Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 1)

I wonder what they’re up to …

I’m pretty sure it’s this.

Yes, it is infinitely more complex than a simple vote. But so is conquering a country.

The object should be to stop a war before it starts.

We stood by for weeks while a crazy person lied about NOT invading Ukraine. We could have rolled in a shit-ton of equipment from NATO (by invitation). It doesn’t require any sword rattling. Just a meet-and-great with our Ukrainian neighbor.

Putin takes his army that he said he wasn’t going to use and goes home. No humiliating defeat.

convoy gotta pee…

What makes you think he’s unable to use them? He hasn’t to date, but that doesn’t mean he couldn’t or can’t. There is a lot of speculation as to why Russia has so far not really utilized their air power, but none of the stuff I’ve seen indicates it’s because they can’t. And if Russia is going up against NATO then they would have too.

This is the first time I’ve heard that, and it just might haunt my dreams.

I’ve heard that temperatures are -20º. I don’t know if that is C or F, but either way it’s cold enough to freeze the ground and allow them to maneuver off the road.

Here’s some welcome news.
Guardian Live blog…

Keep in mind gas prices (not oil) are due to rise temporarily when we switch to spring blends.

The best explanation I have seen for that is this article. It doesn’t say they can’t, but it does detail why it might be a bad idea to use their air force heavily. The short version: when employed properly, the Russian/USSR built SAM systems are particularly effective against Russian/USSR built aircraft. It’s possible that they’ve generally held back to continue the fiction that this isn’t an invasion, but they seem to have lost a significant number of aircraft if they’ve restrained themselves in the air war.

Personally, I’m hoping that that’s the reason. My worry would be that the plan was to get his people into place around the major cities, Zerg over from the sky for an all out bombing run, and then sweep through on foot to pick off any survivors.

If so, then it’s still coming. Putin just hasn’t gotten his ground forces in place and Zelensky would have good cause to want a no-fly zone.

With the convoy having called it a day, Putin might decide to call it in at any moment - if that is the plan.

If I was Zelensky, I might call it time to abandon Kyiv. At this point, I think that he can be confident that Ukraine is (for the duration) controlled by him and not by a particular city. He’s distracted Russia enough by staying in the capital. Hopefully, they’ve been able to get most of everyone out of the city.

That would have been very unwise. Putin was desperate for any pretext to start the invasion he had been planning for months. A massive arms buildup in Ukraine orchestrated by NATO countries would have given him just the excuse he needed, and many observers would have regarded it as legitimate and credible, since the expansion of NATO influence is one of Putin’s more justifiable fears – or at least, less crazy than some of his other claims. I know I’ve said before that in some cases the West was guilty of “too little too late” but we have to balance that with avoiding the appearance of outright provocation.

With the Russians targeting hospitals etc. I cant help think that Putin is doing his best to either goad NATO into responding for some reason best known to himself , or he knows they really can’t, but the atrocities he is committing will generate such internal pressure from Europe/US population to do something, but the government’s know they can’t , that in itself will cause further divisiveness within western nations , which he is a fan of.

Since the state controls the media there, why can’t Putin simply declare his mission was accomplished and leave? How many Russians would know otherwise?

Oh, my gosh! That was a favorite song of mine back in the day. My brother still knows all the lyrics. Now when I hear it, I’ll be imagining Russian soldiers invading the woods, and the teddy bears lobbing tiny Molotov cocktails at them. Thanks so much for posting this.

I would be very interested to hear from you what sort of military doctrine it is, that laughs at completely preventable losses. If you are asserting Putin CAN use his air assets, then you are equally asserting that he is willing to see his forces torn apart unnecessarily. The losses on the Russian side could have been easily avoided if you are correct.

If you are correct, then Putin’s attitude is equivalent to a general saying, “We could give our men body armor, but I can’t be bothered to supply it. Let the men get slaughtered instead.”

Well now they look like ewoks in my head.

And then when it warms and the ground thaws, they will be stuck there for weeks

My closet monster used to sing that song. I was pretty sure I’d hear it again in my dreams until Nellie chimed in.

Hubs has picked out a dozen guns he wants to sent to Ukraine. Does anyone have information as to how to ship them off. Needs to know now.

The advice that I’ve read is that it’s a bad idea to try to send physical items to Ukraine because of the challenging logistics of getting them there. They may, in fact, never arrive, and the challenge is probably even worse with guns because of various cross-border restrictions. Regarding the logistics, see this article:

The sentiment is greatly appreciated, but much better to donate money. You can do a search, and there is some discussion of it here:

Good article and video from a BBC reporter on the ground in Kharkiv.

How are the Russians fighting, I ask. “They fight like stupid animals,” says Reaper. “They fight like it’s 1941 - they have no manoeuvrability, they just come to the front and that’s all. They have a lot of people, a lot of tanks, a lot of vehicles, but we are fighting for our land, and we are protecting our families. it doesn’t matter how they fight because we fight like lions and they won’t win.”

The comment that ‘they fight like it’s 1941’ shows that the bad tactics of the tank column (on the other side side of the country, outside Kyiv) isn’t an isolated incident. The Russian army simply isn’t well trained.