I’d appreciate any thoughts you might be willing to share concerning living in ethnically diverse neighborhoods.
A little background - but I’ll try to keep it short and expand upon things should the conversation develop.
My wife and I are both in our late 40s and of European ancestry, several generations removed from any immigrants. All of our lives, from childhood through college and during adulthood, we have lived in communities that were overwhelmingly (probably >95%) European-ancestry caucasian.
We are planning on moving in the near future - we are not sure where. Last night we looked at a home we absolutely fell in love with. While perhaps not one-of-a-kind, it certainly is one-of-a-very-few-of-its-kind. Price is affordable to us, and location has many other things going for it.
The ONLY thing keeping us from putting an offer on the house immediately, was that it is in a community where nearly 50% of the population is a different ethnicity than ours. Small example, driving through the small downtown the majority of businesses had signs in a language other than English.
It is interesting when you come up against something like this - as much as I might praise diversity and declaim the insular lily-white nature of my current community, any questions I might have had get magnified when at issue is the lion’s share of my family’s net worth. In short, it makes clear how comfortable I have been all of my life being happily ensconced within the ethnic supermajority.
Like I said, I’ll be happy to try to expand upon my feelings/thoughts or add details to whatever extent anyone is interested, but I’d prefer to start off getting your experiences/gut reacting to the situation I present.
I’ve lived most of my life in such places. My current suburb would have white Australians and Lebanese ones probably rough equal first, followed by Vietnamese, Greeks, Turks, Maori, Sudanese, Chinese, and a smattering of Koreans, Indians, Pacific Islanders and others. It’s a reasonably safe, friendly place. I’ve never lived in a place with just two ethnicities and possible resultant tension, but it’s so mixed here everybody just seems to get along.
Actually, when I visit my mother in a country town, I feel a little odd that EVERYBODY is white. Not bad, just… odd. Multicultural areas are my comfort zone.
What exactly is bothering you about moving there? Are you afraid for your children? Afraid people will rob you? or just afraid you will be different?
No matter what your kids are going to stand out. The only way you can prevent that is to never move, and I happen to think new places and environs are good for kids. (Raising them in one place has its perks too though.)
I would say go for it. Your kids will be exposed to many new things and new cultures. Their horizons will be broadened. You and they will both have a feeling of what it’s like to live somewhere where you’re not the majority.
I have always lived my life in vastly white towns and it’s very different and enjoyable. I think you’ll end up really liking it. What’s the ethnicity, Spanish? Korean?
Again, my gut feel is that the “ethnic crime” we hear of tends to be intra-community. I can only afford to live in a white trash neighbourhood or an ethnically mixed one. I’ve lived in both, and I feel much, MUCH safer in the latter. There are a lot of young migrant boys and men into gangs and such, but they tend to leave others alone. Conversely, when I lived in a poor, white area, I was constantly harrassed for money, cigarettes, etc or was just left feeling none too safe. There was a lot of heroin there. There’s almost none here.
I have always lived in mixed-ethnicity areas (except when I was in grad school, but then the town was practically all-white), and have on occasion been the only native English speaker in my building. I love it. It’s interesting. And if you like to experiment culinarily, the grocery shopping is great (and usually a lot cheaper than chain supermarkets).
Of course, much depends on the specifics - there are ethnic neighborhoods that are just regular neighborhoods that happen to have people of other ethnicities living in them, and there are ethnic neighborhoods that I wouldn’t want to live in for safety reasons.
My area is increasingly mixed ethnicity, immigrants from pretty much every country on earth. The quality of life hasn’t decreased and if anything has increased in the period of immigration.
According to the census, IIRC 48% hispanic, of which 98% is Mexican.
Not entirely sure - for me I think basically unease at something that is different from what I have experienced the past 47 years. Tho I cannot categorically deny there may be some element of prejudice. I’m trying to suss out exactly what I am feeling and why. And I’m not sure my feelings are exactly the same as my wife’s. Then, if I am successful in identifying the basis for my feelings, I/we need to decide if it is something we can/want to try to change.
2 simple, possibly little things as examples. Driving down the main street, every store’s sign was in Spanish. Supermercado, Taverna, etc. Neither my wife nor I speak Spanish. I have never before lived somewhere that the vast majority of businesses/services were aimed at a culture/language other than mine. I suppose the healthy attitude would be to view this as a growth opportunity. Heck, immerse myself in a different culture, learn the language. But I’m not entirely sure we could both successfully adopt that position, even if we wanted to.
Second, my wife and I really desire a quiet, peaceful neighborhood, and we generally keep to ourselves. We currently live on a busier street than we would prefer, and one reason we want to move is to eliminate that noise. In my limited experience, and at the risk of making a gross generalization, I get the impression that many Mexican families enjoy large social events with extended family. In short, I’m concerned that the noise might bug us, and if it might bother us more if what noise we perceived was of a different culture. But if their culture doesn’t view large, loud parties as annoyances, we certainly have no business moving into their neighborhood and either expecting them to change or resenting them.
See, I’m not trying to defend my feelings - just trying to figure them out. And even if my concerns are irrational or undesireable, I would be foolish to ignore them while plunking down several hundred $K.
Spanish/Mexican people are more integrated, IME, and do get together more. I’ll be honest, part of the reason I like staying in white neighborhoods so much is everybody keeps to themselves, and I value my privacy immensely.
There is no reason to “defend” your position. It is tough to change so radically. My whole life has been one of change and adjustment, that doesn’t mean I can’t understand it from the opposite point of view.
I will agree that the grocery shopping is awesome, but there will be an adjustment period.
Now that you have stated some of the reservations you have about moving there, how about some of the things you might find fun? Maybe you should make a list, “pros”, and “cons”, and write down stuff on each side. It might help clarify your position to yourself.
I think it sounds like an amazingly cool opportunity. It sounds like you might be a little uncomfortable at first, but eventually everything will just seem normal again, and you’ll have the added opportunity of personal growth learning about another culture, and hey, maybe even pick up a little Spanish.
If you are concerned about noise, and that seems like a legitimate concern, I would try casing the place at various times of the day to see how the relative noise level is. For example, drive past at 10pm or midnight just to see if there’s anyone congregating and making racket. Try it at various times throughout the day and various days throughout the week. Then you’ll have a pretty good idea what your noise climate will be.
–olives, who is about to move to a community that is 40% Latino and is totally psyched about it
I don’t know where he lives, but according to your own link, the only non-southwestern city in which Mexicans are the major Hispanic community is Chicago.
IMHO this is a pretty valid concern. Keep in mind though that the vibe in all Mexican neighborhoods isn’t going to be the same – where my boyfriend lives by Midway is quieter than the west side, and quiet enough for the South Side as a whole. Definitely check out the block itself if you haven’t already-- head down there on Saturday night and Sunday afternoon for a walk around. Keep in mind, you’re not trying to figure out if you can live in any arbitrary Mexican neighborhood, you’re just trying to figure out if you can live in this neighborhood, regardless of ethnicity.
FYI, I was merely relating that the census bureau reports them as describing themselves as of Mexican ethnicity. Of course you knew that, unless you are really not all that bright. :rolleyes:
My preference would be to discuss this without folks having to worry about every word they choose, without including disclaimers and modifiers at every turn. Heck, I might even slip and refer to someone as “white” in this thread. If I do, you gonna pull out your color chart for me?
I used to live in a 95% white area, now I live in a very diverse community, so much so that we reckon we are the only two native English speakers on our street. And 'im indoors doesn’t really count 'cos he’s Scottish.
There is a large Bengali and Punjabi community where I live now, a bonus for me because we have some excellent curry houses! In the last couple of years, we’ve seen an influx of Poles, Turks, Kurds, Iranians, Kenyans and Somalis (and probably a lot more I’ve yet to recognise). It’s reached the point where the local shop is owned by Turks, the nearest off-licence is run by a Pole who speaks virtually no English but smiles a lot, and the supermarket is run by Punjabis. If you want to hear English spoken, you have to be in our house! But if you want to buy exotic spices and have a broken conversation with grandmother about what to do with them, you need to be in the Punjabi supermarket. As for the Polish off-licence, apart from vodka, I’ve got no idea what else he’s selling but I’ll give it a try.
I wouldn’t say I feel any less safe with the change in ethnicity, I’ve always felt marginally unsafe but sometimes it’s quite intimidating to find a large group of young foreign men lounging about outside the shops or just hanging about on street corners. I’ve never had any bother from them, but there’s just that nagging feeling that it’s only a matter of time.
I agree that there is no way to advise you unless you tell us what exactly is giving you second thoughts about this.
My one piece of advice is that in any community, the more you become a part of the community, the safer and happier you will be, and the more you will learn.
If you are the kind of person who makes friends with your neighbors, shops in local shops, is willing to learn a few words of a new language and generally make a small effort to be with the people who live near you, you will do great and people will watch out for you. If you are a “close the door and be done with it” kind of person, you will stick out as an outsider and run the slight risk of being a target for whatever unpleasant activities go on. This doesn’t mean bad things will happen. Chances are it’s just fine. But becoming a part of your community can go a LONG way towards making sure that community watches out for you.
Incidentally, I wasn’t trying to be pedantic or anything; you said you thought Mexican families might be loud, which may or may not be true, as I don’t know any.
I do, however, know lots and lots of Puerto Rican and Cuban families, and they’re generally not loud at all. Thus the (pointless, as it turns out) nitpick.