Most telling statistic from the debate.

From CNN: “Another troubling number for Palin is that only 46 percent of the debate watchers said she was qualified to be president, compared to the 87 percent who picked Biden after the debate.”

Despite the fact that people graded the debate much closer in terms of who won (though Biden still ‘won’ in their poll by a good margin), this number is huge, and speaks to my real opinion after watching the debate. I have no doubt that there are 3 candidates on the major tickets that are qualified to be President…not 4.

That’s bad, although it is slightly better for Palin than the 40% of people in a pre-debate Washington Post poll who thought she was qualified. I’m an Obama supporter, but I’ve been nursing a good case of the jitters over this election for several weeks. I think the debate probably did help McCain a little. There were probably some right-leaning independents who just wanted to make sure Palin wasn’t really as bad as she looked in the Couric Incident. Since Palin was able to demonstrate that, at least, I expect a couple of points worth of reassured voters heading over to the McCain column. Probably not enough to catch up to Obama, but enough to fuel my jitters for another few days.


Yes, CNN is laughable as any kind of source. :D:D:D:D:D:D:D

I don’t know that I’d be too worried about that Bayard. She’s decent with the canned speeches and okay with using policy sound bites to dodge questions, but it’s clear she’s prone to collapse anytime there’s no script. She’s lost the image as the “ringer” for McCain, and the image as a highly intelligent, attractive, ideal female VP candidate. While she’s still a favorite of the rabid right, I can’t help but wonder if they aren’t wavering a little, simply because it’s clear McCain’s people are telling her what to think. How influential is she going to be when he’s in office and pushing policy away from what that rabid right want? There’s already been talk of her going away, stepping down, resigning, even getting fired.

And despite her being the VP candidate, this leaves a massive hole for Dems to exploit, either directly or through proxies of various sorts. She isn’t thinking for herself, she’s a puppet, she’s too chicken to even risk an interview, etc. For having a month left in the campaign, there’s a lot of subtle damage done, and in a sense, her being attractive may start to work against her if she can’t show some presidential ability or intelligence during the last few weeks. “Ditz” is already being tossed around, and she’s got that cruel impression she’s got to shake, as well. SNL is probably going to haunt her dreams till she dies, too. If she wins and I was Tina Fey, I’d probably flee the country. :smiley:

It wasn’t Biden’s best showing, but long-term it wasn’t bad. Attacking her might have won some points with the home team, but letting her fail on her own was probably the better strategy for the long term.

Philo, the source doesn’t really matter here, impression does. CNN has plenty of viewers, regular and sporadic, and often all it takes is pointing things out. For hardcore party members, such things are laughable. For the other 60% of voters that are straddling the middle or only leaning a certain way, those little details make a big difference, no matter the source.

Somebody (I think MSNBC) did a poll of uncommitted voters after the debate: 18% were now for Obama, 10% now for McCain, and 71% still undecided.

If this has any impact at all (and I doubt it will), it’ll probably hurt McCain to the tune of a couple percent in a few states.

Interesting. If you can dig up the source, I’d love to take a closer look at that.

This isn’t some right-wing echo-chamber forum. If you care to discredit their polls, do so with data and analysis. Saying that CNN is a laughable source doesn’t quite cut it.

I didn’t say a thing about their polls. Lots of times it’s who you poll and the questions you ask that determine the result.

No, I discredit CNN, they are obviously in the tank for Obama as anyone who watches can plainly see. And, no, I don’t have a source for that…if I did you’d discredit it anyway.

Perhaps if you feel your sources are so easily discredited, you should reconsider what you rely on for information.

So there’s nothing wrong with their poll, except the implication that it’s fraudulent and misleading. CNN is clearly biased and actively campaigning for Obama’s election, an accusation for which you will offer no evidence.

Thank you very much for your valuable input. If we need anything further, we’ll be in touch.

That was on CBS news after the debate.

Wow…you must be new to this.

Anyway, ranks CNN polls in the middle of the pack as far as poll reliability goes (with a 2.27 margin of error). 538 are not in the tank for anyone and solely seek to bring some sense to various polls.

In short CNN polls are fine. Not stellar but not awful either and certainly good enough to be worth quoting.

Ball’s in your court.

The cry of the conservative: If it’s not right-wing, it’s biased.

The folks behind 538 are pretty much in the tank for Obama, and transparently so, but that transparency is the key.

They publish their entire methodology and it is open to dispute, and I recall they have changed the model several times in response to quibbles with their method and simple proactive improvement. I don’t have the knowledge to judge their efforts, but the transparency reassures me that folks smarter than I am are free to do so.

It’s refreshingly scientific for political analysis.

Honestly, if CNN became ONN, the Obama News Network, what difference would it make? They’d still have viewers, the situation would still be the same. News can only report and manipulate. If McCain was clearly doing well, they couldn’t spin it, and any attempts would be laughed at and hurt their candidate in it’s own subtle way. If a massive majority of people thought McCain was perfect for the job, nothing CNN could do would make a difference. Even a total blackout would fail, it’s not like we’re stuck with one news channel like in the old days. Dozens of news stations on tv, national and local, gob-awful amounts of news and opinion on the internet, radio, etc.

Blaming CNN for being CNN is laughable. We all know CNN’s general position towards the parties, and that nullifies the attempts at manipulation. At the same time, they’re feeding an audience that’s willing to listen to their pandering, and you can’t fault them on their ratings. But like I said, there’s so much information out there, blaming the voters on one cable news network, be it CNN or it’s arch-nemesis FOXNEWS, is so scarily small minded it depresses me to think you’re actually going to help decide who gets to lead the country the next four years.

But don’t take it personally, you’ve got plenty of company on both sides of the aisle… :smack:

I’ve mentioned my thoughts on the debate (some, at least) in another thread, but more appropriate to this OP, my immediate thought after was how she did depended on which side of the fence you were on. If you like the homespun style she tried to put on, then she was probably for you. If you liked a more professional, conservative style of delivery, then Biden won.

What I just said doesn’t pertain to content so much as delivery. But that was one of my immediate thoughts when it was over, just to be clear.

What exactly are 538 doing that puts them “in the tank” for Obama?? Publishing an analysis of various polls, and clearly showing showing their methodology? I just don’t see the bias. Could you enlighten me as to how they are specifically biased towards Obama?

Well if I am reading that correctly, then CNN (21 of 32) is as close to Fox (24 of 32) as it is to middle of the pack and the two sources have an error difference of +0.14… So does that mean this board stops taking CNN as a credible cite like Fox? Or does Fox news become a credible cite like CNN?

From the site:

What is your political affiliation? My state has non-partisan registration, so I am not registered as anything. I vote for Democratic candidates the majority of the time (though by no means always). This year, I have been a supporter of Barack Obama. The other contributor to this website, Sean, has also been a supporter of Barack Obama” Here (scroll down a bit).


“My methodology remains essentially the same as in this Daily Kos diary.” Here (Scroll down to Pollster Rankings 2.0).

SO while not out right saying it, expressing your political leanings and having a diary on Daily Kos kinds of belies… or at least poisons the appearance of… neutrality.

No, it means Fox is reliable as a pollster. Fox and CNN both do news and both do polls at this time of year. The two functions are not that related.