Should Hillary dump Bill? Re: the Ed Klien story.

Great Debates
1

Would Hillary be better off, politically, if she were to divorce Bill?

I don’t see how Bill, being the womanizing, egomaniacal philanderer that he is, could take a back seat to his wife if she were to become the top candidtate for the POTUS, or even the POTUS herself. She is currently holding all the political power in the family and her run for the WH would prop her up in the national light in such a way as to cast a shadow on old Bill.
We have access to parts of Ed Kleins book in which he details the events that led up to the birth of the Clinton’s single offspring in an unflattering way. Never mind that Ed Klein is an unconscionable prick of the Nth magnitude for ‘sharing’ this with the public. (Not only is it an allegation that would be virtually impossible to disprove, but even if it were true, why?)

Here is an excerpt from an article I found.

*“I’m going back to my cottage to rape my wife,” Klein quotes Bill Clinton as saying during a Bermuda getaway in 1979.
In the morning, the Clintons’ room “looked like World War III. There are pillows and busted-up furniture all over the place,” an unnamed source tells Klein.

Klein source claims Bill later learned Hillary was pregnant reading about it in the ARKANSAS GAZETTE.

“The fact that his wife didn’t tell him that she was pregnant before she told a reporter doesn’t seem to phase him one bit, because he says, 'Do you know what night that happened?”

“‘No,’ I say. 'When?”

“‘It was Bermuda,’ he says, ‘And you were there!’”

Hillary is reported to be in the process of suing Klein. Good on her.

According to other sources, (I believe these are also mentioned in the book) Bill has continued on with his cheating ways and is currently having a go of it with a divorced gal living in the same neighborhood as the Clintons.

If Bill won’t keep his dick in his pants, is it time for Hillary to move on without him?
Can she?
Would America vote for a woman that continues to drag along in a relationship with an unfaithful husband? (In a relationship where the man (Bill) still seems to have all the power, given that typically the spouse of the POTUS is the subordinate, or at least the impression is given.)

I think she needs to dump him sooner than later if she wants to make a serious run at this. Create her own identity, drop the anchor, and surge ahead without him.

What are your thoughts?

2

Personally I think that she should dump him flat, no questions asked. If a person cheats repeadedly, they obviously dont want to be in the relationship and it is better on all sides to cut the cord.
But politically it is a whole other story. If she wants to be a successful politician she would need to analize what her voters would see as noble.
To stand by ther person she married through thick and thin.
Or stand up for herself and her right for happiness that can not be found in a relationship that is a one sided as hers.
In differing opions both sides can be argued as strong character. She just needs to see what the demographic she is targeting wants.

3

She’d get half, so why not?

4

No.

[ol]
[li]Bill Clinton is one of the most brilliant political minds of our time. HRC, or any Democrat, passes on his advice at their peril.[/li][li]Bill Clinton remains popular among many centrists and liberals (now that they’ve seen what Bush has done) . Anyone who is still put off by Clinton’s antics or policies is unlikely to vote Democrat anytime soon, and unlikelier still to vote for HRC even without Bill.[/li][li]By staying with Bill, Hillary has managed to humanize herself in some people’s eyes. “Standing by her man” and all that rot. Plays well in Peoria. A female divorcee has her own set of problems. Divorcing him now would be seen as a purely political move, and she’d suffer from that perception.[/li][li]First Gentleman Bill Clinton would be an astounding asset. Hillary’s already proven herself strong enough so that most wouldn’t suspect that this was Bill trying to sneak in a shadow third term, and Bill’s already done his duty, so no one would be smerking at the dude planning white house tea parties. The duties of an active first lady are already very much like the duties of an active former president: speeches, goodwill visits abroad, cheritable activities. Bill’s already shown himself to be good at that sort of thing.[/li][/ol]
That’s not to say that HRC is at all electable. I’m still not convinced that she is, or that I’d even vote for her, but divorcing Bill, from a political standpoint, would be a bad move.

5

This is a personal matter between Hillary and Bill, the rest of us don’t have a dog in this fight. It should make no difference whatever in her electoral future.

6

Why even mention Ed Klein? That story is clearly bullshit.

Politically, I think it would be a bad idea. People like Bill Clinton, and he is one of the best politicians out there. He is the most well regarded living ex-president, and could have probably won a 3rd term if allowed. Why wouldn’t she want him to contribute to her campaign?

Their marriage is their business. I think a smart woman like Hillary knows what kind of guy Bill is, and has accepted/tolerated that. He’s probably cheated on her dozens of times, why would she rock the boat now?

7

Should not, I agree.

But I think that it’s naieve to suggest that it would not have an effect of Hillary Clinton’s electability if she divorced Bill.

8

But it will.
Not to pick on you Bob, but why are people so naive to think that the personal lives of our politicians shouldn’t/don’t matter? I’m under the assumption that there are those that may be swing voters that actually have personal morals that they would like to see exemplified by the person they choose as the POTUS. Hint; Most of us are AGAINST adultery. By extension, most women (a likely Hillary base) don’t want a leader who allows her husband to traipse around on her. Some leader.

9

Brace youself.

Bullshit or not, it’s now out there. It needs to be adressed. I think it’s bullshit too, and I disapprove STRONGLY (even though Klein has been viewed as a liberal) that he chose to include it in the book, so now we have to deal with it.
It brings to the front the other allegations of adultery by Bill that WILL undoubtedly be part of the conservatives campaign. It just will.

10

Okay, let’s ignore the fact that Klein’s story is crap and your question is nosy. Let me ask this: what does you do mean by this comment? That if she ran for President and won, he’d be unhappy? That he’d try to covertly support another candidate instead of his wife? What the fuck does this actually mean?

RIGHT NOW she’s a Senator and he’s not. He’s dealing with that just fine as far as I know. Do you know something else?

More Klein, more crap. Show me some proof or please drop the gossip column.

Isn’t this Great Debates? Not to be an idiot about it, but this sounds more like catty gossip.

Upon what do you base that? When Bill was President, for years some people said Hillary was in charge. :stuck_out_tongue:

It’s true that politicians’ private lives are significant. I think your suggestion that she get a divorce just for political reasons is execrable, as is the idea that she’s going to lose votes because her husband cheated on her. She would not have a national platform without him and the personal crap that would ensue would derail any attempt at discussing the issues during her campaign. It would also be used to confirm a ton of people’s negative impressions of her.

That doesn’t answer his question, which was “why did YOU bring this up?” We already had a thread about Klein’s book a few weeks ago. “It’s out there” doesn’t explain why you have chosen to talk about this now when the book does not deserve that much discussion.

11

Unless there is evidence Bill is still sleeping with the babes, a divorce at this late date would seem odd.

12

I’m sure you’re right that some voters would not vote for HRC based on their perception of the personal morals of her family. But I think a lot of people might think as I do that if she forgives Bill then it’s enough for me. And some people sympathize with her as the injured party. I think we’ve come a long ways since FDR’s indiscretions were never revealed, and a long ways since Gary Hart’s candidacy died as a result of his philandering. I don’t think a Gary Hart style revelation would get in the way of someone running for office in 2008, and I also think that for most voters, the marital issues a candidate might have are pretty far down on the priority list. In 1976 it might have been a significant issue, but I don’t see it as a huge problem in 2008.

13

Simply, it would be more tension on the arleady seemingly tenuous relationship.
Bill would enforce his status in the relationship by doing what he wants to do, and that may include adultery. Some actually use adultery as a tool in which to control the other person.

Maybe, maybe not, I guess we don’t know that.

Gossip has wrecked more than one relationship. Do we even know for certain that Klein is lying?

If you want to play along, but refuse to believe that Bill is a cheater, then for the sake of discussion, pretend the stories of Bill’s philandering are true.

True.

Thanks for sharing your view, that’s all I’m looking for.
She wouldn’t be getting a divorce for political reasons only. Isn’t her personal hapiness, her pride, her family, worth anything? Or is it all political, - all the time?

14

David Brock at Media Matters addressed several concerns about the Klein book in his letter to Penguin publishing. Read it here.

I find the OP to be confusing regarding the stance toward the Klein book. Specifically, you seem to say, on the one hand, that the Klein book is crap (but largely because he wrote about private details, not because it is completely unsubstantiated bullshit), and on the other, BUT WHAT IF IT’S TRUE?

This, as others have noted, is very much like the Swift Boat bullshit. A person or a group starts spewing complete lies, and others pick them up to present as matters for debate.

I would suggest that this debate needs to go back to square one and demonstrate infidelity before even beginning to talk about whether this is our business or what Hillary Clinton ought to do about it. Just because “it’s out there” is not a basis for giving it any credence as a debate topic. There’s a lot of bullshit out there.

15

I think you’re confusing the matter by bringing that book up. We don’t need that book to know that Bill cheated on Hillary. But, as others have already addressed, she’d have much more to lose by divorcing Bill than staying married to him. Bill is immensely popular, not to mention how many people would interpret a divorce as being motivated primarily for political purposes. It would be close to political suicide for her to do so.

And divorcing him would make it an even bigger issue. Only the question would become: why now instead of 15 years ago?

This is a non-starter, Uncommon Sense.

16

You’re playing psychologist with someone you only know as a public figure, and I find that always results in a shallow analysis that is unconnected to reality.

And that’s why we need to gossip?

Do we have any reason to believe he could be telling the truth? Does he offer any proof? No, and as far as I know he’s relying only on anonymous sources. He’s making the claim, let him prove it. Until he does, I’m gonna say this is one of the stupidest stories I’ve ever heard and he’s a liar.

What? No. I’d rather drink paint thinner.
I didn’t say Bill never cheated on her. We all know he did. I said I don’t believe your Enquirer-style comments - from the same source as the rape charge, no less - that Bill is presently cheating on Hillary with some local widow. And I’ve heard no stories about his philandering either, so I’m not going to pretend their true just because you ask. He made a lot of money from his book and he’s making a lot of money as a public speaker, so if he’s philandering, he’s philandering his own money as he is entitled to do. I don’t know or care how this impacts Hillary’s presumed future campaign.

You EXPLICITLY said “I think she needs to dump him sooner than later if she wants to make a serious run [the Presidency]” and politics is clearly one of the subjects of this thread. The side topics that are not political are pure speculation on your part (that she is personally unhappy with him, has no pride because he’s cheating and philandering, blah blah blah blah blah) and that’s how I’m treating them.

17

I thought Hillary would be better off without Bill for sometime now. I happen to think that Hillary can command her own aura without leaning on the past through her husband. If the country is to take her seriously, they need to disconnect her from Bill, otherwise it will seem like a Bill 2 presidency. She won’t get elected.
I think there is a portion of the voting public that will refuse to vote for Bill (via Hillary) again. He may have been a great politician, but I don’t think the country wants to be dragged down the ‘Lewinsky’ road again, just as they would rather not be dragged down the ‘Iraq’ road again anytime soon.
Maybe I should have left out the Klein book in the OP, but I couldn’t have made up a better scenario if I tried. It seemed to be a good place holder with which to kick off the thread, I was probably wrong then.

18

Why focus on Hillary? She isn’t in the race. Joe Biden is. Why aren’t we talking about Biden?

19

Why do you think Hillary should divorce Biden. :confused:

20

looks at calendar

goes to hide in a cave for the next three years

The OP is merely an attempt to toss around unsubstantiated and vile allegations in the disguise of a political theory. I am going to hide in a cave for the next three years. I’m sick of this already.