Question about unattractive women

In My Humble Opinion
21

I’ve known several unattractive women who had no trouble getting men. There are some men who discriminate based on looks alone, but plenty who don’t. I think part of the reason many unattractive women are unable to get a man is because they have low self-esteem and don’t try - they assume that no man will want them.

I am one of the bad guys who does discriminate somewhat based on looks. I’ve dated a few women who could be described as ‘plain’ but I don’t think I would date a woman who was ugly. There’s only been one woman whose advances I rejected and she WAS unattractive, but she was also an extremely annoying and mean-spirited person. I probably would have dated her if she was good looking though, despite that.

22

Like ** Malkavia ** said; There’s charm and * humor *

I’ve dated “ugly” guys. Not for their power or wealth, but they were FUNNY.

Would you guys do the same?

  • I’m neither gorgeous or ugly…just curious.:wink:
23

shrew , you are SO right.
My sister is stunningly beautiful. All of 110lbs with long, thick hair and a “perfect” figure. And I feel so awful for her sometimes. People always say things to her like

“You’re so pretty…”

“…You’ve got such a lovely shape.”

“You look great in those jeans.”

ad nauseum.

No one comments on her intelligence, wit or creativity. It has to leave her feeling quite empty at times.

Plus, she has no way of weeding out shallow people.

24

I wanted to say something “humorously” shallow (and typically male) like: “it doesn’t matter if she’s “unattractive” as long as she’s got a really great rack…”

…but seriously, I’ve known a handful of women that society might define as “unattractive” that I found to be bright, charming, funny, creative, etc. Some of these ladies did expressed some unhappiness over their looks from time to time. But their spirit and positive attitude overcame their (own) perceived physical shortcomings and I found them to be among the most beautiful and desirable women I have ever encountered. I never felt like any friendship or relationship we shared was ever for the purpose of “validating” their worth.

25

We were just talking about this last night on the way home from dinner. I have a friend who is extremely witty, intelligent, compassionate, and just all-around the most sarcastically fun person you could ever want to meet. She knows this. However, she thinks she’s ugly. By western standards, maybe she is. I don’t know. I certainly don’t think so, but most of the guys in our circle will admit that she is not the most attractive girl. Sometimes I really wonder if I could relate at all to what her life has been like in regards to this subject. I have been told all my live that I was beautiful. Of course, there are many people that would dispute this. I have dark hair and green eyes. For some guys, only blond and blue may do.
I have hourglass hips and breasts. Some guys would insist on boyish leanness and only a champagne glass-full. I’m sure there are lots of people who find me ugly. However, I have never had to deal with image issues, because I have received so much positive feedback about image my entire life. I take it for granted that people will at least pick up the book for the cover, even if they think it’s a horrific read! She has virtually, by her own admission, never had that benefit, which I think more attractive
people take for granted.
Having said that, this so-called unattractive girl gets much more attention from guys than my marathon running blond blue-eyed fantastic figured successful friend, who is a little on the frigid side, seems less comfortable in her own skin, and can’t get a second date to save her life. So go figure.
I really do believe that to some extent, the attitude of “it’s not what you have, it’s what people THINK you have” can take people a lot lot further than a pretty face.

26

It is extremely difficult for both men and women with today’s all-pervasive mis-representational media blasting us with unreal images of human beauty.

It is also extremely difficult as studies continue to show that the more beautiful are more likely to succeed: to win richer partners, to be selected at job interviews, to attract more attention and popularity (yes there can be a downside, but we’re focusing on the “non-attractives” here).

Many people spend all their lives never coming to terms with feelings of unattractiveness, overweight, inadequacy. It’s the reason for all those Miracle Weightloss! and Penile Enlargement spams - there are people out there so desperate they respond. There are increasing numbers of people with anorexia, bulimia, body dysmorphic syndrome. The (non-medically necessary) plastic surgery is surely growing exponentially.

I would rate myself as average attractiveness (I work on-screen) but am far, far from “beautiful.” Like 99% of women, I suffer off-days when I feel hideous and unattractive. There’s really nothing you can do about it. I think you learn to focus on your good - or less worse!! - points, such that when you look a mirror you look straight at your eyes, not double chin/wrinkles/large birthmark whatever.

You spend your time enhancing those points. You kid yourself (realistically or unrealistically) that if your pretty eyes are made up, or your neat ankles showing sexily, society at large will be distracted from your huge arse or your thin, dull hair.

But beauty is also like athleticism or brilliant brain-power - you don’t really expect to achieve it to the extent of supermodels or people in films/magazines. I don’t look at Venus Williams and think, “god, I’m so puny compared to her.” I just think, there’s someone with a professionally muscular body. In the same way, I look at Cindy Crawford, and think, “there’s someone with professionally beautiful looks.”

And I guess all of us - more attractive and less attractive - learn to use our own looks as a benchmark, rather than those of others. So it’s not “I look so much worse than Julia Roberts today” but “my skin looks much more blotchy than it did last week” or “my lips look particularly nice and full last night, compared to usual.”

And back to the question in the OP:

Very often, she never will.

27

Any woman I’ve been involved with has had to be beautiful to me. But that covers a lot of ground. Women can be physically attractive in far more ways than the TV programs and magazine ads let on. And as I get to know a woman, my awareness of what she’s really like tends to get folded into my perception of her looks. Intelligence, empathy, a wicked sense of humor, liking oneself, and being interested in a wide range of people and things - these attributes can make a woman very beautiful indeed.

So would I be involved with an ugly woman? Of course not, at least not one that I regarded as ugly. I’ve certainly been involved with one or two whose driver’s-license photos looked quite unattractive, even to me - but that wasn’t how I saw them.

*[sub]“Say, you cover a lot of ground yourself. You’d better beat it. I hear they’re going to tear you down and put up an office building where you’re standing.”
– Groucho to Margaret Dumont in Duck Soup.
(Sorry, couldn’t help myself. :))[/sub]

28

astro writes:

> Now when a man is not that good looking he can least console
> himself that if he accumulates enought wealth or power he can
> become more “attractive” via these attributes. The reverse is
> generally not true for unattractive women. An unattractive
> woman with money and power is simply an unattractive woman
> with money and power to most men.

I’ve never believed this. From my personal experience, unattractive men are just as unhappy about their lack of looks as unattractive women are and are just as lonely because of their inability to find dates. It may be true that they talk about their unhappiness and loneliness less, but that may be because men aren’t expected to complain like things like this. Women are allowed to cry on other women’s shoulders; men are supposed to just suck it up or to get drunk with their buddies in order to forget their problems.

Furthermore, the proportion of men with enough money or power to attract women purely on the basis of that money and power is actually fairly small. These days you’ve got to be reasonably rich and/or fairly powerful to attract women on the basis of just money and power. It’s not like the old days when any doctor or lawyer, regardless of his lack of looks, could find a wife because some reasonably intelligent but unattractive woman would tell herself, “Well, he’s not very good-looking, but then neither am I, and at least he’s got some money. I’m getting older and I don’t want to settle for some of the dolts I’ve dated who have no brains, no money, and no looks.” Nowdays such a woman would be more likely to say, “Hey, I could become a doctor or a lawyer myself. And if I never find anyone, I wouldn’t like it, but it wouldn’t kill me.”

29

You don’t give most men due credit when you say that they can console themselves with enough wealth or power. I wouldn’t look twice at any man’s wallet, regardless of his looks.

I also wouldn’t give back what I have learned in the last 25 years for anything. As a teenager, my best friend was very flashy: “Farrah” hair (gives you an idea of my age), tall, did wonders with makeup. Me: 5’7", red hair, glasses, i.e., didn’t stand out. The difference between us: No one noticed my looks so I “had” to develop a personality. Her? Will never see her dream of tons of kids, being a millionaire, blah blah blah, because she went on her looks alone. She is a very boring person. I, on the other hand, believe I am more attractive now in middle age than when I was 20. I also have men (who have nothing to gain from it) tell me I’m beautiful. I am happily married and have two boys who I hope I am teaching what is important in life.

People like people who are interesting and who make them feel good. It’s as simple as that.

30

I wish it weren’t a cliché that “inner beauty is what really matters” — because it is a cliché. However, the reason that it’s a cliché is because it’s true. If you can get past the clichéness of this truth (which is only a superficial, verbal phenomenon) and get right down to the living reality of it, then you know it deep in your bones, in your blood, in your innermost core of your being where the real truth strikes a chord and resonates.

I once visited the hotornot.com site, which numerically rates people’s pictures bsed on their superficial appearance. I had fun there for a while, looking for hotties, but soon got that sick feeling that you get from pigging out on too much junk food. Then I pondered why my gut feeling tells me this is wrong.

I have known certain women who were older, pudgy, even frumpy looking. But they and not the centerfold stereotype are the ones who give me spontaneous erotism just from being in their presence. You know why? They had that inner beauty, a strong sense of self-awareness and heightened consciousness along with vibrant life-energy. One of them is in my yoga class, another is a yoga teacher who used to work with me (I was sorry when she got another job). Neither of these women was within miles of being considered “good looking.” Someone who only looked superficially would But they are the sexiest women I know. When I was sitting at my desk at work, and saw this lady standing at her desk and doing sideways yoga stretches, as her dress slid along her hips I got very aroused, looking upon her as a man looking upon a woman. She was so nice, I loved working with her. Once she gave a yoga class at work.

What both these wonderful ladies have in common is yoga. In my experience, yoga is the best beauty secret of all (along with not smoking) because it builds up your beauty from within, and it radiates outward. I’m very grateful to these ladies for making me understand the true meaning of beauty. If I weren’t already married, I would have the serious “hots” for them.

Barking Spider’s remark

is very well said. I agree with that completely.

31

Sidle , you took the words right out of my mouth (substitute brown eyes, olive skin and champagne-glass chi chis…).

My situation might be a little different, however, in that I’m Black, but grew up around a lot of White people, which means that among certain people I got little attention for my looks, and among others I got ALL the attention!

While the (White) boys I knew growing up thought I was pretty groovy, and I enjoyed a modicum of “popularity” in terms of getting invited to parties and all, come prom time I was pretty much left out in the wind. (Now that I’m in my 30s, I’ve come across a couple of fellas from my past who’ve admitted they had big crushes on me back in the day… then sort of evaded the issue when I asked where the hell THEY were on Prom night, when I was eating Chinese food with my mom!)

On the other hand, I always got a lot of attention from Black people old and young (friends of my parents, or the kids in my grandparents’ neighborhood/church in Houston, where I spent the summers growing up, fellow students at the Black college I went to…) for my looks (which may have saved my ego during those promless adolescent years). Sucks to say, but light skin and long hair were my “in” to the Beauty Hall of Fame among Black people, in those days (and HOO-WEE! just let me MENTION cutting my hair in those days, Honey, a full-on intervention took place)…

Ironically, nowadays I find that more of the Black people in my life are rejecting the “lighter and longer” aesthetic that garnered me all those dates in college, and are more attracted to dark-skinned people (I am strangely happy about this…), meanwhile more White people are asking me out on dates these days (OK, not LATELY, but everyone has a dry spell, right?) ; did I mention I ended up dating (in my mid-20s) one of those guys who had a crush on me in high school?

I swear to God, though, if one more person tells me I look “exotic” (honey, I’m just a Colored gal from Kansas), I will kick some neck up in here, you hear me? :stuck_out_tongue:

But I digress.

I often wonder how people (no matter where they rank on the “Magazine Standards of Beauty” scale) can live day to day thinking, “I’m ugly.” It’s one thing if you’re thinking, “I’m no Christy Turlington” and you don’t give a rat’s ass (as you shouldn’t), but I do see the point of the original OP, and echo the sentiment: How DO you cope if you think you’re butt-ugly (which, as someone said, few people are) and are hating yourself because of it?

I feel like I’ve been lucky in that I’ve never been put into a situation to know what that’s like, but I wonder what others think about who’s to blame, here?

Can we pin it on the media (whose new emphasis seems to be on the “BUT” campaign: “[Fill in appropriate “Beauty Infraction” here] BUT still beautiful”), or do we say, “Well, hell, all of those people trying to convince us we’re ugly are just doing their jobs, which is to sell us things that promise to make us pretty, ,and it’s our fault if we fall for that crap?”

32

I know a couple where the husband is handsome and successful. Not only that, but his parents are attractive and his children are growing up to be handsome. The wife is, and I’m sorry there’s no gentle way to put it, ugly. However, she has a wide range of interests and a vivacious personality. I think she could charm the socks off even the shallowest, most superficial man.

33

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Who was made judge of what is beauty? What is beauty today may not be tomorrow. e.g. Twiggy.

I think the woman just finds a guy who likes her the way she is. A few of them find very attractive women to hang out with, perhaps to use as guy-magnets?

34

Whoops, I forgot to insert some words. Let me complete the sentence. It should have read:

Someone who only looked superficially would say they are “ugly.” But they are the sexiest women I know. I have been taught my lesson. I can never again call a woman “ugly.” All women are beautiful.

35

Word. Think Wallis Simpson. The difference is, though, that I seriously doubt Wallis Simpson considered herself to be unattractive, and by all accounts, thy guys sure went for her in big way!
But what about women who really do think they’re unattractive? Who, unlike the previous examples, don’t seem to possess the smoke-and-mirrors charms to make themselves seem gorgeous even if the parts don’t add up that way? This is a subject that has intrigued me for some time. I really do wonder what life is ilke for people-and let’s face it-especially women, who are ugly, if only in their own minds.

36

Well, it depends, doesn’t it?

If the woman thinks that she is hideously ugly and defines beauty and attractiveness as being other than herself, then that’s very sad.

If she knows that her face isn’t as conventionally beautiful as that of a film star, but knows that she can be attractive to people via a vibrant personality, then she can’t be so sad. A woman laughing out loud at a joke is a beautiful, happy sight.

If the woman gets self-esteem boosts from other areas of life, she’s less likely to concentrate on her non-appearance on magazine covers as a source of misery, isn’t she? If her boss tells her she’s damn good at doing her job, if clients or customers ask specially to have her work for them, then she’ll feel better about herself all round. Western society gives conventional beauty more importance than it deserves, but come on, it isn’t the only thing that is considered important!

If she is rich, she is rich. Dollars and pounds and euros buy goods, doe-eyes and apple cheeks don’t. Personally, I’d rather have a lover who chose me for my laugh, and drive a car I bought myself; than I would have a lover who chose me for my face and bought me a car because of my face.

37

I don’t date or get involved with women based on how they look. I know many women who have the reciprocal attitude towards guys, i.e., that appreciating a guy’s visual attractiveness has no bearing on whether or not they’d do more than glance with appreciation for the view.

I’d rather stare at a nice photo of Christie Brinkley than of Janet Reno, but I’d rather go out with Janet Reno.

38

Handy: You got my thinking about something I hope isn’t too off topic. You mention how the standards of beauty change, i.e., Twiggy. It made me think of one woman who was beautiful 20 years ago and still is (agree?/disagree?): Bo Derek. But there again, you have someone with a brain and interests in something outside of her physical beauty. My 15-year-old son has a girl in his class who is gorgeous now but has no discernible (sp?) personality. Her sister, however, has this off-beat thing going on, not stereotypically cute, but her own style, and NOTE: a personality. I’m glad to see in this thread that it appears most of the posters here look beyond the physical.

39

The most unattractive people I know are unattractive because they possess certain qualities like jealousy, selfishness, ignorance, cruelty, immaturity, spite, shallowness, etc. I could go on, but the bottom line (from someone who’s put on a few extra pounds in the last few years–and Zyada, I miss that thread too!–and could, as noted above, therefore be perceived as “unattractive”) is that looks fade, wrinkles form, you get spots on your hands and veins pop out of your legs. What lasts is one’s personality, an intellect (or, at the very least, a desire to increase one’s existing knowledge), an open mind, and a kind and caring demeanor.
That said, there’s sadly not a lot you can do to raise someone’s self-esteem when they think themselves desperately and irrevocably flawed, especially physically.

40

Okay, I’ll try to answer the OP.

We fake it. Or at least some of us do.

I can’t accurately describe how I truly feel about myself physically without getting this thread bounced to the Pit. My self-worth is practically non-existent, due in part to the way I was raised and part because of some rather traumatic events in my more-recent past. Go look up the DSM-IV on the web and read the ‘Avoidant Personality Disorder’ characteristics. That’s my picture you see next to it.

So I compensate with a really huge ego. Remember the genie from Aladdin? Phenominal cosmic power, itty bitty living space? Same thing. I’ve seen a few therapists over the years, and they’ve been shocked to find out that I’m APD. I can be extremely outgoing, very personable, very funny, very confident. People do tend to like me for some inexplicable reason. But it’s all theatrics. It’s how I’d like to be, but it’s not really how I am.

Prime example… I didn’t bat an eye when I wore leather pants to the Bama Dopefest, but damn if I didn’t emotionally punish myself for it later. For weeks.

I applaud those of you who have reached the stage where you’ve learned to accept yourselves as you are. I’d give anything to be right there with you. But as has already been pointed out, it’s not easy. There are too many conflicting messages that bomard us from all angles, telling us that we’re not good enough because of the way we look.

I’m taking a class this semester on counseling individuals with eating disorders. I’ve had two serious anorexic episodes in my life, so I have a little experience in this area. The professor keeps talking about EDs being about control- the individual lacks control over other aspects of their lives, so they control their eating. She’s full of it. Sure, that may be a part of it for some cases, but I’ll tell you that the majority of people with EDs, the ones that have real trouble recovering, do it for the positive feedback they get from those around them. My mom bought me a whole new wardrobe when I lost 50 pounds in 6 weeks, and told me over and over how fabulous I looked. Until then, she constantly harped on my looks, when she paid attention to me at all. There are benefits, emotionally, to being thin and attractive, and no matter what you tell the ED person, they will not believe that it’s transitory or that they can get the attention no matter how they look. All they know is people love them and pay attention to them when they’re thin. Don’t think for a moment I can’t tally the difference between the amount of looks I received when I was 5’6 and 120 pounds and what I get now. And don’t think for a moment I don’t use that information to totally berate myself, despite knowing better.

Boy, this became a bit of a rant. Sorry 'bout that. Did that even come close to answering your question?

-BK