Mafia Reunion - Day Two

[LightFoot]

@Lakai

Well, this is awkward. Hello town! Nothing like being strung up from a tree to end your first day in town. No need to apologize or anything. I’ll be fine. I promise.

Both Colby and Lakai (Part I) were town, but a lot of people thought their behavior was pretty scummy. Can we gain anything from looking at the people voting for them? Were the votes driven by scum looking to lynch a town person, or did scum just sit by while the town gathered a bandwagon around their own people?

I mean I was essentially lynched for voting for Colby and then for not doing such a good job defending that vote. But I was town voting for Colby.

for the record I voted LakaiV1 for the reasons I stated ( not the vote) LakaiV1’s reasoning
for D1 hit me so sour I could not see past it. No hard feelings. Now that I know that is how you look at the game I will disregard that as a non-Town tell

[TexCat]

And for those who want to see the unvotes.

Normal Phase(1): [del]Texcat[29-91][/del], Johnny Bravo[36], [del]Pleonast[241-511][/del]
**Angel(3): **[del]SNF[37-157][/del], Zeriel[413], TotalLost[493], [del]JSGoddess[503-716][/del], BoozySquid[546],[del] Septimus[981-993][/del],[del] Lakai[1006-1209][/del]
Johnny Bravo(0): [del]Meeko[41-130], BuffTabby[259-1094], Septimus[488-659][/del]
ToeJam(15): CaptKlutz[57-347,796], Sunny[113], Normal[147-322,1011], Hooker[184], Sinjin[200], Sachertorte[534], Lakai[775-1006,1209], ProfP[1057], BillMc[1152], Septimus[1155], Biotop[1178], Guiri[1182], Ender[1195], Chronos[1197], SNF[1205]
Pleonast(1): [del]Septimus[85-106][/del], ThingFish[794],[del] Normal[824-1011][/del], [del]Nesta[1187-1187][/del]
Colby(6): Texcat[91],[del] Guiri[101-977], Septimus[106-231,993-1034], Meeko[130-1082][/del], ToeJam[132], [del]HockeyMonkey[152-1101][/del], [del]Lakai[154-775][/del], Suburban[162-541,1026], [del]Diggit[249-264][/del], Hawkeye[350], [del]Nanook[455-1208][/del], Brewha[683], Pleonast[841]
Meeko(0): [del]Drain[94-888][/del]
Drain(0): [del]Angel[97-542][/del]
BoozySquid(0):[del] Normal[102-147], SNF[157-295], Angel[542-1078], Biotop[709-957][/del]
JSGoddess(0): [del]Chronos[183-917][/del]
Hawkeye(0): [del]BoozySquid[188-540][/del]
**Capt Klutz(0): **[del]HoopyFrood[195-480], Drain[889-1108][/del]
Septimus(1): Ender[243], [del]TotalLost[273-493], Normal[322-714], Colby[335-946], CaptKlutz[347-796], HoopyFrood[480-736], Pleonast[511-841][/del]
Lakai(17): InnerSticker[257],[del] SNF[295-1205][/del], RedSkeez[319], PlumPudding[647], Lightfoot[883], Koldanar[900], [del]Guiri[977-1182][/del], HoopyFrood[1031], Angel[1078], Meeko[1082], HockeyMonkey[1102], Drain[1108], RavenThief[1109], JSGoddess[1129], MHaye[1176], Nesta[1187], BuffTabby[1194], Cookies[1206], Nanook[1208]
**SNF(0): **Diggit[264]
Biotop(0): [del]PlumPudding[412-470][/del]
Prof(0)P: [del]PlumPudding[472-647], Septimus[659-981][/del]
Ender(0): [del]ProfP[528-545][/del]
PlumPudding(0): [del]Suburban[541-1026][/del]
Koldanar(0):[del] ProfP[545-908][/del]
TotalLost(0):[del] RavenThief[679-912], JSGoddess[716-1129][/del]
**Texcat(1): **Scathach[758]
Scathach(0): [del]HoopyFrood[798-1031][/del]
ThingFish(0): [del]Chronos[917-1197][/del]
Brewha(1): Colby[946]
Chronos(0): [del]Biotop[957-1178][/del]

Notes: Other vote counts show that Scathach voted Lakai in 1031, but that was actually the post where Hoopy unvoted Scathach and voted Lakai.

[Thing_Fish]

@Chronos

On the topic of Pleonast’s casting of multiple votes, even though only one would count, I think that his fault (and that of all of the rest of us) is in doing too few, not too many. I read that as “I find all of these people sufficiently suspect that I would cast a vote for them if I could, and the only reason I’m not voting for the others is that I’m only allowed to do one”. But the thing is, there are at least 14 people in this game that we should suspect, and getting out information about that helps Town in the long run. I think that we should all be striving, not just to vote for one person, but to also make clear somehow a significant number of other people we consider worthy of votes. We don’t necessarily need to format them as votes, like Pleonast did, but there should be a lot more FOSes flying around than there are.

The problem with identifying a list of players you think have an above-average case of being scum is that it implies the existence of a complementary list of players you think have a BELOW average case of being scum, and I’m not really there right now.

We saw a huge rush of players onto the Lakai and ToeJam wagons at the end of the Day. No doubt many of those were scum looking for a safe place to park their vote and blend in with the crowd. A lot of them presumably were Town thinking that one of the two was scummier than the other, and that’s great. But I think a lot of them were Town thinking that they “had to” vote for one of the leaders, and this illustrates the problem with that approach which I mentioned yesterDay; there were so many people voting for those two with flimsy “me too” type rationales that it’s hard to pick out which ones might be scum.

[AngeloftheNorth]

Vote Idle Thoughts

He’s a fairly consistent player and he’s not acting consistently now-- up to and including the late “town” claim. (I don’t think everyone has to claim town. I think he always does.)

[Drain_Bead]

Reiterating my one-off vote from yesterDay.

** vote Captain Klutz**

I really think his vote timing on septimus was such that he realized he was voting for a Town power role when he did it, because it came an hour and a half after septimus mentioned that he wouldn’t be around at EoD and would need to claim early if still a lynch leader. Seems like something Scum would try to take advantage of.
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[Prof.Pepperwinkle]

So, I’m obviously good with ToeJam, but this is an old style reunion, and there’s one player who I have a tradition with.

And he only posted 5 times yesterDay. And he didn’t vote.

vote Sario

for old times’ sake!

[Drain_Bead]

@Chronos

The existence of the Watcher would not scare off the Mafia’s factional kill, because that can’t be Watched. It could, however, scare off the Outrider, who can be Watched. So there’s a reasonable chance that a single-outed-power-role would be targeted for a kill but not Outridden, which makes protection a reasonable choice.
Why do you think that? He had already declared himself as the EMT, and had said publicly that he would be self-protecting. That takes out all the luck from the Outrider targeting him, and discourages the Mafia from making the attempt. You’re positing two parties targeting him, one having absolutely no effect, and an unknown third party making the other kill: That seems like a lot of extra assumptions to make, when we can account for both kills using mechanics known to be in the game.

This was from the N1 thread. I admit posts were fast and furious at the end of D1, but I have zero memory of septimus publicly saying he’d self-protect. Did he really do that? Because with the existence of the Outrider/Hitman roles, that’s a really bad play. Can you link the post where he said that?
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[TexCat]

@Sunny_Daze

That’s, um, disgusting. Yes. Disgusting is the word I want. Also, apparently Colby should change his name and try playing as someone else entirely, because it sucks to be him.

Not a great start to the day at all.

Or perhaps Colby should defend himself, quit lurking, and do some scum hunting. His vote on Brewha for being out of town was ridiculously bad.

This quick bandwagon on ToeJam is making me nervous.  Seems like an easy place to park a vote.  Can anyone summarize the case him?  All I remember is that he said he posts a lot and then didn't.

[snfaulkner]

@Drain_Bead

This was from the N1 thread. I admit posts were fast and furious at the end of D1, but I have zero memory of septimus publicly saying he’d self-protect. Did he really do that? Because with the existence of the Outrider/Hitman roles, that’s a really bad play. Can you link the post where he said that?
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Post 792 is a long post, but here’s the relevent quote snippet:

…And note that Wolves (the Night-time killers) may decide that a Day-time protector is more help than hindrance to them. They’d be more likely to Kill me if my Power were certain but undisclosed. Mafia won’t try to Kill me either: obviously I’ll be self-protecting now.

[Prof.Pepperwinkle]

@TexCat

Or perhaps Colby should defend himself, quit lurking, and do some scum hunting. His vote on Brewha for being out of town was ridiculously bad.

This quick bandwagon on ToeJam is making me nervous.  Seems like an easy place to park a vote.  Can anyone summarize the case him?  All I remember is that he said he posts a lot and then didn't.

See Post 568 on D1 by HookerChemical for the best case on ToeJam. I’d copy it, but it has Spoiler sections that support it, which won’t copy over (AFAIK).

[Idle_Thoughts]

@AngeloftheNorth

Vote Idle Thoughts

He’s a fairly consistent player and he’s not acting consistently now-- up to and including the late “town” claim. (I don’t think everyone has to claim town. I think he always does.)

How is claiming on Day One being inconsistent again? :dubious: I just didn’t have it first freaking post because I was mostly busy the group of days Day one went on.

Weak vote. Extremely weak.

[Prof.Pepperwinkle]

Here’s a link to that post: http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=19912942&postcount=568

[LightFoot]

@Idle_Thoughts

How is claiming on Day One being inconsistent again? :dubious: I just didn’t have it first freaking post because I was mostly busy the group of days Day one went on.

Weak vote. Extremely weak.

all I recall from you so far is your claim
dost thou have more?

[paulwhoisaghost]

@Prof.Pepperwinkle

47 votes cast out of 54 players. FOS on anyone who didn’t vote, and on anyone who posted less than 10 times considering just how long D1 was.

At least two of them subbed out right? I know the guy I took over for didn’t vote… I’m still not caught up, but so far I haven’t even seen him post. You should be doing the work to figure out who those 7 players are and then seeing who was even active enough to post at least once. Don’t bring up a topic and wait for others to fill in the blanks… it pings me… like you’re casting a wide net so you don’t have to commit to calling people out directly.

But then again you pinged me last game too…

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[snfaulkner]

@paulwhoisaghost

At least two of them subbed out right? I know the guy I took over for didn’t vote… I’m still not caught up, but so far I haven’t even seen him post. You should be doing the work to figure out who those 7 players are and then seeing who was even active enough to post at least once. Don’t bring up a topic and wait for others to fill in the blanks… it pings me… like you’re casting a wide net so you don’t have to commit to calling people out directly.

But then again you pinged me last game too…

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He didn’t post. At all. That is why you are in for him.

[Hockey_Monkey]

@Idle_Thoughts

How is claiming on Day One being inconsistent again? :dubious: I just didn’t have it first freaking post because I was mostly busy the group of days Day one went on.

Weak vote. Extremely weak.

I believe he is saying you are normally more prolific and it’s inconsistent for you to only have three Day One posts with little content.

Weak? Somewhat, but not really all *that *weak.

Why you so jumpy?

[Chronos]

Quoth Thing Fish:
We saw a huge rush of players onto the Lakai and ToeJam wagons at the end of the Day. No doubt many of those were scum looking for a safe place to park their vote and blend in with the crowd. A lot of them presumably were Town thinking that one of the two was scummier than the other, and that’s great. But I think a lot of them were Town thinking that they “had to” vote for one of the leaders, and this illustrates the problem with that approach which I mentioned yesterDay; there were so many people voting for those two with flimsy “me too” type rationales that it’s hard to pick out which ones might be scum.

And that’s part of the reason why I’d like to see people call out more suspects. Yeah, most players put as their first suspect one of three people, and that doesn’t give us much information. But if you had asked all of those voters who their second choice was, or their third, or tenth, you would probably end up with a lot more variety of opinion, and have a lot more basis to distinguish between those players.

[paulwhoisaghost]

@snfaulkner

Who posted in D1N1? spoilered for your protection

Who Posted?
Total Posts: 1,447
User Name Posts
LightFoot 91
Normal Phase 84
Plumpudding 81
AngeloftheNorth 70
Meeko 64
Suburban Plankton 62
Total Lost 59
snfaulkner 59
NAF1138 56
Prof. Pepperwinkle 56
Thing Fish 53
jsgoddess 44
raventhief 42
GuiriEnEspaña 41
Chronos 40
septimus 38
Drain Bead 37
Biotop 29
Johnny Bravo 25
Boozahol Squid, P.I. 24
bufftabby 24
HookerChemical 23
Hoopy Frood 22
TexCat 22
Sunny Daze 22
sachertorte 21
Mahaloth 20
Lakai 18
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies 17
Captain Klutz 17
Hockey Monkey 17
Nanook of the North Shore 16
Scathach 16
sinjin 14
Zeriel 13
Crys75 12
brewha 11
Pleonast 10
Colby11 9
Enderw24 8
BillMC 6
nesta 6
MHaye 5
ToeJam 5
DiggitCamara 5
Hawkeyeop 5
Sario 5
storyteller0910 4
Inner Stickler 3
Khameleon 3
Hal Briston 3
Koldanar 3
Idle Thoughts 3
paulwhoisaghost 2
Precambrianmollusc 1
Red Skeezix 1
Show Thread & Close Window

Anyone below my name on that list is gonna get the hairy eye from me when I catch up.

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[Biotop]

@Chronos

Colby was an obvious choice for the Vig and a lousy choice for the Wolves, so absent any evidence to the contrary, I assume it was him vigged and Suburban wolfed. I don’t think he gave any indications of his role, which would mean that the wolves choosing him was just dumb luck. And it hurts us significantly to be down two investigators so early: One, we could replace with the Understudy, but now one’s gone completely.

As to why he was chosen, I think (unless I missed a change somewhere) he ended the day with his vote on Colby, so that definitely wasn’t it. He wasn’t the most prolific poster left, but he was pretty high, with Meeko, Angel, and Plumpudding ahead of him. I can understand why the Scum might not have targeted Meeko or Angel, both of whom they probably considered lynchable, but I’m not sure off the top of my head about Plumpudding. It’s possible that they skipped over him because he was one of their own, or it’s possible that they just considered Suburban a greater threat as a player.

I’m honestly a little surprised that there were only two kills. We’ve had a full cycle now, with five deaths, and all of them can be accounted for. I would have expected there to be a third-party serial killer out there somewhere. Though of course we can’t rule out the possibility: Two killers might have targeted the same person, or someone might have been successfully protected, or we might have a serial killer who can choose not to kill, and so on.

On the topic of Pleonast’s casting of multiple votes, even though only one would count, I think that his fault (and that of all of the rest of us) is in doing too few, not too many. I read that as “I find all of these people sufficiently suspect that I would cast a vote for them if I could, and the only reason I’m not voting for the others is that I’m only allowed to do one”. But the thing is, there are at least 14 people in this game that we should suspect, and getting out information about that helps Town in the long run. I think that we should all be striving, not just to vote for one person, but to also make clear somehow a significant number of other people we consider worthy of votes. We don’t necessarily need to format them as votes, like Pleonast did, but there should be a lot more FOSes flying around than there are.

Chronos, you posted this long analysis only 39 minutes after the results of Night 1 came out. That’s pretty swift to say you don’t think **Suburban Plankton **gave any indication of his role. Did you really have time to reread all 62 of his posts or were you just going from memory?

[Zeriel]

I’m honestly feeling the Idle Thoughts thing that’s starting to happen here, but I’m not feeling it enough for a vote. I think he’s been VERY atypically inactive and quiet, and that worries me because I don’t think he does that whether he’s scum OR town.

If he ends up being some kind of weird-rules 3rd Party, I’m going to have SO many I-told-you-so’s.

ahem

I’m going to carry over my vote from Day One. Chewing through what I think the votes and vote timings mean is going to take a while.

vote AngeloftheNorth