It’s true, I’m an idiot, at least when it comes to girls and the dating thereof. So I was hoping to bounce some questions off some of you more experienced, less idiotic dopers and hopefully get some advice.
I’m sort of new to this whole ‘online dating’ thing, and I really have no idea how to play this out. So I emailed a girl about a month ago, and we’ve written back and forth now about 7 or 8 times, with increasingly long messages. But now what do I do?
I guess I’m being plagued by the same lack of confidence that manifests itself in real life situations. I’m guessing the frequent correspondence and the increasing length of messages is a good thing, right? But I’m concerned that she hasn’t really, at least overtly, expressed a desire to meet in person. Is that normal? On the other hand, I would think she wouldn’t email me back if she weren’t interested at all; am I right? Or could she just be emailing me back to keep herself busy?
Also, how long do people typically wait to ask someone else out on these sites? Girls, how long do you usually want to wait before being asked out?
And if I were to go about asking her out, what a good way of phrasing that? I mean, I don’t want to just pull a copy and paste job, but I just need something to get me going. I suppose I don’t want to come across as too assertive/wimpy. Any tips?
IME, it’s best to meet as soon as possible after establishing contact. If you email, IM, and/or talk on the phone for a time, it’s quite possible to become emotionally involved and build something up in your mind. Then when you meet and there’s absolutely no physical chemistry, it’s a big letdown.
I understand that if you’re new at online dating you may want to take things a bit slower than I do, but what could it hurt to go ahead and ask her out? She may be playing it old school and waiting for you to make the first move. Regardless of whether you meet soon or not, maybe establish contact with a couple of other women if you haven’t done so already, so that you’re not pinning all of your hopes on this one person.
As for how to ask her out- find a local event that you find interesting and think that she would, too, like a small live music show or art show, and invite her to a specific event at a specific date and time. At least a week in advance.
A good point, no doubt. I’ve tried it, but so few people actually respond that it’s tough to justify the amount of time it takes. I guess by the time I send out any messages, I’ve pretty much lost all interest, aside from anyone who does respond, which is how I’ve gotten myself into the current situation.
But perhaps I should be actively seeking out more people. It’s just tough to keep coming up with witty things to say, especially since you know most of them won’t respond.
You need to get this to telephonic contact more or less now. It is: 2-3 emails, 2-3 phone calls, then a FtF. FtF is for Coffee or maybe drinks and bar snacks.
See, this is where I get stuck. How do I transition from email to a phone call meeting in person? Preferably without coming across as as desperate, needy, or creepy
I can tell you that I’m not so much into the phone calls, personally. I just find talking on the phone to be so intimate an activity before I’ve actually met them face-to-face. Maybe I’m weird like that and others don’t mind it. But I would rather meet first then talk on the phone.
I feel more comfortable about it if I’m going to do it, if the guy has given me his phone number and asked me to call him, and if it’s already clear that we have much in common and there will be things to talk about. I don’t find an email saying “Hey, why don’t you give me a call tonight after 8- my number is ___” to be desperate, needy, or creepy.
This is good to know; hopefully others feel the same way you do, as I hate talking on the phone (ironic as it is, given my last job as a CSR). I would much rather meet face to face first, but I’m still stuck on how to get going on that front (as you can tell, I have no experience in that area
Have you tried instant messaging? Suggest it to her, and if you don’t already have a service and she does, ask her what she uses and download it. Yahoo is a good one and easy to set up and use. It’s not a good medium if you’re a slow typer or reader, but you could at least use it to officially ask her out in realtime if you have a problem doing it in email or on the phone.
Some dating sites even have instant messaging built in.
There’s no rules about when you’re supposed to start calling or meeting - it’s whatever makes both of you comfortable. The key is not to be pushy - a guy who insisted on meeting me or calling after 2 emails would come off as desperate and scary. However, if you guys have been emailing for a month I’d say that’s a good amount of time. Just ask the girl if she’d like to call or set up a meeting - whatever she prefers. Leave the ball in her court. There’s no harm in asking!
I did the online dating thing for a while, and here was my technique:
Email one: “Hi, here’s a little bit about me. Here’s a comment on something in your profile. Hope to hear back from you!”
Email reply one: “Thanks for the email! Here’s a reply to the comment you made about my profile. Here’s a comment about something in your profile.”
Email two: “Here’s a reply to whatever you commented about in my profile. So are you busy this weekend or what? Want to grab dinner?”
Like the others have said, too much contact before the initial meeting is a bad thing, as far as I’m concerned. I think I had 1 girl kind of hesitate because I sort of “jumped the gun” and skipped the phone calls nonsense (I hate the phone anyway), but the others seemed relieved that we didn’t have to do that dance or wait for me to decide if I was interested or not. After reading her profile and getting an email or 2 from her… what’s stopping you from meeting in a public place for a little bit of time?
For me, dinner was always a safe bet. I could make conversation with anyone for 45 minutes as we ate. I don’t drink coffee or I may have gone that route if I thought I needed something shorter and less committal.
Now I’m rambling. But meet quickly, face-to-face. Don’t let the emails and phone calls build her (or you) into something she’s (or you’re) not, leading to a face-to-face disappointment. Just ask. It’s easy. And it’ll get easier.
I think the default position should be that anyone on an Internet dating site is interested in dating by definition, and that asking one of them out on a date is not really on the level of asking your waitress out on a date because she smiled at you. The interest is implied; if she’s on a dating site, has been corresponding with you, and is offended when you ask her to meet, then perhaps she’s nuts.
The point is not to have e-mail buddies; the point is to meet actual warm-blooded humans. I think a long e-mail correspondence or even switching to IMing is a bad idea. It’s not that uncommon to encounter people who sort of talk a good e-mail game but can delay that personal meeting forever for reasons of their own (low self-esteem, married, obvious lies on their profile, they’re 14-year-old boys in Taiwan). Personally, for me, having a bunch of e-mail buddies is just too close to having imaginary friends. I’d rather just meet a person and see what they’re like.
That said, comfort levels vary. There are folks who want to talk on the phone a few times before you meet, and they will want to meet in a public place for a very circumscribed coffee date. The other end of the spectrum extends to those who answer your first message with a phone number, set up a date for that night, and have sex with you on the first date. It’s important to remember not to be too offended by someone talking the more cautious approach, because they don’t know you from Adam anyway.
I’m not tracking this – by the time you write to someone, you’ve already lost interest in them? I understand that’s it’s dispiriting that not many people write back –here’s an old thread on this topic – but if you really want to do this you need to (a) find a balance where your initial messages are charming and personal but not so long that you can only write one a month before falling back onto your fainting couch in weary disarray; and (b) trick your brain somehow that you actually look forward to going out on a dinner date with a total stranger. Seriously, while it can be difficult putting yourself in the position of being judged over and over by attractive members of the desired gender, there are not too many opportunities to sit down with a stranger for an hour, find out all about them and have them find out all about you. If you were trapped on a 10-hour bus ride, you’d be happy as all get-out to have a girl to talk to, right? So, essentially, admit your social life is like being trapped on a 10-hour bus ride, and talk to the girl sitting next to you.
My worthless advice: if it’s available in your area, I’d try speed dating. It will get you more comfortable with the idea of meeting people face-to-face, and doing it without composing witty e-mails, and after doing it ten times it won’t be quite so terrifying. Nothing will likely come of it, but it’s good practice.
For the love of God, grow a pair and ask her to meet you for coffee.
*Hey X,
I’ve really been enjoying our e-mails. Let’s meet for coffee this week. I’m free Tuesday and Thursday after 6:00 pm. We could meet at the Coffee Bean on Main. How does that work for you?
-Red*
Don’t overthink it. It’s just coffee.
She’s on the market and is probably talking to other guys. She’ll eventually meet someone. You snooze, you lose. Women don’t like wishy washy wusses. Get control of the situation and do this. Today.
I have to say that I disagree with Alice on a few things. I personally hate when the gentleman suggests meeting within two or three emails. If I want to meet someone that way, I’d go to a bar to get picked up. The point of on line dating for me is to get to know someone a bit prior to meeting. After two or three emails a phone call is appropriate to keep things moving along. You learn a lot from a voice and how easily the conversation flows. After two or three weeks of this and if all goes well, I agree to a meeting. By that time, it really doesn’t matter to me how the guy looks because I know if I like him. As for me, I have confidence that although there may not be an attraction on his part, he won’t be horrified at his table companion.
If I were you, I would simply ask for her phone number on your next email. After a couple of conversations, ask about getting together for drinks. There is nothing wrong with slow and many woman, such as myself, appreciate it. To me it doesn’t seem like you have an ad simply to get laid.
I guess that’s where we part ways- I can’t really tell if I like someone until I actually meet them. I could spend weeks emailing, IMing, and talking on the phone with someone and be totally digging them and thinking it’s going to be so great to meet them, and then actually meet them and the physical chemistry is so bad that I momentarily consider doing that thing where you go to the bathroom and never come back but of course I don’t do that because I’m a nice person.
I learn a lot about people from being physically with them- one’s body language and facial expressions tell a lot. I’d rather skip the whole e-flirting thing and get down to business. And I don’t mean getting laid- that comes much later, if we’re lucky.
I would tend to think more people in the situation are like you in that aspect. I am more of a sense of humor, how his mind works type of person. I met my current SO on line and when we met, he was someone that I would not have been physically attracted to if we had met as strangers but by the time we did meet, I cared very deeply for him. His looks were simply the package that great person came in.
I haven’t dates since meeting Razorette 35 years ago, but I can tell you that you cannot establish any kind of a relationship with anything less than looking each other in the eye and at least touching each other. “Online dating” isn’t dating at all, it’s not even meeting. It’s just corresponding, and there’s no relationship-building in that. I’ve corresponded for years with people I’ve never met – I do not have a relationship with those people.
All of this is background to my point: The object of dating is to get to know someone. The only way that happens is face-to-face. Using the internet is not a substitution for this. The moment you get a girl’s phone number, call her and make a date – the point of dating is getting to know someone. If she puts you off because it’s “too soon,” delete her from your address book and move on. You will never get to know anyone via e-mail and messaging. You only establish a relationship by dining, dancing and talking together face to face.
And this is the attitude you need to have from here on out.
I recently went out with a guy from match who seemed to agonize over the tiniest decisions, like where to take me for the first date. I even told him “Dude, it’s just dinner; I’ll eat anything” and he still kept sweating over the whole process of arranging the date. Eventually, I felt compelled to take the bull by the reigns and do it myself, which in and of itself isn’t terrible, but the circumstances that pushed me to that point permanently soured my impression of him.
Give her the impression that having a date is no big deal to you. You want her to think that you have women falling out of the trees trying to score dates with you. When you do ask her out, take charge of the planning yourself. Don’t ask her a million times to list all the foods she likes and dislikes, name all of her favorite places, and describe the last cusine she’s had…because those questions, while well-intended, reveal an inability to fuly take charge of the situation.
ETA: Many girls nowadays are brave enough to ask on their on sometimes but enough girls remain that wait for the guy to ask. And we don’t want to come off as looking desperate either. So just ask!
