I was at a friend’s house yesterday for their son’s first birthday party. During dinner I was sitting with a couple of good friends of mine, the grandparents of the birthday boy, and the aunt and uncle of the birthday boy. This was a lily-white crowd, which normally I would not mention, but it is relevant to this story. Also, the industry I work in (softare engineering) in tends to be very ethnically diverse; I work with people from China, India, Pakistan, and lots of other places.
That morning, about two blocks from my condo, I saw that the police had blocked off a large area encompassing about 4 or 6 low-rise condo building with “Police Line - Do Not Cross” barriers, and I was sharing this story with people. I figured something nasty had happened (turns out someone had been shot and killed, but I didn’t know that then). The grandmother says “Don’t a lot of Mexicans live there?” I look at her, somewhat dumbfounded, and say rather loudly “So?” (quite obviously meaning “So what does that have to do with anything?” Then the uncle says “A lot of Indians live there.” I look across the table at my friend, who is also a software engineer, and say very sarcastically “Yes, those Indian bastards. All those Indian engineers I work with are nothing but troublemakers.”
What the fuck does the ethnic mix of the neighborhood have to do with anything? :mad:
I am not going to sit by politely anymore when people make comments like this. I’m sick of listening to shit like this and letting it slide; I didn’t do it yesterday, and it felt good.
“What the fuck does the ethnic mix of the neighborhood have to do with anything?”
Absolutely nothing. Nor should it. It just pisses me off when some “good-two-shoes-holier-than-thou” jerk thinks that they are better than somebody else. I am white, but I guarantee that I am absolutely no better than anybody else. What I would really like to know is where it is written that white people are better than blacks or where blacks are better than mexicans or mexicans are better than indians etc etc. Nobody is better that anybody else. Period.
The unfortunate thing about the story you relayed is that the child can hear what was said and since bigotry/hatred/racism is something that is learned, he will, in turn also learn it, unless he is taught otherwise.
Luckily the parents are not racists - I have never heard any type of comment like that from them, nor any inkling that they hold these kinds of views (and I’ve known them both for 13 years). So there is hope for the kids.
So I’m in theatre class, and this girl Ekta is directing another boy. She tells him to get up and perch on a chair. She says, "Now this probably feels really gay - " I interrupt and say, “Oh, maybe I should do it then!”
So is asking about a neighboorhoods ethinic origins considered racist?
Also, this woman was a grandmother! Hell, my 80 year old grandmother is racist also, but I don’t go around argueing with her about it. (and neither does my brown skinned wife)
Have a little resepct for your elders. They will be dead in a few years and then they wont bother your PC self anymore.
I’m with labdude on this. The Grandparents grew up in a generation that thought that way. As long as the parents aren’t professing racism let the sleeping dog lie. You damn sure aren’t going to change the Grandparents viewpoint at this stage.
Hell, my Mom talks that way at times and if you were at my table I would have smacked you for smarting off to my Mom whether she was wrong to say it or not.
Usually I don’t post in the pit, but Sledman and labdude I am absolutely against your train of thought!!! Just because someone is “old” that does not give them the right to be racist!!! As a person gets older they should learn from their mistakes. People can change their point of view, regardless of their age. Being old is NO excuse for being racist. Where do you think kids learn racism from? Their parents and grandparents! Do you want a little kid to turn out racist and say to you: Well grandma didn’t like (put some race here) so I’m not going to like them. Does this make sense to you?!
My grandmother and I used to fight about race a lot. You know what? She finally realized that I was right! She is 79 years old! She does not automatically assume that someone is good or bad based on their race. porcupine I applaud you for standing up to people and letting them know that racism is wrong and that you don’t appreciate it!
I better stop, I am so pissed right now that people still have such barbaric view points that I am not able to concentrate on work.
Let see, when I told my mother this story, she said “Good for you. Next time somebody says something like that around me I’m going to do the same thing next time - just say ‘So?’” My mother is 77, significantly older than the grandmother of the birthday boy. So saying that it a generational thing is bullshit.
I’m not gonna defend their views, but they gotta right to them. Getting in someones face with righteous indignation and demanding that they change may not acheive the desired result.
You must not ever get much done then. People have been stupid since the dawn of time, try to correct them when you can, but don’t lose any sleep over it.
I think in this context, it was a thinly-veiled display of racism.
I got nailed by this, however, when I moved to MI from VA. I was touring an apartment complex, and was very curious to know if I would be living among other grad students, professionals, retirees, families, etc. I wasn’t sure what I was looking for, but I wanted to know. When I asked the manager what sort of people lived there, I got a very frosty, hostile retort, and no information.
My mom and I were befuddled and it wasn’t until about four hours later that Mom and I figured out she must have thought I meant if any blacks lived there! Argh! No wonder she was so frosty, but on the other hand, fuck HER for assuming that. I suspect this assumption was helped along because I told her I was moving from a Southern state. What a goddamn idiot, like all Southerners are aghast at living near African-Americans… or that the South has a monopoly on racism.
Actually, biggirl &bluemonchichi, it does. People have been as stupid as they want since the dawn of time, and the First Amendment gives them the right to express that stupidity.
I conceed that a person has a right to be racist. Being old does not give them this right, however.
And Spoof was implying that since they are old, they should not be called out on their stupid ideas. I’m sorry, but just as any American has a right to spout stupidly racists crap, I have a right to tell them that it is stupid racist crap.
The OP’s response was not disrespectful. It was pointed and made her feelings known, but was not disrespectful.
Just because you don’t feel a person’s opinion is correct, biggirl and bluemonchichi, does NOT mean they do not have the right to it.
What this elderly racist woman DOESN’T have the right to do is stand uncorrected simply because of her age.
If she wants to be a god damn moron, she can. And you can tell her exactly what you think of her. But her opinions are impossible to censor.
This is a really good topic for the holday season,when the old adage “you can’t pick your family” often gets driven home.
I don’t think you can have any hard and fast rules about these situations. Some times it is right to speak up, sometimes it isn’t.
Case-in-point: Last Xmas we went to the mother-in-law’s. MIL had a friend over, and friend’s over bearing red neck husband. MIL was happy about the whole situation because over bearing red neck husbund rarely let his wife leave the house except to go to work-this was something of a victory. Over the course of the evening, over bearing red neck husband spouted about every disagreeable opinion you can think of–here was a man who worked at a chicken factory belittling our English degrees! I honestly dont remember if he said anything overtly racist–I was doing my best to tune him out. However, no matter what he said, I wasnt going to argue with him. Certainly, I had no chance of changing his mind, and the only effect my standing up for what is right would have had is a) making myself feel better and b) I would have made this asshole feel antagonistic towards one of the few friends he allowed his wife to have. (read: no more going over to MIL’s house).
As a more general principle, I refuse to get in a fight about things like racism with anyone who is obviously looking to pick a fight with me. The loudest racists often seem to be motivated by a desire to get someone to nay say them so that they can bring out a list of “facts” they got off of talk radio, or from some guy in the bar that listened to talk radio, or worse, the Personal Anecdote. Argueing with these people is just giving them a chance to air their bull shit. On the other hand, apearing to agree with thiem is clearly unacceptable, so I have found the best solution is to leave–walk out of the room, go play with the little cousins, go help with the dishes, whatever. If this is not possible, change the subject everytime a racist comment is directed to you. Loud, persistiant racist types tend to be looking for an audience, so dening them one is the only thing I can think to do that actually bothers them. Furthermore, if most of the people at the gathering refuse to participate in thier racism, they soon look like serious asses. And while logic may never change thier minds, social pressure can.