Put her back in the closet

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
1

Not what you think… or maybe it is.

My daughter is 12 and in 7th grade. She came home very agitated one day, crying that she needed to confess something. Our hearts are racing: did she get in a fight, damage something, find a boyfriend, start kissing… a million scenarios are going through our head as she’s settling down.

Then she tells us she has a crush on a girl, and she is afraid to tell us she may be “bi”.

We’re actually relieved. Okay, she won’t get pregnant or anything :wink:

She says she never talks to this girl and nothing happened. They don’t go to the same school anymore. So we tell her we’re supportive and don’t be afraid of telling us anything. While hugs abound, my wife and I exchange knowing looks “a 12 year old has no idea”, so we just decide to ignore it and let the phase take it’s course. She’s been into plays like Evan Hansen and reading teenage books, so we figure she doing it to be cool and different. We’re a little afraid to tell her to keep it personal and quiet, lest we become “My parents don’t support me.” If anything, we feel if we do tell her to chill, it will only escalate and a persecution complex will emerge.

So, today, it escalated: We get a call from the school. She told her teachers she wants to be addressed as “Alex” and start using the Boy’s bathroom, because she is starting to identify as male. It’s one thing to say it to us and a few of her friends. But if she’s now bold enough to tell school authorities, it looks like it’s time for a little chat. We did tell the school “She’s a girl named Anya, unless we tell you otherwise”

We want her to express herself and support her whatever LGBTQ she is/becomes. That said, don’t believe a 12-year-old understands what it means. And now she’s publicly telling everyone about this, including authorities like teachers.

I’m an SDMB '99er, so, while I don’t post a whole lot, I know the vibe of this board pretty well. Is there a rational way to get her to chill until she’s older, even if it screams “Homophobia”?
And yes, I know I’ll get answers like “stop being homophobic” or, worse, “she’s not a little girl anymore”. Admittedly, perhaps I don’t want to accept the latter.

2

Oh no…She’s/he’s way too young to have to go thru this without some skilled therapy…I am sure y’all are great parents, you showed that by how you reacted to her/him telling you, but…if you feel overwhelmed by this it will color your decisions and perimeters for talking to her/him…get professional help as soon as you can and make sure they work LGBTQ teens

3

ISTM she may have been holding back some in that first conversation with you. “Time for a chat” seems about right, especially if she took your supportive response to the first one as a sort of carte blanche to announce her identity realizations to all and sundry so you hear about them from other people.

Some other Dopers who have lived through this, either as the parent or as the child will probably be along with more specifically useful advice . Good luck.

4

You said you told her you’re supportive. I’m sorry, this is harsh, but you don’t actually sound supportive, you sound like you want your kid to shut up and be normal (and maybe stop embarrassing you), regardless of what they want, or are.

Thinking back, just in my little group of school friends (and I was an unpopular nerd), the first girl started having sex at 13. Yeah, too young, and I can be damn sure her parents didn’t know about it, but kids that age are not necessarily just having little cute crushes on each other. It’s not just something to dismiss as ‘she told us she’s “bi”, she has no idea what that means!’

How many times have we had the ‘How old were you when you realised you were gay/trans?’ threads on here?

They’re 12. And yes, you said it yourself, not a little kid. You probably should at least consider the possibility that this is not a phase, and they may not just grow out of it. Sure, it might be, but what’s your plan if it’s not?

You’re also giving hella mixed messages here- we want her to express herself, but without telling anyone but us and maybe a few close friends. We want her to think we’re supportive, but we don’t actually support her choices, because we think they’re not real. It’s not surprising you’re not on the same page, you’re skipping between chapters yourself.

I’m not a parent, but trying to shove a kid back into the closet sounds unlikely to do anything other than build resentment, and make said kid wary about telling you anything. You need to talk, yes, but even more than that, you need to listen.

It might all blow over, this might be temporary, maybe hormones kicking in and doing weird things, but dismissing your 12 year old’s thoughts and experiences about their own identity, even if they turn out to be just a phase could badly damage your long term relationship. It definitely won’t help.

5

One of my daughter’s best friends is a FtM trans kid. He started around 12. LOTS of therapy and exploration as a family, starting before then, before he came out. It’s been very good in his case.

I’d make it clear you support her fully, and therefore lets get a process in place. For something this huge as a physical/psych/social ball of issues, it must be approached seriously. Ask her to work with you on this process and what approaches experts recommended for managing a transition, if any ends up occurring. Simply charging ahead solo is risky as hell - let’s talk to some pros.

Also ask her to do you a favor and go through a thoughtful process for your sakes - tell her this is new and scary for you and you’re trying to figure things out to support her/him and you need expert input.

Whether she follows through with a full transition and how you handle it is one of those Huge Parent Things, but if you demonstrate a willingness to commit to a process, you increase the chance you’ll do it together.

Good luck.

6

I have to agree that this doesn’t seem supportive. From the kid’s perspective, you’ve gone behind their back and made the decision for them, telling everyone in authority that you won’t allow them to be male. Imagine if it turns out this isn’t a phase, and your kid is actually male! You’ve just become the transphobic parents who went out of your way to oppress them by even forcing the teachers into a shitty situation.

You say that twelve is too young to know for sure. That’s fine. But then you act like you do know for sure. Your child is female, and just doesn’t know any better. You’re willing to tell everyone to ignore their clams to be male. You seem pretty sure that they’re not going to wind up male, and thus find all of this oppressive.

My suggestion is to stop doing anything before you talk to your kid. And actually listen, without preconceptions. Don’t try to change their mind so much as to understand them. Leave this “it’s just a phase” idea out, and realize it may be, or it may not be. You don’t know.

And do realize that they can always change back, if it turns out they are wrong. The genie is out of the bottle–they’ve already told people they are male. There’s no harm in letting them try that out, and discover if that works for them. If it does, great. If not, they make another announcement and things go back. What’s the harm?

I would also consider actually talking to the teachers as equals. They are more likely to have seen this sort of thing before. They have experience with multiple kids, while you have experience with only your own. It’s very possible they know more than you.

I would hate to be a teacher who had to decide between what the kid wants and what the parent wants. Do I make the kid feel like crap to avoid the wrath of the parents? Because if your kid really is trans, then referring to them as female is only going to increase their gender dysphoria. You’re only going to hurt them more.

I get it. This is a hard thing to deal with, especially since the entire concept is so new. But I do know one thing for sure. Trying to choose for the kid is not going to work. If they are trans, they really are trans. If they’re not, they’re not. (Same on whether they are bi or are not). Nothing you do can change this.

The only choice you really have is whether you will be helpful or be seen as an obstacle to overcome.

7

I’m not an expert, but I suspect PFLAG and similar groups will almost certainly have some relevant resources to help you navigate this. You don’t have to reinvent the wheel here - many other parents have gone through this sort of thing (both for those kids for whom this was a “phase” and those for whom it wasn’t) and you should seek them out and learn from their experiences.

8

I would seriously reexamine the idea that 12-year-olds don’t know. As others have said, there have been plenty of threads where people have known they are LGBTQ from even earlier.

9

I think that the orientation part is relatively unimportant since there is plenty of room on the scale for everyone no matter what their feelings turn out to be later on.

W/r/t gender, I think the more recently s/he came to the conclusion about gender, the more likely s/he is to be confused or insincere. If s/he says that s/he has always known about being the “wrong” gender, then it is most likely true and sincere. I just can’t think of a way to find out about this without asking leading questions.

I s/he has felt this way for a long time then I think you should reverse your anti-social-transition stance. If she hasn’t, then I’m not sure what to do except I’d still allow a name change since people change names for lots of reasons and Alex can be a girls name as well :slight_smile:

10

What was the timeframe between that initial conversation and the change in self-identification?

11

Here’s a thread from 4 years ago that covers a similar situation: Support for the parent of a gender-questioning child? Please? - In My Humble Opinion - Straight Dope Message Board

You might find some good info there.

12

My daughter likewise came out as gay at about that age. I also had doubts about whether she really knew what she was talking about. Actually, I still do…she is now 25 and has not had any relationships or experiences that I know of.

I did also tell her that it wasn’t necessarily something to share with everyone. I was mostly worried about some very religious/homophobic relatives finding out and giving her a hard time, but I also thought she might get picked on at school.

The thing in your story that stands out to me is that she told school administrators she was starting to identify as male before she told her parents, even though you guys were okay with her being bi. Why would she do that?

13

I have no experience in this, but I don’t think 12 is too young to know. All involved need some counseling on how to best proceed.

14

As the mother of a daughter who started identifying as bi early, and hasn’t wavered, I would suggest that questioning her age and commitment is the wrong course of action.

Please get counseling, both for yourselves and her.

15

What was the time frame on all of this? It sounds like one day she tells you she has a crush on another girl and the next day she tells school she now identifies as a male. These are separate things. She might be a lesbian, or bi, or heterosexual and just have a same sex attraction right now. I don’t get when the gender came into the picture. Did she leave a large chunk of information out of the conversation she had with you and your wife? I agree with the other posters, some therapy sounds very reasonable.

16

I hope, hope the school is okay with her/his public transition. Some schools simply won’t let a student say they identify with another gender…and of course there will be bathroom and athletic issues. Wrongly of course…but it takes years for school boards to address these things…There are so many social hinderances s/he will have to navigate in your community. Get pro-help!!

17

Not a parent myself, but…

Sure it’s possible your child is “wrong” about their ultimate path…they’re 12. It’s also possible they have a lot more exploration to do.

It’s also likely that they will face prejudice and misunderstanding for this announcement. From relatives as well as peers and bullies.

It’s also possible this will put you (the parents) through a lot of worry and perhaps (if they change their minds later) even embarrassment.

None of that really matters, though. There are some things you have to do if you love someone and want to support them – some things you have to accept as truths even if those truths change later.

So what if the school has to make accommodations? It’s not like they’ll be the only institution adapting – this is one of the issues our generation is dealing with everywhere.

So what if your child changes their mind later and reverts to female, and your co-workers give you crap for buckling to a 12-year-old? Who do you love, some asshole from accounting, or your child? Fix said asshole with a steely gaze and say “Yes, and we love [name],” and hold your head high.

I guarantee you that the warm, immediate, unflinching embrace of their parents is what children will remember forever after and model themselves on later in life, regardless of whether they were making a childish mistake at the time or not. Perhaps ESPECIALLY if they were making a childish mistake.

My relationship with my own father was strained at times. But I will NEVER forget that at the lowest moment in my life, when I tried to apologize to him for screwing up, he just shook his head and said, “Put your stuff in the car – let’s go home.”

At my Mom’s funeral, my sister’s fondest memory was when she came out as lesbian. My Mom’s immediate and total embrace of that announcement defined their relationship for the rest of her life.

Some things you don’t analyze and can’t prepare for. You just have a choice: is this love, or is it something less?

18

I am self-centered and self-aggrandizing enough to say that if my book were available to kids (and folks who counsel kids) and to the LGBTQ community in general, there would be an additional “model” for how to think of yourself, when you’re at the age of figuring that stuff out, a model that embraces having an inverted gender identity (in the OP’s daughter’s case, “I am one of the boys”) without that understanding being bolted onto “my body is therefore wrong”.

That does not mean that it is not valid for a 13 or 16 or 9 year old to conclude both that “I am a boy” and also that “my body is wrong and I want to transition”. It does, however, mean that they could consider a different model in which embracing the non-default gender for their body is validated but the body in which they were born is ALSO validated. Male girls and female boys, why not?

19

[sidetrack] AHunter3 Have you linked to your book? My daughter identifies as pan (to be more specific), but she also is female and presents as male or gender neutral. I think your book might be interesting for her. Feel free to send me a PM if you don’t want to link in the thread. /sidetrack]

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I would happily link if it were available for sale already (assuming the mods were OK with that, I mean). (But it’s not; it’s scheduled to be out in late November).