrons around – snatched up a young baby from the arms of one of my friends, cuddled it, and began rhapsodizing about how much she had adored breast-feeding, concluding by saying “if I let this baby suckle me, do you think it would make me start lactating?”

Ever since she said that, she has been known to me and the friends who were present at the time by the sobriquet “Mrs. Wet Nurse.” It’s been over 20 years since that little display, and no, we haven’t forgotten.

I agree that most of these people are rude and a bit crazy - but the problem with not telling them until it’s over is that once you get to the ‘final countdown,’ as it were, these same people will start calling you two or three times a day, just to check up on you.
If you head off to the hospital, and don’t answer your phone or aren’t at home, they may all go down there looking for you.

The only answer is to make sure the nursing staff knows you don’t want ANY of them in there with you. As others have said, make your wishes known to the nursing staff, even if it means having them tell people you’re not there.

You can have the kid in a cab to spite your mother. She won’t track you down then.

Well, MM, you know this already, but I’ll tell ya again: this is where you start drawing lines on behalf of the Mouseling. And her not even born yet…

Your mother isn’t going to take “no” for an answer, so you’re just going to have to keep saying it, and then be sure you talk with your OB ahead of time about the fact that you do not want anybody in there except you and Mr. Mouse, and specifically that you do not want your mother. And paranoidly yet apologetically and firmly see that s/he writes it down on your chart somewhere, because s/he’s busy and can’t be expected to remember all the little quirks and foibles of each and every patient.

And–pay attention to this–you don’t have to go into any long drawn-out explanations of exactly why this is. It’s not relevant. The doctor doesn’t need to know all your mother’s dysfunctional past history. All that matters is that you don’t want anybody in there except you two.

And–s/he won’t think you’re some kind of monster for not wanting your mother in there with you. Frankly s/he doesn’t care who you have in there, as long as they haven’t brought a brass band or a full-tilt-boogie camera crew or something and they aren’t getting in the way.

Make it clear to him/her that this may involve hospital security, so that when you’re in the throes of labor and your mom turns up and you try to get her outta there, she can’t say to the OB with wide innocent eyes, “She doesn’t know what she’s saying, she’s in labor for god’s sake…” and have him/her concur and allow her to stay over your protests. You want him/her to be prepared to get on the horn and get some uniforms up there to escort her out.

And when you first arrive at the labor room, make sure that the OB nurse on duty also makes some kind of notation on your chart as to who is, and is not, allowed to be in there with you. Again, this is so when you get to eight centimeters and your mom walks in and you just don’t have anything left to use to argue with her, you can at least wordlessly point to the spot on your chart where it says “No visitors”.

As for any other friends and relatives who may insist on joining you–just smile politely and say, “No, thanks, this is a private thing for us, and we’d rather do it by ourselves. You can wait in the waiting room and we’ll send out pictures ASAP…”

If someone won’t get the hint, there are some easy steps to take:

  1. “OF COURSE we’ll call you” :wink:
  2. 3 weeks before the due date, start telling them you’ve turned the ringer down so mommy can nap (while we’re at it, actually nap, you’ll appreciate it later, believe me)
  3. Don’t call when you head to the hospital.

With further preplanning (in case there is a second mouseling), you can tell them your due date is 2 weeks later than it really is.

Mouse I asked this in my last post, and I haven’t seen an answer, so I will ask again.
Assuming you are not over at her house when labor starts, how is your mother going to know that you are in labor? :confused: :confused:

About C-sections. While it is more common now than it was when my children were born, I would suggest that you ask your OB/GYN about the possibility now.
With our first we asked about my being in the OR in the event of a c-section. the doctor hemmed and hawed, and didn’t really give an answer. So I asked him straight out “If I promise not to be an idiot, can I be there?” He got a big smile and said “Sure, no problem”
As it turned out my wife had to have an emergency section. They brought me in right after the first incision. The doctor was good to his word, and I was good to mine. :smiley:
Based on what I saw, when the decision is made for an emergency section, it would be too late to ask. Things start to move very quickly at that point.

Mouse, stick to your guns! Your body, your baby, your choice!

When I had my baby back in April, I was fortunately in a different country from the in-laws, and I decided to limit the cast at the delivery (excluding midwife and OB) to my husband and my older sister (a GP, aka family physician, who also has 2 kids of her own). My labour was induced - I was 39 weeks pregnant, had high blood pressure, fluid retention and carpal tunnel in my right hand but baby’s head had not engaged. Things happened fairly quickly in terms of labour (from ARM and syntocinon drip starting at 9am to birth at 4pm), so when my parents turned up to deliver the pillows I had asked them earlier to bring in, I was already 9cm dilated. My husband grabbed my mother by the hand and wouldn’t let her leave. Good thing too, since he nearly fainted a couple of times! But my mother just stood behind my husband (who was holding my left leg in the air at the time) and I really appreciated knowing there was somebody there to look after him.

Who you want around when you give birth is very much a personal choice, and it is something you need to decide on now and stick to, because once you get to 8 or 9cm dilated, you probably won’t give a crap who walks in and sees your nether regions!

Aw, Mouse, that’s too bad. It’s uncomfortable enough to have to say “Thanks, but no” to such a crowd of people, even if they’re well-meaning, but the response from your mom is just not very good at all. That’s really disrespectful and creepy. I would be concerned about someone who seems to have no respect for your decisions having much access at all to that baby even after she is born.

Let me add another “stick to your guns” response. In my opinion, the best place for a woman to give birth is where she feels safest. If you feel safest at the hospital, that’s where you should be. The same holds true for who is in the room. If everyone there does not add to your safeness factor, then they have no business being there. I encourage you to be very clear about what you want, and don’t apologize. If ever there was a day when the mama sets the rules, it’s “birth” day. That includes the staff too, IMHO. If the nurse you get rubs you the wrong way for whatever reason, ask the hospital to send you someone else. Most nurses are terrific, but it’s amazing what birthing women will put up with from the few bad ones, or even ones who are just a bad fit for that mother, because it didn’t occur to them that they could request someone else.

I am sending warm thoughts your way, Miss Mouse, and I’m wrapping you in calm. I’m picturing your birth going really well, your baby being healthy and wonderful and everyone involved being supportive and kind to you.

I really like the advice about telling everyone that you’ll be “turning down your ringer so you can nap” towards the end of your pregnancy. I do hope that you’ll tell us here though, so we can “wait” with you from afar.

I think I’d just send them a brief note saying “thanks ever so much for your interest, but seriously, what the fuck?”. I think there might even be a ‘seriously, what the fuck?’ section in many greetings card shops now.

I’m not going to tell her, but we’re concerned that she may hear through the grapevine (My best friend is my brother’s ex, we call BF, she tells Brother, he tell Mother. Unless there are complications, we’re not telling anybody until its over.) or she may go into stalker mode. If she can’t get ahold of Spouse and I, she may show up at our house or the hospital.

We had a birth preparation class last night, the nurse/instructor said that the only people allowed in the room are those the parents want. According to the nurse, they are very used to belligerent relatives. It was a relief to hear.

Duck Duck Goose had a good point, I feel guilty that I don’t want my mother around. Its compounded by the fact that the Mouseling is a girl. Part of me worries: Good Gods! Is this what I’m going to turn into? (My father is no prize either, but he lived up to his promise of “Once you’re 18, you’re no longer my problem.”)

Becoming a parent is scary. To me, its even more frightening because I’m not sure what “good” parenting is. (Ok, I’ll feed her, clothe her, keep her clean, don’t hit - hell, I can’t even spank my cats. What else?)

Mouse_Spouse and I have had circular discussions about therapy.

M_S: You’ll be fine, don’t worry. You can always talk to me.
M_M: I AM worried. I appreciate the support, but I think I need something else.

Repeat 100 times.

BEST…TSHIRT…EVER!

That’s pretty much it for at least 6 months. The rest of it often comes intuitively, or is led by the kid. If you seriously are worried, though, pick up a book by Brazelton or Sears on infant and child development (it’s more than 10 years old, but Touchpoints is still my fave) and a copy of Love and Logic for the Early Years and one of Parenting With Love and Logic for when she’s older and you’re all set. Then expect to throw everything you learn from books out the window as you fumble around, make mistakes, and do the best you can with the child you’re given.

If you can keep immune compromised mice alive (at least as long as you need to), you’ll do fine with a baby.

When boyfoolie was born I wanted my mom in there, but my husband would never have forgiven me if she was there. So we went with husband. Um well that wasnt a good thing, and well one of the two people (besides doctors, nurses etc) that was there for my son’s birth has been among the missing these last three years. (My son is three and a half)

If I have another one… depending on what the “daddy” situation is… It will be me, my mom and my two best friends. Actually, if current boyfriend was the dad, that wouldnt change… he would not much be interested in the blood and poop part of it that accompanies birth. Especially if I have another c-section.

They mean in the actual delivery room? Not standing around uselessly in the waiting room?

Make your wishes clear to the nursing staff and they will carry them out. You also may want to make sure your husband puts up a united front with you.

Okay, I can understand that there are reasons why people might want to be included in someone else’s birth experience. However, *asking * to be included and then sulking when you’re not invited is well past rude.

I see it like this.

There is an exceptionally limited list of people I am willing to allow to have an up-close and personal look at my hoohah.* This is especially true during the childbirth experience, when my hoohah is not at its best. If you are not on that list, you may not be in the room with me while I give birth. So sorry. You may hang out in the waiting room all you like, and perform the salutory function of keeping my husband from loosing his freaking mind during my labor (as I suspect strongly he won’t be able to hack the actual delivery room parts), but you can’t be in the room with me.

I’ll be more than willing to visit with you when it’s medically reasonable for me to cover my nether regions against drafts.

*Discounting trained medical professionals, that list numbers precisely three. My husband, my mother and my bestest friend. In a pinch, if none of those three is available and I require urgent emotional support - my husband’s paternal aunt.

Don’t feel guilty that you don’t want your mother there. The person who gave birth to you has not been a “mother” to you in any reasonable sense of the word, and you do not have to inflict her on your child.

Talk to your brother now. Tell him about your mother’s threats to intrude on the birth, and request that he not tell her if he happens to hear that you have gone into labor. If you don’t think he will agree with this request, then ask best friend not to tell him when you go into labor. If she won’t comply with this request, she isn’t your best friend. Then make sure the doctor and hospital personnel know you don’t want her in there. Do you already know the hospital you will be using? You could contact them now and ask about their policies and procedures for this type of case.

If you think therapy would help you with setting boundaries with your mother, then go for it! MouseSpouse sounds like he is wonderfully supportive, but support is not the same as therapy. Your mother is most likely not going to be easier to deal with if you don’t follow her wishes concerning access to your baby, and although your spine is stiffening up nicely some therapy might help in dealing with her. If MouseSpouse’s feelings get hurt, try to explain that you have to deal with the guilt she is trying to drown you in.

Wow…so much of this is making my fricking head spin. How in the hell would anyone who didn’t actually take part in the conception think they had any business being part of the delivery?

I love the “I’ll be there whether you like it or not” bit. Yeah, sorry, not where we delivered you wouldn’t be. I’ve been in bank vaults with more lax security systems. My wife and I each wore a sensor bracelet, as did our newborn daughter. The doors to the maternity wing wouldn’t open unless it sensed our bracelet. And as a bonus, if it sensed our daughter’s bracelet approaching the door without sensing either mine or her mother’s, then it would automatically send the wing into lockdown.

It was so tempting just to see if I could find the magic spot where it would pick up her bracelet but not mine. :slight_smile:

No. Quite definitely.

Because you are aware of the problem, and that’s half the battle in outgrowing a dysfunctional upbringing. The first time you hear in dismay your mother’s voice coming out of your mouth, you will pull yourself up short and think, “Wait. What’s happening here?” And you will re-think the situation, and you will fix it, because you are an intelligent woman, and you have the mental toolkit to do so. And because, as I said, you are aware that it’s a problem that needs fixed. If your mother’s voice came out of your mouth and you didn’t realize that it was not-desirable, then and only then, would you be in danger of raising the Mouseling the way you were, undesirably, raised. But knowing that you want to do things differently puts YOU in control of your mother’s voice.

Actually, I would say that you are more in danger of leaning too far in the other direction–your mother was meddlesome and interfering, so you’re in danger of doing too much hands-off “I will mind my own business” parenting, which sends the message to the Mouseling, unfortunately, that you don’t care what she does.

So basically the line is drawn at, you meddle in her life only to the extent that you’d meddle in Mr. Mouse’s life. If Mr. Mouse picked up his car keys and started out the door, you’d be entitled to ask, “Hey, where ya goin’?” and, “What time will ya be home?” But you wouldn’t be entitled to give him the third degree. Nor would you be entitled to give him the third degree when he got home, “Who else was there? Did you go…anywhere else? [suspicious look]”

And if Mr. Mouse decides he wants to wear an orange Hawaiian shirt with blue Corona boxer shorts to work, you are entitled to one neutral “Umm…” as he heads out the door, but you are not entitled to jump all over him and have hysterics at what he’s wearing, and then go out to Wal-Mart and buy him an entirely new wardrobe and insist that he wear it.

And if you saw Mr. Mouse peering into the gas tank with a lighted match to see how much gas was in there, you’d holler, “HOLY SHIT WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU DOING!!” and you’d knock the match out of his hand. And then maybe you’d read him the riot act about being a dumbass. But you wouldn’t, ever afterwards, call him up on the phone twice a week and make sure he wasn’t checking the car’s gas levels by matchlight. Over and done, 'twould be.

Mommy needs to be a bit more paranoid/protective of Kidlings than of Spouse, because Kidlings honestly don’t know that you’re not supposed to peer into a gas tank by matchlight, so once you knock the match out of her hand, then you explain calmly to her that you’re not supposed to do that because it could be Very Dangerous, It Might Blow UP!!–no casting aspersions upon her intelligence, see.

Hope this is helping.

Hon, parenting is scary to everybody, even those of us who had textbook Norman Rockwell childhoods with the turkey dinners and the visit to the kindly old family doctor.

You learn as you go along, you make mistakes, but they aren’t world-shattering mistakes, and if you had any kind of normal childhood at all–which, your interfering mother notwithstanding, I detect that you did, mostly (you weren’t sexually abused or systematically starved or pimped out on the street corner, you weren’t beaten every Saturday night, you weren’t, worst of all, completely ignored, unless I’ve missed those threads)–anyway, you’re halfway normal :smiley: , and Mr. Mouse provides the other half. And your native intelligence and sturdy common sense will fill in the blanks quite nicely.

“Being able to spank your children” isn’t an important parenting skill, anyway. I didn’t go into parenting in August 1984 telling myself, “Well, at least I can spank my kids if I need to.” I had never even done any babysitting outside of a single outing when I was 14, which did not go well. And suddenly there I was raising a baby at age 29.

But as you go along and have to Solve Problems, you find that your subconscious provides the solutions that your parents used on you, automatically, without you having to think about it. Problem: toddler removes clothing and runs down the street gleefully naked. Solution pops out, unbidden: Intercept, re-clothe, explain firmly that “We don’t run around naked.”

So where your challenge will lie is in detecting when the solution that pops out is one of your mother’s solutions that you, now more enlightened and mature, feel is undesirable, and in being able to modify it to be more suitable. Or in scrapping it completely and going with what Mr. Mouse’s automatic solution would be. Or even in consulting an Internet message board for still other solutions. :smiley:

Duck Duck Goose said most of what I was going to say.

For the most part, you will know good parenting because you will know what it was you needed and didn’t get. There are two caveats though: it can be painful, to grieve what you didn’t have, and at the same time provide it for your daughter. The other, as Duck Duck Goose said, is that it’s easy to overcompensate. There are situations when I am sure my daughter must be feeling scared, angry, etc., because I would have felt that way, when in reality she’s okay with it. I have to be careful to follow her cues, and not teach her to be angry or scared b/c I would be.

Said through tears of joy: “Oh, thank you Mom; you don’t know what this means to me! You simply must stay for the eating of the placenta; I won’t take “no” for an answer!”