The parents are coming to my place for Christmas, because I can’t get any time off around the holiday. When we first hatched this idea, they asked me to look for some restaurants that will be open Christmas Day since I’m not really set up for a sit-down dinner. I decide as a surprise that I will buy furniture and cook Christmas dinner. I’m also the only vegetarian in the family.
Mom and Dad call last week. They ask about dinner arrangements. I say I found a place. Mom asks if it’s vegetarian. I say yes. This upsets Dad so greatly that he complains loudly about how there will be nothing for him to eat and how I can find something anywhere, and he slams the phone down.
As I think about this more and more, I get more and more pissed off. So in emailing him about something unrelated, I say that as a surprise I was going to cook and go through the menu (traditional fare except for Tofurkey instead of a dead bird for the main course). I add “anyone who wishes not to go through a meal without meat may bring his own as I will not be purchasing, preparing or serving it.” For good measure I added that there would be no holding of hands and saying of grace around my table; “those who wish to give thanks may do so in the van on the way over.”
I click send and wait for the shitstorm to begin.
Today I get an email in reply from Dad. “We would be delighted to have Christmas dinner at your home. We will certainly respect your wishes regarding grace.”
My father has never reacted this calmly to this kind of defiance in his life. It’s like one of the underpinnings of my world has been uprooted. Can it possibly be that after almost 70 years he’s finally become an adult?
I did a similar thing the other night. I emailed my dad and told him why he had upset me and asked him to please not do it again. I was fully prepared for huge amounts of shit to hit the fan.
I nearly fell of my chair when I got an appology from him.
OK, I understand that he’s advanced into reasonableness, but …
What is he, on the Atkins diet? Or is he just allergic to non-meat products? :smack: :wally
Seriously-I’m an omnivore, but I can’t imagine objecting to doing without meat for an evening out of respect for someone I’m dining with. Come to think of it, I’ve done that. What could the big deal possibly be?
Getting my dad to switch from rotary to touch-tone was enough of a stretch for him. I can’t imagine him having a computer for me to even be able to send him an e-mail.
Well, it’s your house, and you can do whatever you want, and expect whatever you want. But controlling whether or not other people hold hands seems a bit much. You mean a moment of silence and holding of hands (no grace said aloud) would be too much for you?
Of course, I’ll repeat, you can expect whatever behavior you want from your guests. It’s your right.
I, for one, would be a little miffed to have a meatless Christmas dinner. Eating a veggy dinner is fine, most of the time. But Christmas is a time of traditions, and most people’s traditions include a turkey, or a roast, or a ham at Christmas.
Saying grace is the same. Many people feel it’s important to say grace before a meal, especially before a special meal like Christmas dinner.
IMO, inviting people to your house for Christmas and then forcing them to give up the things that make Christmas special to them is a bit over the top. You say you want to surprise them, but you’re surprising them with something you know they won’t like. Did you also buy them gifts that they don’t like?
I’m all for you choosing the way you want to eat, but forcing it on others is not OK in my book. Same thing with grace - I’m not religious, but if my guests prefer to say grace then I can sit politely while they do it.
I completely understand where he’s coming from. If I cooked Christmas dinner and everybody came over and just decided to have a prayer, I would be offended and upset. The way I see it, I calmly and politely close my eyes and bow my head when I eat at their homes, because that’s what you do. THeir house, their God, their food, their prayer, whatever. I don’t need to cause a problem. But in my houes and my food, I don’t have to put with it.
Of course, Otto probably has a completely different reason for saying what he said. I’m just adding my two cents…
I respectfully disagree. When I’m in someone else’s home I don’t smoke, drink, eat peanuts, use the cute soap in the bathroom - whatever. It’s his or her home. But I see no problem in expecting others - even family members - to abide by my house rules. If “George” misses the little things that make Christmas special then perhaps George should have the party.
And on this point:
I’m reminded of a Miss Manners column from a while back, in which a correspondent complained she could no longer hold dinner parties because “John” and “Mary” were on the Atkins diet, “Steve” and “Harriet” were on a gluten-free diet, “David” and “Stuart” were vegetarians, and “Bill” and “Beverly” were watching their cholesterol. Miss Manners replied along the lines of, “Well, isn’t the point of a dinner party to get together? While the food should be good, isn’t it secondary to the idea of friends spending an evening enjoying each others company?”
I think the OP said that if the guests wanted to eat meat, “anyone who wishes not to go through a meal without meat may bring his own as I will not be purchasing, preparing or serving it”. See, he’s not forbidding them from eating the meat, he just won’t participate in it in any way whatsoever. There’s a big difference between that and forbidding them to eat the stuff at his house completely, unless I am misunderstanding.
The grace thing could be along the same line, but he doesn’t even want to allow them to do it. Is is assumed that he won’t be saying grace, of course. We haven’t heard whether or not he’d allow them to hold hands and say a silent prayer or not, but my guess is not. In which case, well, once again, totally his house, totally his rules, and he has the right to request that, I know. But I don’t know if I’d go appreciate such a restriction if I were a guest. I don’t think I’d appreciate having my own silent gestures and thoughts controlled and inhibited by my host, when they are not being intrusive on others around me. (Unless you consider silence, bowing of heads and holding hands “intrusive”, which I do not, personally. Hell, everyone else can dig in and start chewing while the rest silently say grace to themselves.)
Well, my father would. He and his wife are walking feasts. They have been known to come to children’s birthday parties with platters of oxtails. I’m not kidding.
No one is being forced to do anything. If they like tradition all that much, how about the tradition that the host controls whether or not grace is said aloud? I don’t get the picture that she would police their inner thoughts. Besides, she reminded them that they could say grace on the way over. When it comes to prayer, I don’t think that “tradition” is all that relevant. God will pick up on their gratitude on her own.
They will probably be surprised at how good vegetarian meals can be. I’m glad her dad wised up.
I just emailed my dad and thanked him for a good Thanksgiving time at their house, and noted that the best part was his being so sweet to my mom. I hope he got the point, because the last time I was there I was nearly inspired to give him a veeeeery pointed speech about his duties as a husband.
(Yes, I know that it’s his marriage, but I got this vision of my mom having to put up with this for another 20 years.)
Why don’t you want hand-holding, Otto? It doesn’t have to have religious significance. When Mr. Rilch and I have more than two people for dinner, we hold hands and…well, basically make something up, since we don’t know any traditional graces. It’s just our way of saying we’re glad to be here, all together and about to have good food, wine, and conversation.
[tangent]Friend Across Town’s wife is LDS. When they were planning a trip back to her hometown to announce their engagement, he offhandedly said, “Now I know I’m gonna have to say grace…”
“We sing grace,” she informed him.
“I can’t sing.”
“You don’t have to sing. Just sit quietly while we’re singing.”[/tangent]
Wow. You invite people over for ahem Christmas dinner, but they’re not allowed to say grace?
I’m not religious, but I wouldn’t attend. What intolerance! I mean, if there were some OTHER deity you thought you’d be offending by listening to grace, that would be one thing. (And I still wouldn’t attend.) What is your trip?
Regarding the vegetarian meal: I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect that people coming into a vegetarian home not expect to receive a plate full of animal flesh. I’m preparing Tofurkey, stuffing, mashed potatos, a vegetable, fruit salad, cranberry sauce, rolls and pumpkin pie. If they can’t find enough there to eat until they bust then oh well. When I go to their home I don’t expect them to go to extra trouble to meet my dietary issues. Keep in mind also that at the time of the phone call they thought they were going to a vegetarian restaurant. My dad’s reaction was “you can find something to eat anyplace you go,” the implication being that he would be unable to find something without meat that he could tolerate.
Regarding grace: The reason I said that was because the last couple of times I’ve been home I’ve been made to feel very uncomfortable because I was coerced into participating in this ritual. Since I prepare my own entree when I’m there for Christmas, I try to time it so that I’m finishing it up as they’re saying grace, but my dad refuses to start the meal unless I’m at the table, holding hands, head bowed and eyes closed. It’s led to some rather ugly scenes (there’s more behind it than just the grace issue but that tends to be a catalyst) so I figured I would try to head off the tension before it began by making my expectations clear well ahead of time. I’d rather if he were going to get a mad on about praying that he do so on a day other than the one day the whole family will be together. I wouldn’t mind the idea at all of holding hands and saying nice things about each other or what have you, in fact I kind of like the idea and might suggest it. But an actual religious ritual goes beyond what I’m willing to accept. I certainly wouldn’t tell them they couldn’t pray silently or out loud in the motel room beforehand or wherever, just not in my home where based on past examples trouble will brew. Things will be stressful enough for me preparing seven or eight dishes from scratch!
If I’d received such an e-mail, I’d refuse to come. Yes, it’s your right to serve whatever you chose. Yes, it’s your house. But to me, the excerpts from your e sounded snotty, argumentative and high-handed. You could’ve been more gracious about the meat and I think you could allow those that wish to, to say grace beofre meals.
