That’s the same reason a lot of extremely religious parents forcibly enroll their kids in ex-gay programs. Doesn’t make it justified, of course.
Actually, in retrospect I’m really glad my ex’s parents’ assholery revealed him for what he was and I don’t blame them much anymore at all. I’m freaking thankful! There are things in life that are much, much worse than the Romeo-and-Juliet drama of telling your parents to piss off. And I am not trying to play down that drama, I mean, obviously I have been there and have a scotch-taped heart to show for it. But my parents lost a child and went through several years of infertility, my father coming down with some odd viral disease that left him paralyzed for a year etc. etc… IMO a big pussy who couldn’t piss off his precious parents for love of money wouldn’t have been much use to me in the long-run. So thank you Asshole Parents!
Holy shit, do you know anything about Jewish culture? I’m guessing not. Please consult the movie “Mother” and get back to me. It is an extremely humorous, if not relatively accurate movie about the relationships of Jewish men and their mothers.
No you shouldn’t have, if you didn’t want to. BUT, you should be prepared to accept the consequences of making that decision in a culture that still relies heavily upon continued interbreeding(or IOW, marriage according to faith).
For the record, I am Jewish. Thankfully, I come from a family that is extremely liberal and secular. It allowed me to marry the love of my life, a Catholic Italian woman. Were things different, time, place, people, I might not have made that decision.
The Mother In Laws opinion, or actions in telling her son to marry a Jewish woman are wrong to you(and I also, but that’s neither here nor there), but not to many Jewish(and Punjabi, Hindi, other culture/religions as well), people. I understand where they are coming from and why they would hold these opinions. 60 years ago, I probably would have married a good Jewish girl, and I would no doubt have risked ostracization by my family and the Jewish Community as a whole.
In today’s day and age, it’s almost unthinkable. To many, including you and I, it’s a remnant of a different time, backwards as hell. On the other hand, many devout Jews still hold these ideas and are extremely devout, and there can be only one way. Like Mo said, there are very strict laws governing the behavior of Jewish people, and some follow that to the letter.
Sam
P.S.- I hear ya, Maureen.
It’s different for one main reason: At a certain age, everyone believes their parents are morons who are trying to control their lives. I completely admit I was off base about catsix’s parents, but after helping raise two stepdaughters (who call me more than they call their father) and in the middle of raising my own two, I can tell you that there is a prevailing attitude of “my parents are hopeless idiots who have no clue what I’m going through.” So yes, my first reaction is to wonder just how oppressive these parents truly are.
catsix, while it’s true that your life is yours to control, and your parents no longer do the steering, I’m getting the impression you believe all parents should be completely hands off. This is what I mean when I say you’re personalizing this issue. If there’s a healthy amount of respect on both sides, there should be no problem setting boundaries. But I don’t see why it’s wrong for a parent to give their kids some advice, or even say “look, if you go there, you’re going to regret it.” And, as I said before, being a parent makes objectivity damn near impossible. Your first instinct is to protect your child, and overriding it is not as easy as you seem to think it should be.
Elenia28, no problem. I think the kids should respect the mom’s religion, and from what the OP was saying, the young lady intends to do exactly that by converting and raising her children within the faith. I think the mom needs to cool her jets and respect her son’s decisions. I don’t think she’s right. I can just see her point of view.
No, I didn’t have the best relationship with my parents, and still don’t with my father. But I made a resolution to be a better parent, and be more involved in my kids’ lives (he was rather the opposite of yours, with alcoholism thrown in) than they were. Much therapy was involved, and my mom and I eventually found middle ground.
I should be prepared…? I did accept the consequences, I think, and have been accepting them for years now. :dubious:
I still don’t understand why that makes it right. Just because it’s always been done that way.
You wish to argue over tense? I get the feeling you’re looking for any reason to argue about the subject with people.
I don’t understand why that makes it wrong. Judaism can be very strict and based on long-standing traditions. To you, it may be wrong. To someone whose faith you’re painting with such criticism and such a blanket statement, it may be right. If so, your opinion is just that. An Opinion.
Your opinion carries no weight, and as an outsider your unfounded judgement is extremely narrow-minded. People, religion, and culture are all different. One must learn to accept certain things about them. For Jews or significant others who are involved with Jewish people of the opposite(or same) sex who are devout, and are of a different faith, it is something to keep in mind always-like it or not.
Sam
It doesn’t make it right because it’s always been done that way. I’m not sure if you read the other thread all the way through, but it was explained at one point that by marrying outside the Jewish faith, you are effectively discontinuing that religion/culture within your family. Especially if marrying a gentile woman; blood lines are passed down through the mother, not the father. It reduces the Jewish faith by however many children that couple has, and however many children they will have, and so on. It’s not just their religion, but their entire culture that some Jews feel is being eroded by interfaith marriages.
As I said before, I am a Jewish interfaith marryer. I fully understand that just what you have described(as explained in the other thread)-is what I am doing to Judaism. It’s kind of sad, but unavoidable, IMO. Jewish laws concerning marriage and faith are there to protect and grow the population of Judaica(?). Marriage outside of it only hurts the population as a whole.
But since I didn’t attend a Jewish school, didn’t regularly go to temple, attend Sunday School, go to Jewish functions and mixers, I’ve literally known only a handful of Jewish people at any given time, and the end product was pretty much guaranteed.
Besides, Italian women and Jewish women are SO alike… 
Sam
You are so bad. We are not. 
I thought Italian guilt was bad…I got nothing on my SIL, I tell ya. Nothing. That woman could outguilt my mother any day of the week.
Or steal the key to your house and have a copy made. Then go to your house while you are at work and go through your closet. My mother took everything out of my closet she didn’t think I should wear and gave it to Goodwill. She also threw away some of my books she didn’t think I should read, and re arranged my kitchen. This was last year and I’m 45 years old.
She has shown up at my job and told my boss I was quitting because “I needed to get a REAL job”. I’m a library classification specialist (cataloger) so I “don’t work with my hands enough”. She called me several times each day to complain about my marriage, clothes, job, weight, house and anything else she could think of.
I tried to talk with her about her attitude many times to no avail. It was always the same guilt trip about how she raised me after my father died when she could have given me away instead. If anyone thinks that I was throwing a tantrum to sever all ties then so be it. My life is mine and I will live it for me not someone else.
Nope. What I’m saying is that once that child becomes an adult, the parent needs to respect the boundary of involvement that the adult child has set and not meddle beyond it.
What would be the harm in not giving advice unless it is asked for?
As an adult, a person has the right to set boundaries regarding the involvement and influence other people have in their lives, including their parents. It’s the parents’ job to respect those boundaries.
Hear, hear.
It never ceases to amaze me how many people who would never dream of telling any other adult how to live (because they’re adults and able to make their own choices, donchaknow), think nothing of trying to run their adult children’s lives. They just want what’s best for them, after all, so it’s all right.
To that I say: HORSESHIT. If it’s not okay to dictate the terms of any other adult’s life, it’s not okay to try to dictate the terms of your adult child’s life. I’m not saying parents should never offer their opinions or advice once offspring reach some magical age, but your input ought be limited to that, unless something else is agreeable to all parties involved. The fact that they’re adults and entitled to the same respect, privacy, and autonomy as any other adult trumps the fact that they’re your kid.
The worst case scenerio has to got to be when the kids end up killing themselves because of the controlling bullshit their parents put them though.
An online friend from Taiwan told me about a 22 year old who had it beaten into his head by his father that he “would be” a doctor. I asked her if the boy succeeded in this, and she said that he did, but once he graduated, he realized that his life “was not his own” and so he shot himself.
What’s sad is that it seems pretty common in certain areas of the world.
And what if the threat of death were more imminent? For example, your sister were about to drive while being falling down drunk? Or maybe she was about to swallow a bunch of sleeping pills? Would you still keep from interferring simply because she is an adult making her own choices?
You tell me how that even compares to having your parent sabotage your love life, and I’ll answer it.
Or to any of the outrageous examples mentioned, like throwing out your posessions, or trying to drag you out of your workplace.
Carl Sandburg said that if we had some eggs we could have some ham and eggs if we had some ham. If there is a healthy amount of respect on both sides, then problems are not an issue to begin with.
Because the need for parental approval is so strong that the parent’s advice can be harder to go against than the advice of anyone else. And the parent can be just as wrong as anyone else. You said it yourself: “Being a parent makes objectivity damn near impossible.”
No one has said that overriding your instinct to protect your child is easy. But it is crucial to the emotional health of the child if you want that child to trust in her or his own judgment.
If the child has had an emotionally healthy environment growing up, she or he will probably be able to set boundaries naturally. But the very parents which intrude on your adulthood are often the ones who have robbed you of the very building blocks for setting up those boundaries. Thus the pistol-whipped child becomes the dominated adult.
Tinkertoy, you are most certainly not having a temper tantrum if you are doing whatever it takes to keep these things from ever happening again. You are being the responsible adult you are meant to be. And it is never too late.
Oh, good. I’m so glad the thread is being dragged back to this level. catsix and I were actually starting to understand each other, and heaven knows, we can’t have that. :rolleyes:
And it was catsix and Elenia28. Not tinkertoy. Doofus.
Ok I think we are arguing over two different things here.
You said something to the effect of I should learn to accept the consequences. Perhaps you weren’t addressing this comment directly to me. I simply answered that I had made this decision with regards to my faith, and I had accept my consequences. I’m not sure what your answer to that means, and it seems you are just as ready to argue when there was no arguement.
As for the second paragraph, you are talking as if I were an outsider. I am not simply talking about the Jewish faith and you have made it extremely narrow by (apparently) limiting it to that. I was speaking of ANYONE who gets involved with a person whose parents wish them to marry within their own culture. Do you understand? You keep bringing up Jewish people but that was simply a starting point for me. You are right. As I have no interest in a Jewish man I have no place to argue. But I do have a place to argue about interfaith relationships. I am talking in the broad sense, you are limiting me.
Also I never said not to keep it in mind! I simply said that interfaith relationships (not just Jewish!) are first and foremost the decisions of the two people involved. It is their choice whether or not to involve the parents.
I think you have this hype that I am somehow sticking my nose into all Jewish people’s business. I ask you who has the chip on their shoulder. And to prove it, I will no longer argue with you at all. I’m done. You may think as you wish.
Elenia28, I’m sorry to see you won’t discuss it any more. Because that’s what your OP was referring to. At least, I thought it was. A Jewish/Christian marriage that the mother doesn’t approve of. And while all interfaith marraiges have difficulties, this one poses problems that I (and GaWd, apparently) felt you didn’t really consider before your OP. Not all interfaith marraiges, Jewish/other.