(Old) Today in History - a pivotal moment in the MMP

[nelliebly]

Dang! I miss two days and am 79 posts behind! Yikes!

I made the decision to stay in the general area when I move, but then my sister-in-law invited me to live with them. (They have a big, luxurious home in the Chicago suburbs.) Of course, I’m not going to take her up on that. I doubt she’s even asked my brother, though he wouldn’t mind. The thing is, though, she was so happy with the idea. and was almost pleading, so it made me waver. And I hate to be morbid, but she’s not in the best of health. As difficult as she can be, I do love her and worry about her. I think I should stay put for a number of reasons, though, so I’m still planning on that. (I mean stay put in the area, not the apartment.) I’ll be going to there place at some point for my brother’s knee surgery and can discuss it then.

In another moment from my I Love Lucy life, I used fusible mending tape to hem some pants. (I don’t have a machine and would probably end up sewing my thumb to my palm if I did.) It worked great…on the wrong side of the pants. So now I have to get it off.

Every time you bring up your EX, I am reminded how happy I am that you not only survived him, you are now happy and thriving.
[/quote]

Me, too, sister! He complained bitterly about the mismatched shoes. Apparently they were a sign of my general ineptitude. I’m so much happier now.

@JaneDoe42

I was CDO before I started making cheese

Argh! I feel like an idiot, but what does CDO stand for? Conscientious Dating Objector? Cannabis Doobie Officer? Corporate Duck Organizer? I should know this…

@purplehorseshoe

OH and bringing Nutella so I can make some of my co-workers go this should be fun.

How did the Nutella pizza turn out?

@scareyfaerie

She doesn’t use a gavel, perhaps that’s where she’s going wrong. I

When my dad was a judge, all three of my older siblings got to go to court and see him in action. (A neighbor took them. Mom said OK against her better judgment.) I was bummed, but Mom told me it would be dull. Then the big kids came home, shouting, “It was so cool! Dad banged the gavel and said ‘Order in the court!’ and everything!” What?! And I MISSED it? I was outraged. Years later, one of my students gave me a little gavel of my own, which made up for it, sort of.

@scareyfaerie

finally had their extra-vintage truckles back in stock

TIL what a truckle is. I love that word!

@FairyChatMom

this has potential, tho I lack hair curlers. Must think on it…

Wear one of those knitted beanies. I love the whole idea. That swampy is a genius.

Oh, frick, too many to go, and I have to leave soon to pick up some items at the store.

[Paintcharge]

Imma make biscuits for dinner. I may or may not make some gravy to go with. Perhaps just blueberry jam and/or honey.

@nelliebly

I feel like an idiot, but what does CDO stand for?

I believe that is OCD organized into correct alphabetical order.

[FairyChatMom]

My SS was deposited today also - both mine and FCD’s have shown up that early the last 2 or 3 times.

Yay, money! (Money that is destined for VISA…)

And we’re back home. Exhausted from all that fresh air and walking but the kids had fun and got some candy. We started out with a nice family lunch before SIL had to go to work. MIL is totally wiped out. I’m starving. I just had a piece of toast, but I need something with protein, I think. Or maybe some yogurt. Dunno.

Some pics in FB, but I’m a lousy photographer. I may steal some of Daughter’s pics. Later.

[FairyChatMom]

OK, this is totally weird and out of nowhere, and, no I don’t need answer fast. But maybe someone here might have some experience:

There’s a line of thought that when someone calls another and threatens suicide, it’s not a real threat - just a ploy for attention. So, what would happen if one would respond to such a threat with: “OK. Bye.” Might it drive the threatener to actually follow thru?

Sorry - my brain goes strange places when I don’t have real things to think about.

[Yelnick_McWawa]

@scareyfaerie

Today (October 14th) is the anniversary of the Battle of Hastings in 1066, beginning the Norman Conquest of England. It’s also the anniversary of the publication of Conan Doyle’s “Adventures of Sherlock Holmes” in 1892.

Here in the USA, we used to celebrate Columbus day on October 12th (Gregorian calendar), even though he landed in the new world on October 3rd (Julian calendar). Perhaps we should celebrate Hastings on the 20th (Gregorian) as well.

I have a neighbor named Hastings. He managed to get his phone number to be xxx-xxx-1066.

[BippityBoppityBoo]

@FairyChatMom

maybe someone here might have some experience:

There’s a line of thought that when someone calls another and threatens suicide, it’s not a real threat - just a ploy for attention. So, what would happen if one would respond to such a threat with: “OK. Bye.” Might it drive the threatener to actually follow thru?

As someone with several kinds of experience as a family member, a licensed medical professional and a mental health disability rights advocate I can offer this: the best answer a friend or family member can give is “I’m sorry you are in such pain. I will call the police so that medical professionals will be dispatched to you as quickly as possible. While you are waiting for them please #988 and talk to someone who is trained to offer support and listen in ways I can’t”. Then do just that, hang up and call the police who are trained to do well-being checks and get that person to medical professionals who can sort out how serious the risk is. If it is “just a cry for attention” they know what to do with that too. If you drop everything and rush to the rescue and it is just attention getting, then you have just thoroughly reinforced it happening again and probably soon, disrupting everyone’s life to no good. Let the psychiatric professionals figure out the risk and seriousness and then they can set out the appropriate consequences, whether it is psych hospitalization, ER attention to reverse overdoses or arranging follow-up therapy and care or getting a social worker involved to find better ways to get needed attention. [hint: said attention is best not from family or friends who have been guilted into giving it-that inevitably screws up the relationship on both sides and never solves anything].

To repeat: “I’m sorry you are hurting this much. I will call the police and send the best help to you. While you are waiting for them, please call #988, who will help you stay safe until the professionals get there”. Then hang up (don’t engage or argue with them) and do that. Call the police and get a well-being check. Then pat yourself on the back because you have just done the most loving and caring thing for both of you. If you’re feeling shaken about it after you have called the police, YOU call #988-they’ll be happy to talk to you as you process things and they’ll certainly assure you that you did the right thing. 988 is there for you too.

My gut feeling after doing this since 1975? No, you hanging up is not likely to ‘drive them to do it’. Those who seriously want to die don’t threaten it or talk about it because they don’t want to be stopped-they just keep quiet and do it. Tell them to call or text 988 then you hang up and call the police.

[susan]

@FairyChatMom

There’s a line of thought that when someone calls another and threatens suicide, it’s not a real threat - just a ploy for attention. So, what would happen if one would respond to such a threat with: “OK. Bye.” Might it drive the threatener to actually follow thru?

Speaking as a former psychologist, it might be a real threat. I wouldn’t assume it’s not. Or ambivalence. Or despair in the moment. Or asking for help. Or manipulation. Saying something negative adds another variable and may polarize the person to act when they wouldn’t otherwise. If someone keeps threatening, you might respond differently from a one-time threat, but tempting though it is, saying “OK. Bye” is provocative.

As to MIL saying FCD could help her die, that could mean a number of things, but my sense is that he’s probably not able to have that discussion with her. Some people choose to stop eating, for example, but with dementia, they might be frustrated that they keep forgetting this intention. Some have a general wish to stop suffering, being a burden, having trouble understanding what’s going on… Some who believe in an afterlife may feel ready for the end of this existence. I don’t know how Maryland treats that kind of statement, so unless you know, I’d be cautious about discussing it with hospice.

ETA: my position is that I support person’s right to make their own end of life decision in the case of terminal or certain intractable medical conditions, and I practiced in a state that supported death with dignity under some medical circumstances. State law varies a lot, and it’s best to involve people who are trained to make professional assessments. That said, I strongly believe that the state should not abrogate a medically compromised person’s freedom or self-determination in a blanket or knee-jerk way. Staying alive as long as possible is a value, not a universal truth.

[nelliebly]

Boo, I think FCM was asking what would happen IF someone were to say, “OK, bye,” to someone who’s threatened suicide as a bid for attention.

From my training in suicide prevention, I’ll say that because someone has threatened suicide before for attention (or to sort of blackmail an SO into not breaking up) is still at risk. They may really mean it this time. There’s no rule that if someone seeks attention once, they won’t be honestly suicidal the next time. Seeking attention by threatening suicide is the sign or a possibly disturbed individual. It could be that they’d just get mad and hang up, or it could be that they’d go through with it.

Wouldn’t it be awful if someone said that, even lightly, and then the other person followed through? Yikes. The guilt!

I have to go to Tacoma on Monday. My laptop, which is only three years old, is on the fritz. It won’t charge. That is, the only way I can get it to charge is to take it off Optimized Battery Charging, then unplug and replug in the charging cable. And that’s getting harder to do. It says the battery health is normal. I have a feeling I’m going to have to buy a new one, and they’re not cheap. (I don’t like Dells and the like. I had a Chromebook and hated it.) Well, hopefully I’ll be able to rebuild the moving fund before March 1.

VanGo, thanks for the clarification!

[BippityBoppityBoo]

To be clear I never advised saying “ok, bye”. I always start with empathy-“I’m sorry you are in so much pain, or I’m sorry you are hurting so much, I’m believing you so I’m going to do what I can quickly get you help for that pain. Please call 988 to be safe while I make that call”.

You both are putting cold, heartlessness in what I said. I express empathy and concern first, always. I tell them how to reach another trained, caring human being while I call to get them professional, trained, licensed assessment and help.

I don’t deserve this. I’m sorry I responded at all.

[JaneDoe42]

@FairyChatMom

There’s a line of thought that when someone calls another and threatens suicide, it’s not a real threat - just a ploy for attention.

If you are talking about BIL, he’s already eaten a handful of pills in recent history. I would assume that he was just attention seeking but might take too many by mistake next time. I think Boo probably had the best way to respond and I will try to remember that if it is ever an issue in my life.

@purplehorseshoe

@JaneDoe42

google “stop babies crying by throwing cheese on their face”

I laughed my ass off at some of those clips.

The WTF moment can be pretty hysterical, can’t it?

To those who were worried, no babies were harmed. Cheese was gently tossed, children were shocked silent and some of them responded by eating the cheese.

As to the cream cheese, it was raw garlic. I was following a recipe and thought “there is never enough garlic for us, so doubled it”.

Roasted garlic in paper jacket? Are you talking the paper feeling wrapper on garlic or is that a store bought thing?

Back when I was growing elephant garlic, I’d roast a couple in the oven - paper jacket off - and we would spread it in toasted french bread like it was butter. It was so very good.

@purplehorseshoe

What’s the hours-long holdup?

Textures and fibers. Do I want to do this patch with silk or should it have some glittery ribbon instead? And then there are dye lots. Does this black wool match that black DMC? Do I want number 10 pearl cotton or do I want 8? How does the 8 look next to the silk or does the 20 look better?

@purplehorseshoe

Press them under a heavy book for awhile first. Then just mail a nice folded greeting card & slip as many as you want inside it.

Oh geeze, I remember doing that with Grandma. It left my mind years ago. This is the way!

The only reason I was concerned about the mail is because one of my sisters who lived in CA tried to send some store bought and still in the package California Poppy seeds to ID dwelling mother and the package was intercepted. As I recall, sister also got a really nasty letter from the Post Office over it.

Your pie looked really good, I hope everyone enjoyed it!

@scareyfaerie

It was yummy, but sadly didn’t last very long.

Which is why I can’t manage to age cheese longer than a couple of years. Chances of me getting better about it are not great.

@scareyfaerie

Yesterday afternoon she was in and out of our office at least 6 times

And the main problem with that is that she was stopping you from actually being able to try to deal with it because you were spending so much time dealing with her.

What do you put in your chicken curry. Mine isn’t great and I’ve been thinking about going to Charleston for some.

@BippityBoppityBoo

Done right the wax paper/pretty leaves can be hung in a window like a stained glass sun catcher.

Thank you so much for that link. Grandma and I did the wax paper covered pressed flowers and then I turned into a teenager and put all of that stuff behind me. I’m so happy I have smarter folks to remember for me.

I just happen to have heavy books as well as wax paper. Hurray for the new project!

[FairyChatMom]

@susan

As to MIL saying FCD could help her die, that could mean a number of things,

Yesterday when Preacher Wife came to visit, MIL was talking about how much she missed FIL - it’s been nearly 2 years since he died. She has said she can’t wait to be reunited with him, but she’s also a very devout Christian, and she and PW also quoted some verse about things being in their own time, or some such. (I’m definitely not a Biblical scholar.)

I think MIL is torn between missing her husband of nearly 74 years and her belief that she will be with him when it’s “her time.” But she’s also eating less and sleeping more, which the Hospice nurse says is typical end-of-life behavior. She’s tired, and not just sleepy-tired. I really think she’s ready for it to be over and she’s waiting for “her time.”

@nelliebly

Boo, I think FCM was asking what would happen IF someone were to say, “OK, bye,” to someone who’s threatened suicide as a bid for attention.

That’s it exactly. It’s easy when it’s a kid pitching a fit for attention. But the mind of an adult who makes such a threat isn’t as simple to understand. Would someone suggest killing themselves if they hadn’t thought about it? Or is it a spur-of-the-moment bid for… something? Acceptance? Attention? A hug? I don’t know. I don’t suppose there’s any easy answer.

I do know someone who, when feeling suicidal, immediately sought help. I suspect the feelings were brought on by his meds rather than depression, but I’m only tangentially familiar, so I could be totally wrong.

I know someone else (this was decades ago) who actually had a gun in hand after his wife left him, declaring she’d never loved him anyway. I suspect it was just the realization of what it would do to his parents and siblings that made him put the gun away. And he eventually got on anti-depressants and so far is pretty much living happily ever after (as much as that’s possible in the real world.)

Like I said, my mind wanders down some weird back alleys sometimes. I do spare you some of the weirdest trips

@BippityBoppityBoo

YOU call #988-they’ll be happy to talk to you as you process things and they’ll certainly assure you that you did the right thing. 988 is there for you too.

I didn’t know this, and it never would have occurred to me. Then again, the Hospice folks tell us they have services for the families of patients to help deal with everything, so I guess it makes sense a hotline would have the same. Thanks!

OK, MIL is in bed - she’s mostly been asleep since coming home and we kinda fibbed and told her it’s bedtime, tho she’d be aghast to learn it’s not even 8!! Today wore her out. Me, too. So back to my crocheting.

[susan]

Boo, I read your post the way you intended it, and I read the responses as reading you that way, too.

[FairyChatMom]

@BippityBoppityBoo

To be clear I never advised saying “ok, bye”.

I certainly didn’t get that impression from your response. But, like I mentioned to nellie, I was looking for a window into the mind of the person who made the threat and if, essentially, ignoring it as you would a toddler throwing a tantrum would stop them cold or push them over the edge. I suppose it could go either way, depending on the person.

@JaneDoe42

If you are talking about BIL, he’s already eaten a handful of pills in recent history.

BIL has made various threats since he was a teen, and quite a few in the last couple of years. My opinions on his mental state and upbringing are from the outside looking in. Goodness knows how I’d had dealt with a child like him. It’s easy to have all the answers for someone else - ask any childless person giving advice to parents!

Anyway, I guess I asked a question that really has no answer since it would vary with each person and situation. I shouldn’t ask such things. I’m sorry… < deep sad sigh >

Like I said - crochet.

[Sticks_and_Scones]

@Trieste

Second and last attempt:

Well, good try anyways…

By the way, you need a Mumper nickname! I’m not sure what, though. Maybe Triangle?

Hey, to Boo I didn’t read anything other than compassion in your answer. Speaking as a formerly suicidal person, I don’t think it would have mattered what you had said to me. If I was gonna do it, I was gonna do it. Honestly, though, I’m not the type to mention if I’m feeling that way anyways. I unfortunately have a ‘self-harm thought generator’ that always runs in my head and it’s fucking annoying. I’ve thought of a million ways to get hurt. If I were the sort to give any indication, I’d be happy to receive any of your responses and received them with the love and care that they were given.

[JaneDoe42]

Sorry for the double post, the lights flickered so I hit reply just in case we lost everything again. We didn’t.

@Misnomer

I’m the opposite. I always look for as much yellow as possible; a hint of green is fine.

I wish I liked the texture of bananas. They are so healthy and portable. I like the flavor but I have to force myself to swallow a real banana.

@Chefguy

I suspect we will have a new cat overlord before the end of the year.

The shelter that saved Jolene from the streets has a foster for life program. If old folks foster old cats, the shelter pays the end of life vet bills for the cat or takes the cat back if the old folks are not able to care for it anymore.

@Sticks_and_Scones

Now I’m sitting contemplating if it is, in fact, naptime.

WWAnnieD?

@Chefguy

Making some oatmeal/walnut/dried fruit cookies as I write this.

Oh yum! Do you have a good fruit cake recipe? I LIKE fruit cake but was used to MIL sending it to us every year and never learned how to make it. I’ve looked at recipes online and haven’t found any that had booze poured over them like Grandma used to make.

@susan

Hey, youse.

Beautiful serene pics, thanks for the moment

@nelliebly

It worked great…on the wrong side of the pants. So now I have to get it off.

At least you didn’t spend an hour hand sewing curtains the wrong way.

Get the hand towel you like least and put it on the tape. Iron hand towel until the tape starts clinging to it instead of the pants.

Mismatched shoes are something to laugh about, not something to bitch over. Again, I’m so happy you were strong enough to get away from him.

Doggio isn’t the only one who alphabetizes his spices!

@BippityBoppityBoo

I don’t deserve this. I’m sorry I responded at all.

I love you. I understood perfectly what you were saying. I don’t think that anyone was thinking that you were cold and heartless. It read to me like they were agreeing with you and adding their reasons why.

[dogbutler]

So between working late, and somebody having a psychotic episode at naptime, I didn’t get much rest. But I’m having a Vieux Carré, and watching hockey

@Trieste

I got bacon and eggs?

[Charlie Brown]I got a rock.[/Charlie Brown]
But I like the coffee bean and chilie ones, too.

@susan

I was on a trip for a coupla weeks

Looks very Zen.

@nelliebly

but what does CDO stand for?

@Paintcharge

I believe that is OCD organized into correct alphabetical order.

This.

[susan]

@dogbutler

Looks very Zen.

Zen it sometimes was, and sometimes a lotta people and a lotta cutesy cartoon characters.

[nelliebly]

Boo, dear, I would never, ever be anything less than respectful toward you and I’m horrified at the idea that I made you sound cold and heartless. Your suggestions for what to say were superb and spot on, as your recommendations always are. I’ve read my response over again, and while I can’t see where I made you sound cold and heartless, what matters is that you think I did. I’m truly grieved about this.

What I thought at the time was that you might have interpreted FCM’s request as asking for what she should say to someone threatening suicide, while I thought she was asking what would happen IF someone were to say “OK, bye” at such a time. I didn’t venture into what would be a better response because you had covered that so thoroughly and expertly and much better than I could have.

I’m appalled that I unintentionally upset such a cherished friend. I hope you’ll accept my apologies.

[missred]

@susan

I was on a trip for a coupla weeks

Welcome back! It looks like you had a lovely trip.

@JaneDoe42

@purplehorseshoe

Press them under a heavy book for awhile first. Then just mail a nice folded greeting card & slip as many as you want inside it.

Oh geeze, I remember doing that with Grandma. It left my mind years ago. This is the way!

I inherited my great grandmother’s bible, given to her as a wedding gift in 1905, after my own mother passed. In it, I found a number of pressed 4 leaf clovers and a few flowers. I enclosed several in acid free clear envelopes to include in a scrapbook layout.

Prescription picked up, along with some vitamin D and magnesium supplements and a bottle of lotion. Ribs were also picked up, complete with turnip greens, mac & cheese and cornbread and et. I took Nelson along with me, so, even though Kinfolks doesn’t have a drive thru, the woman at the counter lives in my complex and sent a couple of bites of 'cue out for him when she saw him in the car parked in front of the window.

[The_Stainless_Steel_Rat]

@Misnomer

I tend to buy six at a time and will eat two a day – which is why I’m always needing to buy more

Sounds a bit like my pattern; I pick up 6 bananas on Friday for Sat-Sun-Mon and then 8 apples on Monday for Tuesday-Friday.

BBBoo, that sounds like sensible advice and while I doubt I’ll need it in the future, it is good to know. And I don’t think anyone was contradicting you there, just some additional comments regarding FCM’s original question.

@JaneDoe42

It read to me like they were agreeing with you and adding their reasons why.

That was my interpretation too.

lily, is that Japan? beautiful pics from wherever it is.

FCM, glad the outing went without too much drama and some fun for the kiddos.

Taters, I also try to get green bananas since they usually sit for a day or so before I start eating them, so too ripe and they get dark spots. The ones I have now are just right.

Coppertone, glad your urine is perfect. Hope the weather stays nice.

BBBoo, high school football in most states is a big deal, Texas takes it to 11. And I’m afraid Nebraska got “Hoosiered” real good. Meanwhile Ali-bama lost for the second time this season, so cries for Coach Saban to return to coaching them will be heard across the land.

Oopsie, hope the furniture assembly went well…last time I tried it was an item from Wal-Mart and…it did not go well.

nellie, nice to know that you are wanted and valued, but it’s your life to plan for, so if staying put is what you want to do… And laughed at you missing your Dad’s courtroom activities…did you ever get to go?

As for me, refereed the game I had volunteered for and then refereed one of my games as no ref was available, so was busy from 9am to 1:30pm. We lost the second game 6-5 in the last minutes (first game I coached/reffed was a 5-5 tie), so I went to the gym to pedal away some of the pain. Have had my Fettuccine for dinner and am now contemplating a long list of You Tube videos to occupy the balance of the night.

Take care all and I’ll catch up on Sunday.