Indeed. During the course of my counseling here, I was referred to an anxiety management group, which was very helpful. The first day, it was all I could do to make it out of the house and walk to the group, and I felt like I was going to throw up the entire time. I was trembling like a baby, and I could hardly lift my eyes from the floor, much less speak up. By the third meeting, I was able to contribute to the discussion and felt like I was among friends. The fear of going out among strangers hasn’t come back quite as bad as it was before that group, so I feel it did me some good in the long run.
I was also referred to another organization that works to help people with mental health issues integrate into the community, but they told me I was “too intelligent and educated” to benefit from their services. o_0 Thanks for nothing.
Did you do any specific kind of CBT, techniques that were taught to you by a therapist or did you learn this from your own research? I’ve read and tried to apply the techniques from a book by Dr. Jeremy Schwartz called Brain Lock which is specifically for OCD but the symptoms of which can and do cause depression.
It’s very encouraging that you say that you’re not on medication right now and have not become symptomatic.
Diagnosed generic depression, currently unmedicated, no desire to ever be medicated again.
Up until about nine months ago my depression was terrible due to a bad living situation, lousy “friends,” and a no-count alcoholic boyfriend who has since been kicked to and stomped on the curb. Since then I got my own apartment, the first I’ve ever had without roommates, and I’ve been getting steadily better. I’m a huge introvert to begin with and since I work a job that forces me to be social I need a lot of recharge time. With roommates, I wasn’t getting that and it made me more tense and irritable.
The downside is I don’t have any socialization outside of work and internet. I feel like I should be more bothered by this than I am. I just don’t want to leave my little cocoon. I’m not having full-on panic attacks at the thought of going out and doing things like I was ten years ago, but I just don’t want to go places. Think “I Am a Rock” here. (I am an iiiiiiiiiiiiiisland. Sorry. That’s one of those songs you have to sing along to. Or I have to, anyway.)
I’m trying to keep my mood up with little things. I don’t have a microwave so my diet has improved a bit. I’m starting to do yoga to help my lower back, and that’s also helping my outlook. I have some plants to liven up the place. That’s helped a lot more than I expect. Not only do I have something living around the house besides me and the cave crickets, it’s what I’m used to. My dad has always had houseplants all over the house so a house without a plant is empty to me.
Still I had a very bad week a couple of weeks ago. And most of January sucked due to my dad having a major health emergency. And I’m still talking bad about me to me, so I need to quit that.
Well, for me the reason I keep falling off the meditation wagon (I am such a *terrible *Buddhist) is when I’m having a bad depression day silence means I keep hearing myself beat me down. I’m trying to change that, but I really need to go into some CBT. That’s on the list, right after “fix whatever’s wrong with my car,” “new glasses,” and “go to the damn doctor already.”
This is very encouraging to me. I too want to try meditation. I always hear great things about Transcendental Meditation. The price is very steep though and I wonder if, although the technique itself might be beneficial, the whole thousands of dollars to learn it thing might not be a little fraudulent. But TM people say it’s not like other meditation techniques and so forth. But Buddhism meditation works for you. Why shouldn’t it work for the rest of us? And the only cost is going to a monastery, buying a book, or talking to a friend who knows it.
Whatever the case may be, the OP did a very good thing to start this discussion so that we can share our experiences, techniques, medications that work, meds that don’t, etc.
Yesterday, my doctor doubled my dose of Adderall(we think adding an “upper” is worth a try for the lack of focus and energy. I suggested it, actually.)
So right now I’m feeling a little zippier. Too bad we’re in the middle of another freaking snowstorm so I’m stuck inside! Not feeling quite zippy enough for housecleaning…
I’m still playing phone tag with the counseling office, dammit. I’m really ready to give this a serious effort this time, too. I’ve had therapy in the past but mostly clammed up as soon as they’d ask me anything. Not productive. I need to be able to trust them and let them try to help me, without being afraid of crying, or them judging me. I think I can do that, now. But they need to actually CALL me!
I must apologize if I ever appear to be trying to make everything about me, or not being supportive enough of others. I’m kind of stuck in my own head right now, unfortunately.
they tried me on ssris in the nineties. I would take them for about 4 days, become a nearly catatonic zombie, and attempt suicide.
the only times I ever attempted suicide was on ssris, and I don’t remember any of them. They aren’t the only meds I have abnormal reactions, every anti psych they put me on made me uncontrollably violent. For some reason psych meds do the exact opposite of what they should. I need to find drugs** intended** to make you sad and bitchy evidently. Some allergy meds make me hallucinate and have schizo behaviour, and I have** always**(but for one time) woke up during surgery, I wake up repeatedly and can actually struggle, I bloodied the dr’s nose whrn I had my tonsilectomy. The only time I stayed under they had me on nearly lethal levels of anesthesia, and I still woke up within 10 minutes of them shutting off the drip.
I’ve recently found out tramadol ( the pain med I’ve been on a while for chronic pain) affects seritonin. oh joy, this explains the extreme downswing I’ve been in for the last few years. I haven’t done crochet, photography, and have people who read my blog who actually call and nag me to post something because they are worried. I used to blog near daily, and was active enough to actually have things to blog about. Now I don’t really do anything, I go to the dr and the store and don’t go outside otherwise. I lose a lot of time staring at this fugly wallpaper. I even got posters to cover the fugly wallpaper but can’t be arsed to put them up. Total apathy.
I injured myself in a fall a while back and a little over a week ago my dr gave me a months worth of talwin. I know now the tramadol is fucking me up because the change in my mood and mindset has been considerable just in one week. I’m not suddenly all joy and light, but I have actually gotten out of bed and done a few things that desperately needed taken care of and made a long list of other tasks.
however, I am almost positive if I report this to my doctor they will terminate all my pain management and label me a drug seeker because the state of Indiana has been included in the DEA witch hunt, and that is just fucked up. The talwin is not a class/schedule/level what-the-hell ever level as tramadol, it’s slightly higher but its not at the level of say, vicoden, its…less offensive ?(I really don’t understand the grading system for these meds) It actually works better than vicoden did, and it doesn’t make feel like I’m moving in slow motion.but I’m still terrified.
If a neurologist was willing to crack open my head and look inside to see if they could fix the part of my brain that processes meds, I’d let them in a heartbeat. I am so weary of the biochemical fuckery that is my body, nothing works right, thyroid, hormones, adrenal glands and on and on and on.
sorry, that’s a lot of whinging, but with my mom passing last year and my therapist out for a month I’m left with discussing this with my cat, who really is just hoping all the noise I’m making will lead to belly rubs.
CBT changed my life. Unfortunately, I can’t keep up with the tremendous work involved in applying it without the help of medication. Because it’s work. It’s not like you dump your brains out at the therapist’s office and leave there all happy and cured. It’s a huge job. I managed to do it without the meds, for a while, but things got difficult and I let the “I’m not good enough and I never will be” thoughts creep back in. And those are such heavy, heavy thoughts.
My doctor’s appointment is in 3 weeks. I’ll be asking for a psych referral and I will also ask if she’s willing to start me back on Wellbutrin while I wait to see the specialist. But she may just tell me to smile more. If she can’t help me, I’ll be looking for a new doctor.
I think that’s symptomatic. I know it is for me, anyway. One of the good things about having a thread like this is that it gives us the opportunity to reach out of our own heads a bit, towards others we know are going through similar things.
Yeah, that hasn’t actually happened to me, but I wish it had on one occasion. I went to this community group and walked away realizing that my situation wasn’t nearly as bad as I sometimes imagined it to be.
Screw that. It’s scary out there.
edit: not that’s it’s all lollipops and unicorns in here either mind you.
The kind of meditation I practice is pretty simple. It’s a form of Zen meditation called ‘‘just sitting.’’ To do it, you just sit. No big spiritual goals, no particular target mental state or intention to cease all thinking, just sitting. I find that starting by focusing my attention on the breath is easiest, because the breath is something you will always have no matter where you are. In the car, on a plane, at work, falling asleep - always your breath is with you. Usually I light an incense cone and meditate with my eyes open. When the incense runs out (about 15 minutes) I stop. During the meditation all I am doing is staying as much in the present moment as I can.
The thing about this kind of meditation is, if you’re distracted by negative thoughts, and you sit down, you’re still probably going to be distracted by negative thoughts. But all you have to do is be aware of those thoughts and gently redirect your attention to the present. You gain kind a sense of those thoughts and emotions within the larger context of life, the universe and everything. Sometimes meditation is incredibly boring and I sit there waiting for it to be over, and sometimes I sit and all my emotions just come pouring down like an avalanche. I’ve rolled my eyes, I’ve laughed, I’ve wept. I never really know what’s going to happen when I sit, but it’s okay because there’s nothing in particular that is supposed to happen.
I use this same technique for ‘‘mini-meditations’’ throughout the day where I just try to be mindful and focus my awareness on the present as much as possible. I find it makes a significant difference in my stress levels. It took a long time, but I’ve actually gotten to the point where I can often put myself in a calm, meditative state just by deep diaphragmatic breathing.
I truly believe that one of the reasons some people struggle with meditation is because they think they are supposed to be feeling something profound. But really it’s more like, ‘‘Damn, my arm itches… ok focus on the feeling of the itch… ok I’m thinking I can’t wait any more I have to scratch… ok I scratched…’’ It can be incredibly mundane. The profundity comes in when you make it a regular part of practice, because you start to become more aware of the temporary state of everything. Then you see your emotions as just these waves that come and go, and always you are connected to the sea. When you really start seeing into reality that way, it’s a total head trip.
Seconded. It didn’t cure my depression, but CBT got me from barely able to hold down a part-time job and dropping out of undergrad to completing graduate school and starting a career. The difference it has made in my ability to function is enormous.
And for those at their wit’s end with meds, it took me 12 years to find something that worked, but holy shit does it work. I know meds are not for everyone and believe it is a purely personal decision, but for those out there looking for hope… there it is.
Speaking of medication, let’s talk about self-medication. My drug of choice is sugar. I’ve only recently begun to face that reality as I started working with a fitness/nutrition coach (who I frequently want to punch in the face, especially when he’s right.) I knew I had a problem with emotional eating but I never realized how dependent I became upon it to manage my depression. Depressed? Cookies. Low energy? Ice cream. Anxiety? Pizza. And on and on. Letting go of this dependency has been so terrifying precisely because I didn’t know what the alternative is. Well, so far the alternative is harder. It involves actually feeling all those unpleasant feelings, or god forbid actually doing something about whatever is stressing me out. Once I accepted that it wasn’t always going to be pleasant, I kind of stopped freaking out and am starting to enjoy the challenge.
Counting your breaths from 1 to 10 and then back again can be a good adjunct to that and help keep you somewhat “grounded” (grounded means pretty much whatever you want it mean btw).
Been there and I sympathize, it sucks. I had a lung infection they had put me on prednizone for, not knowing (since I’d not taken it before) it seriously screws up my brain. I had a psychotic episode (which is NOT one of my alphabet soup set of diagnoses…I am PTSD, SAD, and have some learning disabilities, but despite having a horrifc temper, I have excellent control of it) I went in the bathroom and tried to kill myself, and tried to kill the guy who tried to break in and stop me. I was trapped in my own head and only semi aware that something was very wrong and unable to do anything about. After being locked down for three days and drugged to the gills it passed and needless to say I won’t touch prednisone with a 200 foot pole…however after an incident like that, you can forget trying to be gainfully employed. I wound up on disability for both psych and physical issues, and have been officially and eternally stamped as unemployable. :mad:
It pisses me off, because if society were a little more accepting, I feel like I could be a semi constructive member of it. Not all the time and not anything amazing like brain surgery, but there are some skills (such as training animals, or working with autistic kids) that I do well and could concievably do part time and not ‘scheduled’ but rather when I am in a capable phase. Not a chance in hell of it ever happening for pay, nor even volunteer.
I honestly feel a large part of the time that god WANTS me to kill myself. (yes yes suicide is supposed to be a sin why would you think that blah blah blah) but the truth is for a very long time I prayed and was an incredibly devout person, but life has constantly been a shitstorm of negative chaos and catastrophe (not just my emotional state, but actual reality…being assaulted, raped, numerous family members dying within a short span, desperately needed assistance being denied or taken away for arbitrary reasons, severe health issues on and on:smack:) that it just seems very much like god is never going to stop shitting on me until I take myself out of the equation. (I’m going to leave it at that, please lets not get into “satan is making you think that” or whatever, I have thought processes there too and this message is already going to be a whopper)
I’m not atheist, but I’m not any one specific religion either. <b>FOR ME</b> organized religion is evil and has been an origin of a lot of abuse for me…personal spirituality however is a different story. IMHO, YMMV, etc etc additional disclaimers…
do your depression cycles seem to be in fall and winter and you seem to pull out of them in spring? You might read up on seasonal affective disorder, a.k.a. SAD
Fibro, polyarthritis, and genetic spinal degeneration (at 45 I have the spine of a 70 year old, at least in the physical sense. In the mental sense, I’m one mean ass bitch to make up for it!:D)
When I get the “think happy positive thoughts” my answer is usually “oh, like using you for target practice?” because damn it, it has certainly been covered in the media enough that telling depressed people to “just be happy” is NOT HELPFUL.:smack: Especially if the person is familiar with my life and all the shit I’ve been through, I think I’m doing damn well that I haven’t offed myself or someone else in all these years. I deserve a medal or something!!!
My parents were from the Depression Era, and I could never figure out how they thought depression wasn’t real. WTF? My father had it, without doubt, but stoicly bulled through life and rather than admit anything was wrong, often took it out on those around him. Now understand, I love my dad with all my heart, don’t blame him for his ignorance nor his adherence of it (he was a product of his upbringing and times) and I miss him so much (he passed in 06) that it tears my heart out…After one particularly spectacular meltdown of mine, my parents somehow…came around to “there really is something wrong, she can’t just ‘make it stop.’” It’s a long story I won’t share right now because this post is already long, but my dad actually admitted, in his own backassward way at one point, that he understood. Its one of my most precious memories.
Actually, the hair falling out, nails (are they sort of corrugated, like cardboard? or heavily ridged in places?) dry eyes and mouth, rash and dry skin are all symptoms of thyroid problems (I have that too, joy, genetic issue in the family) Go to a endocrinologist and have them run a full panel instead of the partial panel that is included in the standard general practictioners testing. Certain types of thyroid problems only show up that way (disclaimer, not a doctor, just sharing personal experience, entirely up to your discretion, only a suggestion, etc.) it will take several months of gradually upped doses of replacement hormone (levothyroxine) to stabilize you to better levels. You’ll still have some of these problems, but they will lesson if thyroid is indeed what you are having problems with. If you’ve already explored this option (the only reason I did was because of family history and seen it in action) my apologies for rambling about it. Just trying to help.
I as well as my doctor have wondered if I have a intermittent lupus problem, or a rare version that is difficult to diagnose with the standard testing. I have such a wide spectrum of auto immune (polyarthritis, allergies, and non specific other issues) that it is driving up both nuts, but since steroids are generally the treatment for lupus and I can’t take them, really doesn’t matter. I’m on hydroxychloroquinine (yay I’ll never get malaria!:rolleyes:) which is a very old treatment for arthritis and lupus (used in pre steroid days) and it makes a small difference, though whether is just slowing the arthritis or if it’s also supressing stronger lupus? symptoms, we don’t know.
heh. GO YOU! that’s a great answer
I was hospitalized three times during high school from being beat down by groups of people. Happy thoughts just didn’t work for me, and while probably not healthy, the mindset of being fairly misanthropic and telling the world to kiss my ass, it’s not going to push me into killing myself because my staying alive is just that much of a fuck you to all the abusers. Probably not healthy, but its kept me alive.
<b>THIS.>/b> Unlike physical medication where they can go and look at things and expirament on cadavers and have an actual working basis of healthcare, psychiatry is a crapshoot. They breed mice, rabbits monkeys whatever to have certain behaviours, but these behaviours are known only through observation, they can’t ASK said critter “are you apathetic, sad, angry, whatever” they can only guess that’s the case because of how the animal acts. They then shove drugs in said animal and if it stops acting that way they think they have a solution and move on to human trials, and if you’ve read anything about them, they are iffy at best. They are left to the drug companies to run and report, and since the test for it is to ask the patient “are things different?” it steps into the realm of statistics, which can be manipulated, and it’s in the interest of the pharmaceutical companies to manip those stats to their benefit.
That is not saying that some of the drugs do work for some people, they do, I won’t argue that...but doctors all to freely (for the reasons you cite) throw meds at people and there is not an adequate observation period or monitoring to determine if this is TRUELY helpful, and these drugs can wreck as easily as they can rescue. I actually have a friend who is in a SUPPORT GROUP for people withdrawing from Celexa. She said one person in her group said going off Celexa was worse than stopping cocaine. This to me, is fucking scary because it seems like someone is constantly trying to hand me that drug (as it’s one of the newest and coolest and most heavily pushed by pharm reps) and that WITH my record of bad reactions to ssri’s. WTF?
Another problem is if it doesn’t work, they up the dose, and up it some more until it’s at max. :dubious:That makes no sense to me, and I’ve watched someone progressively get WORSE with a different issue than what he was being treated for to the point it became permanent damage, as a doctor continued upping a med that was not resolving what he had been given it for.
Weight. Being fat is practically as wrong a being a Nazi, yet what is the most common side effect of all psych meds? Weight gain. What are the most common drugs prescribed in this country? Psych meds. Why do we not see this correlation discussed in the media??? No it’s bad diet or bad exercise and complete and utter fail on the fat person’s fault, it could be ANYTHING else, like meds or if you have chronic pain issues and a health isssue that makes exercising actually bad for you. I had someone blow me shit for using handicap parking (I have a plate and often walk with either crutches, cane or walker, depending on day and conditions) the twat smarts off “fat is not a handicap.”
Big mistake. I trained for a while to sing opera, I can **project
** I blasted the bitch telling her do you think people with MD or MS or parkinson’s or…damn I can’t remember the name of the other one, it used to be called St Vitus dance…anyway, you think people are just overnight completely disabled? NO, it’s a horrible slow slide into increasing inability to do the things you love, and even the things you need to be able to do for yourself, all the time aware that it can’t be stopped or fixed and where the end result will be, and I’d gleefully serve jail time or be beaten daily then have the health issues I have and instead of blowing me shit out of her ignorance, she should damn well get on her healthy skinny knees and offer up thanks to god she was healthy, and she had better get her ass in her car and get away from before I shoved my cane up her ass.
She ran.
Everyone in the parking lot paused, and then applauded. I gimped my way into the store with my head up. Yes, I was a bitch, but I don’t start these things, I respond to someone else’s nasty behaviour, and in a lot of cases, I open a few peoples eyes. I had people come up to me in the store afterward and say " I never thought if it that way." It’s a shame the speech is to big to put on a bumper sticker, though god knows if I had the money I’d post it in a full page ad in the newspaper.
I can remember trying to figure out something as simple as spider solitaire. I even had someone try to explain it to me, I could NOT grasp it, when in the past I had picked up a book on how to use word perfect and within a couple of hours had learned how to do things that people at my job who’d been using it for years didn’t know how to do. A couple years down the road on a good day, I accidently opened a game and decided to poke at it and was horrified to find it was actually very damn simple. I used to have photographic memory, now, I stop in mid sentence because i’ve forgotten what I wanted to say. I keep wishing I could get them to scan my brain and see if most of it has died off
Well, FWIW, my experience is office’s with crappy staff usually have good doctors, or vice versa, so if they are sucking at getting back to you maybe they will have a really good doctor when you do get in.
What has worked for me is to let the pissed of wanna hit something propel me into just going into their office and saying “You won’t call me back, so I’m here in person. You have to talk to me, or I will run laps/make baboon noises/ finger paint on the walls/etc until you do.”
THEM:eek: (this person really DOES need our help!)
They wind up talking to me, every time…usually with lame apologies for not calling me back. Generally after that, I get called back promptly.
This is a truely marvelous explanation of the process. I watch the incense smoke and try to see images in it (like you do with clouds) and often I wind up with a mental mantra of “bored, bored, bored, bored, bored, bored, bored, bored, bored” (there’s a tune to that, that music they play at ball games…) BUT…it’s a brief break from the non stop multiple AAAAAAUGHHHHS that my mind normally runs through.
I do plan on going in there tomorrow, and occupying their teeny tiny, anxiety-inducing waiting room(thank goodness they are in the process of moving) until I get an appointment. I have to go out anyway- my regular doctor forgot to have me sign a release so they can discuss my condition with the short-term disability people. I thought I was supposed to be relaxing and taking it easy!
I just don’t “get” meditation. While I appreciate Olive’s description, iI am a complete and total failure at it. I can’t seem to quiet my mind. I think of all of the stuff I should be doing while I’m “meditating.” It just won’t stop.
In other news, my boss called me today and left a message asking that I return his call. Instant Anxiety ™. Ugh. I’m anxious just typing that. I’m supposed to be off work on a medical leave of absence for a month so why in the hell is he calling me? I seriously considered calling my psychiatrist (who wrote the original off-work order) and ask him to give me a note for my boss to not contact me. Probably not the best idea if I want to go back to work but still…that’s just wrong.
Meditation doesn’t have to mean concentration really, at least not anything difficult anyway. A very simple form is counting one’s breaths. It sounds stupidly simple, but I dare anyone to try it for 5 minutes. You simply sit, or lie if you prefer, someplace quiet (if possible) and start counting your breaths from one to ten. Then start back at one and do it again. I’m willing to bet your first time you don’t make it past seven before you lose count.
edit: btw, the rest of the time your mind is free to do what it wants. You can have a thousand and one thoughts in between counts - no restrictions. Just remember what the next number is supposed to be. Simple.
