Actually in the peek household this type of behavior would result in the older dogs licking my nosebleed, the younger dog retreating to his kennel in fear and the cats ingesting houses leading to a costly emergency vet clinic visit.
And I don’t think playing by the rules is a bad thing. I mean they don’t have a different height basket based on the player’s size. Cripes I can dunk a volleyball on an eight foot basket.
Whoops, peek has the ball - lower the basket and change balls. He passes to Kobe - raise the basket and change balls again. If it comes back to me I am passing to Gausol and letting Crawford figure it out.
And I just gotta add - for all those folks that don’t think posting is important and that silence should be rewarded - welcome to the library where all discussions will be met with skepticism and quiet will be rewarded with a pass.
All praise to the lurkers for they shall inherit the town. Sure hope they are good guys.
I like to give everyone a full Day before I start lurker hunting. There are some very good and helpful players (Blaster and Hal are two that come to mind) that almost never manage to post a heck of a lot on Day Ones.
Hell, Lynch the Lurker right now would be pointing at Rooshie… and there’s no way we want to kill his butt before he comes in here and overloads the hamsters with his doctoral thesis of a response to everything.
Well instead of attemping to throw my toys out of the pram, I should have taken a step back and reviewed the situation again given what Nanook’s slip was and what he has claimed.
Initally Nanook’s slip was this.
His claim as given to the town was that he is a Witch, so lets assume he is being truthful.
Now combining Nanook’s statement about secret powers and his claim he is a Witch could imply that either all three Witches have a secret power or that the Witch role has a secret power as a unit.
Now we know from the ruleset that:
Each side will have one secret power. The secret power may be a collective power distributed among multiple players, or may be held by one player.
Now adding Nanook’s statements to the ruleset intimates that he has access to a power role and as a Witch means, either one Witch has an extra secret power or all three Witches as one have the Town extra secret power.
Oh and if I can work this out, anyone can.
However, as explanation, the following was said.
But, in the original rules, all three witches had their own secret power. If he was getting the rules mixed up, then would he have expected all three Witches to have seperate secret powers?
This contradicts the rules however. So assuming Nanook is truthful about his claim can lead to a small problem…
So is Nanook scum?
Well it entirely depends on what he was referring to as “the role” and how confused he was about the ruleset. Something that I cannot determine but only guess at.
Does it matter?
Well not really, he has claimed Witch and will have to fulfill that role for the rest of the game. If he slips up, then he will be lynched. Ironically, it’s along the lines of what I had in mind for a first Day roleclaim. Force people to act through claimed roles, just not with someone claiming Witch up front.
Time to move on and find another scum instead.
You want analytics storyteller, I got yer analytics right 'ere
15 pages in and I have no idea who I want to see swing toDay. I’m going to go back to the beginning tonight and do a reread. Hopefully I will find a lynchable canidate.
But, if I don’t get through the re read or if I don’t find a suitable target:
Vote No Lynch
I don’t think a no lynch on day one would be a bad thing. We could have 3 kills toNight - maybe more. Without an obvious - or even likely target for a lynch, we are just guessing. And if we’re just guessing, I fully believe that the scum are trying to persuade the guesses in their favor. Hopefully we’ll have more to go on tomorrow. But for now I don’t see any reason to lynch anyone. We still have over 30 hrs til lynch, so that may change.
Ok, as I said earlier on, there are a couple of people I wanted to look at in greater detail.
First up pedescribe
#106: you suggested we should target the undead and wolves with the Cabal later in the game. Because the Cabal is almost certainly three in number.
Ok, how can you say that the Cabal is almost certainly three in number? Are you suggesting that in a game with more players where the secret powers are limited to one per side and given that the Cabal got stuffed in the last game, that Pleonast would weaken their side.
Please explain it to me.
#112You list a set of roles which are almost certainly in the game, but then say that you could be completely wrong.
Ok, then what was the point of that post?
#152You say what you think the town should do to slow and stop the undead and wolves without mentioning what you are going to do about the Cabal?
So, what are you going to do to the Cabal?
#185You seem almost certain that the Witches are in the game because otherwise the Cabal becomes too powerful.
Contrast this with you earlier thoughts about the Cabal being the weak faction though. Is it just the absence of the Witches that makes the Cabal so powerful or is it that you know the Witches must exist?
#240This statement caught my eye. “So if we agree that the cabal will be more powerful, and it’s more bloody, (meaning the undead is more powerful) it follows that our powers will be better to compensate. And it works because Pleo didn’t want to expose it during the mass PM reveal, because then we’d all know, but this way we don’t.”
**Pleonest ** didn’t want to expose it as part of a mass PM reveal???
I’m sorry but saying that something is so because the GM doesn’t want a mass role reveal on Day 1 is ludicrous.
Next up is the role reveal idea in which you voted for me for Role fishing, but would made me curious was your unvote
#500"And it doesn’t look like Cat has made much more of a splash".
I had not changed my viewpoint and was still arguing it as before. What do you mean in this sentence?
Why? You mentioned an uber-freeky post of his as justification, but had not mentioned him at all in any previous posts. This just seems like a placeholder vote to me.
pedescribe: Looking back over your posts so far a few things stand out.
Your variance of the strength of the Cabal and your suggestions for dealing with scum. Your unvote for me and vote for Pollux Oil do not seem to have any basis to me.
Please can you clarify all the questions from above, because to me, your posts just scream Cabal member.
Next up, the other candidate for me to look at: Drain Bead
#414 is the first major post. Does not like Day 1 role claims and provides some reasoning for thoughts.
#430 where DB votes for me, citing a certain amount of reaching and not convinced of towniness.
However, given that my reasoning was very similar to **Santo Rugger ** but with slightly more justification, why vote for me and not him?
#506 You unvote me and vote Nanook citing good reasoning.
Next up are a couple of posts on the “lynch the lurker” strategy explaining why DB thinks it is a bad idea especially given the content of this game, followed by a few smaller posts.
After a few days of Day 1, I was beginning to think **Drain Bead ** was pretty scummy. However, reading back over her posts, I believe I may be mistaken.
The only question I have is over her vote for me.
Of the two, **pedescribe ** is by far the scummier, so I am happy with my vote as it stands.
CatInASuit, you have this weird…analytical, detached, relaxed style that just doesn’t sit well with me. Kinda like Dio’s “agressivly pursue one person until s/he’s dead” strategy rubs me the wrong way. I think that’s where most of my suspicion comes from.
::taking eyes off CatInASuit::
THat said, let me adress your concerns.
First, “how can you know that the cabal is almost certianly three in number?” Well, I don’t. Keep in mind that this post was made on night one, where we all were wildly speculating and offering various strategems. I suspect that there are three cabal this time because there were three last time, and there are still three witches, and last game they all got killed off early, so nobody could tell how good they could have been. Also, that post was made very early, before many people were speculating about how many cabal there were (keep in mind it was mentally written a few hours before I got to a computer) (most of my posts are), so the reason I assumed a three-person cabal is because I didn’t think of the idea that there would be anything but a three person cabal.
Second, again this was during the early night, where everyone was wildly speculating. I didn’t want everyone latching on to one idea and taking it as truth. I had no idea if my, or any idea, was so appealing, but I figured that since my post was so tame, it might, so I made the addendum. Okay, a little vain perhaps, but hardly malevolent.
Third, when I said mass pm reveal, I meant pleo’s list of rules on google docs. Although, it took me ten minutes of thought to figure out what I meant, so it was badly phrased. Keep in mind, however, that that was made before the idea of a mass roleclaim was an idea, so I wasn’t thinking about other possible phrasings. Here’s how I would say this now if I was going to make the same point now.
It’s still a stupid point.
Fourthly, “what do you mean in this sentence [and it doesn’t look like cat has made much more of a splash]”. You are right, in that you personally didn’t change my opinion about your scuminess in my eyes. However, you and I don’t post in a vacuum. Other people posted. Other people, who said things like ‘CatInASuit may be contreversial, but he’s not scummy, and here’s why’, and ‘CatInASuit’s logic isn’t flawed, and here’s why’, and ‘I’m going to lynch anyone who votes for CatInASuit’. And not only that, but everyone’s inherent level of scumminess drops for me over time without anyone doing anything. Because I play this game with my emotions, my votes tend to be on rash opinions as opposed to large tallies. As I calm down, and I manage to look at it from another point of view, everything’s more explainable. Everything, and that’s why usually I’ll change my vote several times over the day. So while you personally didn’t do anything, in my eyes, your scuminess level dropped enough for me to unvote you.
Fifthly, I’ve already explained my Pollux Oil vote. You’re right, in that it is a sort of a placeholder vote because I find him the scummiest at the moment, but not extrodinarily scummy. However, I do contend one point. I’ve mentioned him before I voted for him.
In post #559. The contents of that post are this:
I hope that changes your mind, because I’m not a cabal member.
Thanks for answering, but I don’t think you actually answered my question. What you seem to be saying here is that, in the heat of the moment, you didn’t think through the situation clearly. Now that you’ve looked at it more calmly, you no longer think it is a terrible idea that the consensus seems to be to not lynch Nanook. Is that accurate?
But I’m still wondering what you were thinking *at the time *you said that you were so not impressed with the town rolling over. Specifically, what did you want those voting for Nanook to do instead?
Thinking this over, I see a difference between the mod-kill in Simpletown and looking at the supposed witch board: the mod-kill was using the rules of the game to win the game, the witch board would be using environment the game is played in to break the game. In your example you only win at throwing punches, you’ve merely destroyed the game, not won it. If I see a way to win a game by sacrificing myself in a manner accounted for in the structure of the game, I see no reason not to do so; just as is checkers or chess I would sacrifice a piece in order to control the game. I doubt that there will be a point in this game where allowing oneself to be mod-killed will be optimal for the town, but if there is I’d expect a townie to use it.
I wanted to get back to this, since I had a thought when I first read it that I neglected to put on the record. I’m not convinced that CIAS is scum, either, but I’m not a big fan of the “scum wouldn’t do that” line of thought. You may remember in Simpleton, fluid, when MadTheSwine suggested that the Detective reveal himself, several people jumped on him, and several others (yourself included, IIRC) said something along the lines of: “No, a scum MadTheSwine would never say something so stupid.” Of course, it turns out he was the Lead Assassin.
I understand that the mantra of “look for the motivation behind the post” is king around here, but just because you (general you) can’t think of a reason for a scum to do something, doesn’t mean there isn’t one. So while I agree that CIAS has been very vocal and putting himself out there so far in this game, and that this is not normal scum behavior, that doesn’t mean he’s not scum.
I don’t think the situation here is in any way analogous to the MadTheSwine issue. I jumped on MTS then, and rightfully so - he was role-fishing. It wasn’t smart play but it was scum play.
I think there’s a pretty big difference between role-fishing for one (and only one) specific role - especially the most important Town role - and a mass claim in a game of only power roles. As I’ve repeatedly mentioned, the mass claim idea is a pretty big headache for scum too (who are hiding not only from Town, but also one another). Further, CIAS has led the charge against Nanook, and – predictably – when Nanook gave a problematic claim to lynch, the Town turned around to blame the messenger. This is crappy logic.
I’m not saying that someone who has made a lot of waves CAN’T be scum, I’m saying that we should allow for some actual reasoning on behalf of scum players. Fishing for the Detective has pretty obvious scum reasoning. Again, what is CIAS’ reasoning supposed to be? I’ll outline, and continue to push even when pressed, a highly unpopular mass claim idea and then lead the charge against someone vehemently? I just don’t see anything but Town motivations behind this. If I’m wrong, or you can think of reasoning, fine - but I just don’t think we should lynch CIAS based on the evidence. Being wrong and having unpopular ideas are not scum behaviors, and that’s pretty much the case against CIAS.
Look, my intention is not to be hurtful or to call anyone out in particular. Further I didn’t ascribe any motivations to your post, nor do I think poorly of you in any way. I just think people should remember that a lot of folks read the Mafia threads and participate in them as well and please keep game-talk relatively respectful. The line between smack talk and being insulting can be vague at times and there are spectators involved - that’s what I meant by ‘borderline’.
That’s the last I’ll say on the subject, it’s becoming a major hijack. Anyone can PM me if they have more questions about this.
As a matter of fact, if I may continue the metagaming a bit, in what I think was my first game as scum, a scummy Blaster Master had the strategy of being way out there from day one as the uber-helpful townie, and damn if it didn’t work really, really well. He ended up bussing me on the first Day for massive townie cred. Given that this game started at Night, I’m sure the scum that can communicate with one another have already come up with plans, maybe similar ones.
I think you’ve missed my point. I was not trying to equate CIAS’ mass role claim idea and Mad’s role fishing, which you rightly say are not equivalent. I was merely trying to point to a situation that we both experienced where people said things like “Scum would never do that” when it turned out that scum definitely did do that. I’m very cautious of that line of reasoning.
Also, I think you’ve poorly summarized what happened with CIAS and **Nanook’s **claim. The way you put it, it sounds like when Nanook claimed, everyone looked around and said “Hmm, who was leading the charge against him? CIAS! Let’s vote for him!” That’s not what happened. What happened was that Nanook claimed and **CIAS **questioned that claim aggressively, asking for Nanook’s role PM and what his powers were. That’s why people jumped on him, not because he had been pressing Nanook before the claim (or blaming the messenger, as you call it).
So, I’ll ask you your own question: what do you think the motivation was for CIAS to ask for those things?