Seeing as there was visible blood on the frig, I don’t think it would have taken the police too long to figure it out. And it’s been reported that the police and the FBI have torn up this dybbuk’s apartment, backyard and car.
Really? Wow. I thought that was verboten. Thanks.
I’m not sure that I get the Hassidic Jews’ reaction to finding out that the murderer was “one of them.” One neighbor expressed being especially saddened by this.
I mean, were my child murdered by a stranger, I’m not sure I’d care whether he went to my church or not. I’d probably express disgust that he pretended to be a Christian, but I don’t get how the murderer sharing my religion is any more or less horrific than him being, oh, an Episcopalian.
I think it is a close enough community that it would be distressing.
It’s not quite the same thing. Hasidic communities are much more tightly knit and insular than your average Christian church. And Orthodox Judaism is all about “us” vs. “not us.” Different dress, different food, different holidays, different language (in some cases), etc. There’s this constant refrain of “Eisav soneh l’Yaakov” (Esau hates Jacob) supported by thousands of years of horrific persecution that makes them wary of outsiders. So if you’ve put up metaphorical walls and tried to protect yourself and then it turns out the wolf is inside with you, it can be a horrible shock.
Ironically, this may have played a role in getting Leiby killed. He maybe saw this guy with yarmulke and beard and thought, “Hey, a frum Jew, he’s one of us, he’ll help me” and he wasn’t as wary of a stranger as he should have been.
Edit: Well, I don’t want to say it’s all about “us vs. not us.” before somebody jumps on me, but separation is a pretty big theme.
Whoosh! I mean what are you gonna’ do?
It’s a done deal now. Sad but true.
From watching Law and Order, I have learned that 1st Degree Murder is reserved for muder of a Police Officer in the State of New York.
2nd Degree Murder is still eligible for the Death Penalty
I’m also a L&O fan, but I looked it up out of curiosity. New York Penal Article 125.27 defines Murder in the first degree as killing a police officer, a judge, a peace officer (which includes bailiffs, parole officers, probation officers, etc.), a prison employee, a witness to a previous crime, murder-for-hire, felony murder (i.e. killing someone in furtherance to a robbery, burglary, kidnapping, rape, etc.), killing in an “especially cruel and wanton manner”, serial murder (i.e. the defendant’s killed two or more people in New York in the previous two years in a similar fashion)…
There’s more to it of course, but the sections I found surprising show that one can be charged with first-degree murder is one has already been convicted of a separate murder, in New York or elsewhere, or if one is already serving 15-to-life in a New York prison (or has escaped from such an imprisonment and kills while at large). If I read this correctly, if you’ve done you’re time for an earlier murder, been paroled, go to visit a former girlfriend, she angrily attacks you with a knife, you kill her in self defense… boom, you can be charged with first-degree murder, though you can try to argue extreme emotional disturbance, as described in the article.
I’m not even Hassidic, and for the past two days I’ve been freaking out, because JEWS. DON’T. DO. THAT. It’s like hearing your friend’s spouse shot up a building. It’s like your neighbor down the block turns out to be a convicted pedophile. It’s like That Guy Everyone Says Hi To turns out to be a wanted terrorist. It just makes no sense. Sense is broken. I should leave this thread and start thinking about happy fluffy kittens before I totally lose it.
It’s going to be ok. Gud Shabbes.
That guy is GREAT! He spoke to us around the same time as he was on Oprah.
Suspect Levi Aron charged with first-degree murder after all, based on the kidnapping.
I occasionally listen to Dennis Prager & one day a caller asked about the Blood Libel- if it might have once happened that some crazed person in the Jewish community actually killed a Gentile/Christian child, & if the blood might have been used ritually. and all the legends might have come from one incident. Prager denied that was even possible due to the strict Torah ban on blood-use. My first thought was “Yeah, but the words of Jesus indicate that he regarded corrupting a child as one of the vilest crimes, yet that doesn’t stop ‘Christian’ pedophiles…”
UPDATE: Just when I thought this story could not get any freakier, the murderer’s attorney states:
Inbreeding made my client do it
:eek:
:mad:
Well, there’s a certain novelty and imagination to it, I admit. I expect Law & Order:SVU will rip this one from the headlines sooner or later.
Yet another reason to go with option 2.
I’ve had a few months to make up my mind, but I am still on the fence over the basic issues. Could you please give me your insights?
- If a child must be kidnapped, murdered and butchered, for the greater good of society…
a) Should the kidnapping be allowed in a vehicle, even if this violates loading/unloading laws?
b) Should the state have a say in how slowly or quickly the child is murdered?
c) To what extent should the state or federal government regulate the level of butchery?
i) Should the butchering of the child be allowed to occur on public property?
ii) Is simple limb dismemberment enough, or should the state also mandate digits and internal organs be separated from the body as well.
iii) Should the federal government play a role in certifying and inspecting equipment to be used in the butchering of people, or should this be left up to the free market?
d) If it is found to be immoral to kidnap, murder, and butcher a child, would it instead be acceptible to kidnap, murder and rape a child instead?
Thank you for your input in helping me figure out the finer details of this situation.
Oh give me a break. Who would even regulate such a thing: The FDA? Health and Human Services? This should be left entirely up to municipalities to handle.
When informed of the accusation, Levi Aron’s parents both replied with an emphatic “Nuh-Uh!”
The Death Courts, committees or squads Pail spoke about.