The open face Reuben I had at the Carnagie Deli was just right, about a 9/1 split:
Yes, there is a slice of bread under each half.
I accidentally got some oat bread the other day without meaning to, but it turned out to be flavorful and had the right texture to make for a good sandwich.
Yeah, that’s exactly the kind of thing I’m not fond of when I say NY Kosher style delis. But, I admit, it does depend on the sandwich. That’s how pastrami and corned beef sandwiches come. My favorite sandwiches are Italian style hoagies and subs. They have to be on good bread—it’s not an afterthought or a way to transport the innards to your mouth. It should be good enough to eat on its own. Thin crusty exterior, soft interior. I will still generally pull out some of the roll to slightly decrease the ratio, but even unaltered, it’s fine.
I miss several things about being a student in Montreal, but one of the bigger ones was going out for lunch on the weekend, after a big night, to one of the great delis like Ben’s or Schwartz’s or Dunn’s and getting a great sandwich, huge in the middle, less so on the sides. Great fries, pickle on the side. Bread barely there.
Sadly, some of the best places seem to have closed. Smoked meat is amazing. Did not really seem to catch on elsewhere, though, except maybe a bit in New York. Some ersatz versions just not quite right commercially available. Pastrami and corned beef are pale imitations of good smoked meat to me.
French Dip is not a French Dip without a good French Roll … just something about that type of bread, the au jus being the right level of flavor and the beef can be just average and it’s still one of my favorites. I don’t understand why anyone puts it on Ciabatta bread or adds a ton of extras like mushrooms, cheese, onions . Just proper ratio of meat and bread & au jus please.
It’s difficult to generalize as it really depends on the sandwich. Too much is too much, too little it too little. Certainly, a sandwich shouldn’t be difficult to eat. As said above, a grilled cheese is often a pretty short thing.
I’ve never been a big hamburger guy. I like them fine but usually other things are more tempting like a Reuben at a restaurant or a bratwurst at the cookout. However, I’ve lately made a few batches of ‘Big on flavor, not in volume’ burgers based on a video I caught by Kenji (love that guy). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUG9ZXhJEbg It’s not really a recipe but more of a technique. It calls for smaller patties, 3 ounces or about 80 grams each. Work the meat more than usual for a burger (it’s gonna be thin) and then flatten out in parchment so that they’re bigger than the bun. These wind up being the perfect size for the very cheapest, store-brand buns. Generously salt and pepper and cook over lump charcoal. I’ve been keeping the toppings to a slice of onion, a slice of tomato and some spreadable condiments, it’s a very manageable sandwich.
French dip is somewhat adjacent to our Chicago hometown favorite: Italian beef. I also have some ‘rules’ for what shouldn’t be on a beef. No cheese, no garlic bread, no barbeque sauce (gak!), pick either sweet or hot peppers (not both), and I don’t personally condone the combo which is beef and an Italian sausage though a lot of people go for it.
For a more low-tech version, the recent QI episode “Smörgåsbord” discusses the practice of sitting on a sandwich to achieve better bread compression.
So, next question.
Is a patty melt better than a cheeseburger?
I like the ratio more, and it is often more expensive and made with more care. But zi rarely make them myself.
AFAIK, the only thing that will improve any Subway product is to drop it in the nearest trash can and go to literally any other sandwich shop whatsoever.
Or, one could sit on the panini press. It won’t do much for the sandwich, but it’ll sure toast your buns.
You aren’t wrong.
I actually liked subway back in the early- to mid-90s, but they really went downhill since then, and they weren’t terribly high on that hill to begin with…
Threads like this make me sad to live in the ass-end of America; I have no nice sandwich shops. Hell, I don’t even have any nice bread-and-fillings options to make my OWN nice sandwiches. I love reubens; the closest approximation is at Arby’s. I can’t get a decent rye bread around here, and I haven’t even seen any rye flour to attempt making my own. A “bakery” here means “donut and cupcake shop”. The grocery store bakeries offers rolls/buns/loaves, as long as all you want is (dry) whole wheat or white. The meat selections at the counter could never make a sandwich as appetizing in appearance as the open-faced reuben @Czarcasm shows above…
Just a point - the flavor most Americans associate with rye bread is the caraway, not the rye flour itself. So if you ever want to experiment with homemade bread, make sure you secure some seeds, otherwise you’ll go ‘what did I do wrong?’
Oddly enough, my impression is exactly the opposite. I loathed Subway (and that means starting in the late 80s) until the last year or so. Now I can at least tolerate them. They don’t seem to smell like crap anymore, and their bread either has changed for the better or I have somehow become inured to it. If I’m going to a chain, I’ll go to Jersey Mike’s, given the option, but Subway will do in a pinch. Spicy Italian on herb-cheese bread with provolone, lettuce, tomato, onion, pickles or giardiniera, oil & vinegar, salt & pepper, shake of oregano, please.
I’m with you except for the sweet & hot rule. There’s also places that will do red sauce on it – I think that’s slightly more common these days than barbecue sauce. Gimme mine dipped, sweet & hot, please! I don’t care for combos, either. But an Italian sausage dipped or splashed with Italian beef jus is nice.
You used to be able to find Montreal smoked meat here in Chicago at the French Market at a place called Fumare Meats, but it seems to have closed. Aw! They did a really good version of it – I’ve been to Schwartz’s in Montreal. A good pastrami (like Katz’s) is roughly on the same level for me, though. They’re essentially the same thing, or at least on the same continuum, but smoked meat seems a bit more concentrated in flavor. (Corned beef doesn’t even involve smoking, so that’s different.)
ETA: It’s weird, because looking up trying to see what the differnce is gives different accounts: some web sites say Montreal smoked meat is dry-brined, while pastrami is wet-brined; others say exactly the opposite. (I’ve always thought the first was correct, but when you go back to the roots of pastrami, it was dry cured.) Some say the cut differs, but the cuts differ between pastramis here, too. It could be navel, but it could be other cuts of beef. So I consider them all the same basic foodstuff with slightly different recipes, and I wouldn’t be surprised if on the continuum some version of pastrami and Montreal smoked meats start blending into each other and one wouldn’t be able to classify which was which.
This is true of lesser smoked meat, such as the type available at many Canadian grocers. Mediocre smoked meat has the texture and taste of pastrami, which is not terrible, but is not fabulous. Canuck Costco sells a frozen version which is somewhat better. Very, very rarely they have actual brisket from Schwartz’s - which is transcendent. They do have Moishie’s pickles and slaw, also a Montrealais institution.
I will say, I’d give the edge to Schwartz’s smoked meat over Katz’s pastrami… but I think New York bagels win out over St. Viateur’s and that other place near it. Or maybe I need a bit more time in Montreal to get accustomed to the style.
Reasonable people can disagree. Montreal bagels are thinner, which I prefer, with denser topping and a touch of honey. I prefer them to New York, but they are less substantial.
I once lived a block away from the original St. Viateur on the Plateau. You could buy a paper bag of bagels still warm from the fire around the clock. They were amazingly good. My roommate said it spoiled him for any bread that came wrapped in plastic, and he was right. Now there are almost twenty locations - which is fine - plus they ship them frozen to my city many miles away, and are not cheap but are still better than what one can buy fresh here.
Ah … sorry. It was Fairmount I’ve been to — the other place around the corner I was trying to remember. Not that it makes much difference.
I go through Subway phases, only ever tuna, meatball or Cold Cut Combo (hey, I like bologna). If they take away the giardiniera, I’m done. I was also under the impression they no longer did oregano though that might be a franchisee-level decision.
The rules are my own limitations, get what ever you like! (My pizza ‘rules’ are even more strict.) A place near my high school job served an Italian sausage in the expected French bread but with a red marinara sauce. When combined with the giardiniera, it was an amazing sandwich, washed down with literally liters of RC Cola. My tastes have changed quite a lot but I still think of a tasty sausage with red sauce and peppers from time to time. Hold the sugary soft drink, please.
No idea. It may just be “Subway herbs,” but the one time recently I’ve asked what all the shakers were, they called it “oregano.” They shake something on my sandwich when I ask for it, no matter where I go.