LDR revisited; seeking advice

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
41

Just a bit of warning.

Is a part of your attraction to her that you are kind of saving her? You’re the white knight that’s going to make her life wonderful. You will be the difference in her life that makes everything sweet and beautiful.

If any of that even has a smidgen of how you feel about your relationship with her. Please be very careful.

Otherwise. Full steam ahead. I would vote for you to be straightforward with her family. No sugar coating or hiding intentions. You will have to interact with these people for a good part of your life going forward.

42

So with all this new-found information in mind, drink half a glass of water right before you’re going to sleep. (Like right before. Don’t read a book inbetween.) While you’re drinking it, say to yourself, “By the time I finish this glass of water, I’ll know the best way to approach (fiance’s) parents with the news of our engagement.”

Drink the other half of the glass immediately upon waking. Don’t think about the question; just drink the water.

Before the end of the day, you’ll have your answer. It’ll just come into your mind, and you’ll have a “Eureka!” moment.

Congratulations on your engagement, **elninost0rm, **and your determination to solve your current dilemma. As long as you’re aware of the traps for young players, you have a good chance of circumnavigating them. Couples counseling may be something to consider. It seems you may both have a lot on your plate, and it’s always a good idea to expand your solution strategies.

43

Her actions to this point lindsaybluth suggest she chooses elninost0rm over her parents. I think that to actually put the question to her would seem churlish. More than likely she would answer in the way elninost0rm would expect anyway; I mean, what else would she say - her parents? Besides, it’s not a true answer until life or death is at stake.

Seemingly she has a pattern of avoidance tactics in preference to upsetting people, so I’m not sure what the point would be in asking. Actions, as they say, speak louder than words.

44

As someone who got married despite his family hating me, it’s actually more trying than you might think. My in-laws were 4 hours away and my husband wasn’t close with them, but I wouldn’t want to do that again.

I think your fiancee ideally needs to demonstrate sustained independence before she does something like get married or move out of the country. But I have very set notions about what people need to be able to do on their own (i.e. “survive”) before they start getting dependent on someone else.

45

I second that!

46

Amen. One problem is that growing out of it can be practically impossible for some people.

From the day she was born, Sally was exposed to, and soon subjected to her mother’s “explosive emotional blackmail”, and avoidance and passive aggression are effectively hardwired into her personality. She is perfectly aware of this, and would love nothing more than to be more assertive and less responsive to the crap her mother flips at her, but it’s much more easily said than done, especially when her mother is never going to change. As Sally puts it, “Mom really knows how to push those buttons, because she installed them.”

.

47

Hi elninost0rm I went and read your other thread you mentioned. I noticed this was somewhat of a sore point for you so please don’t take this as a criticism just for criticisms sake. I have a great deal of empathy for people attempting to go through the immigration process into the US and I got the impression from your last thread that you might not have a good idea of what you are getting into. Have you had a chance to look into the process a bit more? The thing that sticks out to me the most is how young you are relatively and you mention in your last thread you just started a new job. If she is planning to come to the US as a spouse you need to have been making a certain amount of money for at least three years before you would qualify.

Have you considered that the reason her parents are so hesitant about this relationship is that as immigrants themselves they know how hard and expensive the process and don’t want to see their daughter go through the same hassle?

48

I should say… multicultural marriages are hard. The ones I know of that have worked have had a fundamental agreement on something, ideally several things, besides love. With my husband and me, it’s an American upbringing (though my parents are Asian, I was born and bred in the US), a shared geek subculture, and a shared religious commitment. With my friend it’s been a shared commitment to liberal causes. And so on.

Heh. This. Most of my friends think my dad is a complete pushover, and in a lot of ways I guess he’s been conditioned that way, but he also does a lot of behind-the-scenes calming my mom down… she’s waaaaay more hyper when he’s not around.

I’m a total avoider with my parents. Always have been. Probably always will be, some. In my 20’s, I had to work a lot on this tendency in my relationships, although I like to think I don’t do it with my husband or my friends at this point. OP, please note that you and she may have to work on this as well.

I try not to do avoidance with my parents as much as I used to, especially since I’ve had the Little One (I don’t want her growing up with bad habits), but it’s very tempting, because it actually is useful in my family. (My mom has a bad memory, so when something isn’t resolved it’s even odds she’ll just forget about it. But if you do direct confrontation there’s no hope. Of course, the adult thing to do would be to address it in a calm, off-the-cuff manner, but that’s so much more difficult!)

49

Hey do you think that her parents are opposed to her dating YOU, dating a guy she met on the Internet, or dating any guy in general?

If it’s you, why do you think they don’t like you?

If it’s the Internet…well, people are still weird about that. But, if you meet on the Internet IMHO you have to move in to “we are really real” as quick as possible and this means spending time with the parents whether you all like it or not. They need to be convinced that you are a real person and get over the whole Internet thing.

If it’s that they don’t want her dating anyone, then her parents are just crazy. I don’t know how to deal with that.

BTW I remember your last thread and kudos to the gf for moving out!

50

I agree that she does need to demonstrate some independence before she starts thinking of getting married. It’d be bad for everyone if she just transferred all that codependence on to you. What if you guys end up together, she she ends up basically dependent on you, and things end up not working out? Both of you will be in a very bad spot.

There is no excuse for her not to be financially independent at her age. There is no excuse for the fact that she appears to have no long-term plan. She needs to be able to take care of herself. This is about more than obnoxious overbearing parents- it’s about her role in her relationship with her parents and with her ability to successfully run her own life. Her parents are not an excuse for that.

As you encourage her to become independent, I would also set some solid ideas about where the relationship is going and what your “get out” point is. You need to lay down a line for yourself- have some milestones and some timelines for them, and be willing to leave if you are not reaching them. It’s easy to accept an proposal, but until she is actually there being a part of the relationship, it’s just words.

I had a friend who was in a long-term intercultural relationship where the woman would not confront her deeply religious parents about the relationship. The parents had some idea, and had met him once, but she basically avoided the whole subject- even after they had effectively moved in together. He waited patiently through all her emotional drama about it, her occasional sudden decision not to see him any more (always followed by a sudden decision that love conquers all), her wishy-washy avoidance when it came to making hard choices to make the relationship work and her religious angst. He waited and waited for years, thinking every day that it’d just be another week, or another month, before she chose to really be with him.

In the end, it didn’t work out.

She is now in a happy long-term relationship, openly and without drama, with someone who is equally as unacceptable to her family. He, FWIW, is happily married to the girl he started dating after the break-up, and they adore each other.

The point is, if she wants to be with you, she’ll be with you. If she’s not choosing to be with you, it’s probably because on some level she doesn’t want to. Love does conquer all. So, if it’s not conquering all, then something essential (attraction, vision of the future, etc.) just isn’t strong enough.

51

Not to make light of the other issues here, but even if he doesn’t make enough to qualify as her sponsor on his own, he can also get a joint sponsor to make up the difference. Details here.

Eva Luna, Immigration Paralegal

52

So if you marry someone from another country, (and it’s not a scam marriage) your spouse may still not be able to legally come the US?

53

Yes, if you can’t document that you are either able to support your spouse or that you have convinced someone else to be legally on the hook for supporting your spouse, your spouse is not eligible for a green card via marriage to you. There are other disqualifying reasons, but finances are certainly one of them.

54

(I’m re-reading the thread)

I think what matters is his relationship with his daughter. Regardless of how he copes (or doesn’t) with his wife, his acceptance of your marriage would be a tremendous emotional boost for your (future) wife.

.

55

Oh gosh yes, immigration is an incredibly complicated process and there are plenty of reasons you can be denied.

Expensive too, I think all told we ended up spending about 5k for me to come to the US.

56

Thanks for the tip.

I’m making roughly ~$30,000/yr. employed by the PA State gov’t. as a clerk. I now have a full year of service, but as you said, that might not be enough.

I’m not fully aware of the finer points related to the move, but I have started to educate myself. Bits and pieces. We want to keep costs low but that won’t be possible should we choose to have a lawyer handle most of this.

I’ve saved my refund for the past 2 years and haven’t touched it, so I have a decent amount stashed away to help in any way possible with this endeavor. She also has around $15,000 CDN stored in her savings account, so that should help considerably.

Who is eligible to co-sponsor this move?
EDIT: Just to clarify: we plan to take the “conventional” route, as in completing all the paperwork/hiring an attorney/etc. and not just the quick-and-dirty covert ops wedding. Does that even work anymore?

57

Sorry for double.

My apologies for abandoning the thread for a bit. I appreciate all the advice. I’m not going to reply to each post, but just know that every word was read and appreciated.

58

There’s no requirement for a co-sponsor to be related in any way; he/she just needs to meet the other requirements (U.S. citizenship/permanent residence, plus the income/asset criteria, which depend on household size and whether he/she has previously sponsored anyone).

59

The first thing that concerns me is that you’ve only seen her in person 10-12 times in the past 2 years. Seeing someone every other month means you’ve never moved out of the Amour Fou phase and settled into the mundane phase that normally precedes an engagement. So I hope that you are planning a long engagement where the two of you can actually live in the same town and explore your day-to-day personalities, which are quite different than the every-other-month thrilled-to-be-together-personalities.

The second thing that concerns me is her unwillingness in the last year and a half to admit to her parents that she’s still dating you. If, at the age of 27, she still feels so marginalized that she cannot tell them the truth, then she’s truly not independent yet. At the end of the day, she may not be able to have her parents AND you, and she needs to come to terms with that. Right now, she’s burying her head in the sand and hoping that it’ll all go away. It won’t. And she needs to really do some soul-searching to discern whether a life without her parents is something she can handle. So I’d strongly encourage her to break the news to them asap – not an engagement, but simply that she is still dating you and she’s in love with you.

If there is ANY chance that you will receive their blessing, then that has to be the first step. Likely, they’ll feel betrayed and dismayed. But if they have any sense, they’ll connect the dots and realize that if she’s been seeing you for the better part of 2 years, and if she’s finally worked up the courage to divulge it, then it’s for real – and too late for them to stop the relationship in its tracks (which is what they thought they accomplished the first time). Whether they deserve it, giving them HONESTY at long last, then giving them ample time to absorb the news, is the respectful thing to do. Give them that.

If they still won’t accept you, then you know that at least you’ve tried. But for her sake, give it a shot. Having her choose between her parents and you is a cruel choice, which hopefully you’ll all avoid.

Finally, an engagement is between two people, not one. After an appropriate amount of time, no matter what their initial reaction, I’d tell them of the engagement together. You are a united front now. Man up and stand by her side. Tell them to their face that you love their daughter and that you WANT them to support and accept the relationship. In short, you need to start acting like her future husband, not some distant internet boyfriend. Don’t send her up there to do this alone.

60

Thanks for the message. Unfortunately, that’s really how an LDR works. As you might guess, 90% of our interaction is online. We Skype almost every day, and probably half of that is using our digital cameras. The rest is through AOL IM. It’s debatable as to whether or not we’ve reached the “mundane” stage, but both are us are plenty comfortable with allowing the other their space. It’s a poor simulation of actually living together, but I was aware of this hurdle before I became committed. All LDR’s suffer this fate, and it’s sometimes a “gamble” of sorts when you actually move in together.

That said, I don’t think a “long-term engagement living in the same town” is really all that possible. As I understand it, she has 90 days to actually marry me in my country once the temporary visa is issued, right? That doesn’t really allow for a lot of “feeling out,” I guess.

She’s afraid to tell her parents because she’s scared. She has admitted this to me on numerous occasions. Yes, she’s 27, grow up, all that good stuff. She’s been very sheltered throughout her upbringing (stifled, I’d say) and moving out was a big, independent step she made. It was a step that she largely made for the sake of the relationship, and for that, I give her all due credit. I knew that she needed it for herself as a person, and I told her that, and she is now beginning to see that life is a whole lot brighter without having to live with them on a daily basis.

I mean no disrespect, but you can’t really understand what her household was like. Based on what she’s told me, there are a number of valid reasons why she would want to keep something like that secret. Even so, she will be telling them of her trip here later this month as well as our relationship, so it appears that will be satisfied.